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+--- Thread: End of the Liberty-Rheinland conflict (/showthread.php?tid=122070)
RE: End of the Liberty-Rheinland conflict - Timmy - 10-24-2014
(10-24-2014, 04:38 PM)Highland Laddie Wrote: Which, if everything followed this precedent, then LN would have invaded and taken over Rochester long ago due to the Outcasts docking there, Rheinland would have taken over Breisen (Omega-7) for letting Hessians dock there, etc.
It's certainly understandable that people don't WANT to lose their stuff, whether it's bases, status, etc. But, I'm saying that simply coming on here and whining about it is not any kind of real answer to the problem. Folks need to be more pro-active and FIND a working solution that both sides WILL agree to. And if they never agree...then fine. The storyline remains in the hands of the Devs. You wanna change that? Become a dev. Otherwise....deal with it.
And that's literately where you have been leading. Whole the way around to end up in this very place we started. And they say I am wasting the space.
Ah yes, the link that you actually did seen...
PS: Relying on the wish of players is a tricky thing. You will have to chose one half and show a middle finger to another. No faction leader wants to loose stuff but for some reason one looses it and other gains without any oportunity for the first one to change it. Why? And for some reason Liberty was constantly on the gaining side for last several updates. And it still is, and no step against it is accepted because of crap loads of unlogical reasons.
And yeah, Rochester. Whenever you see LR or OC or w/e official landing there, then you can actually start saying something like that. But before, it's senseless. In my example I actually mentioned that it was CR| taged stuff, not a random indie.
RE: End of the Liberty-Rheinland conflict - Timmy - 10-24-2014
(10-24-2014, 04:43 PM)Lythrilux Wrote: Honestly, I can't help but think that the only reason why we don't play a mod where in game actions actually effect the storyline is because where one thing is applicable somewhere, it needs to be applicable everywhere. Whereas we can probably get decent-ish fights in other areas of Sirius, Liberty is a newbie spawn pit and thus it's deemed 'unfair' to base Liberty's forces on them.
I for one say that we really need to just stop babying the players and actually turn this server into a proper RP server where in game actions do define the universe we play in. Actions without consequences is something that has certainly turned people off the mod.
We could easily just arrange events to dictate things if we absolutely have to. But I say that if Liberty can't defend itself due to it's own playerbase, then tough. Other games have features where in game actions affect the grand scale of things, and the players don't complain when things don't go their way.
An un-evolvng storyline based in an un-evolving universe gets pretty stale. Or rather, pre-determined events or progression is pretty lame.
To fix the lolwutery and noobism I have one simple suggestion. Remove all IDs except of Freelancer from a free sale. Let other IDs be given by and to official faction member only.
RE: End of the Liberty-Rheinland conflict - Timmy - 10-24-2014
(10-24-2014, 04:50 PM)Highland Laddie Wrote: Except that this is what Disco has been for most of its existence, yes? And it used to have full servers all the time back in the "good ol' days."
How many players we gonna lose once Liberty is partitioned off by Rheinland, Kusari, Xenos, Rogues, Junkers, Lane Hackers, or anyone else that wants a piece of her?
Why don't we just cut to the chase and make Rheinland own half of Sirius, Gallia owns the other half, and Zoners own Omicrons?
Because this also puts ALL storyline and development in the hands of the PvPers, who could pretty much just ally together in any faction they want and then own WHATEVER they want. Hmm...maybe they'll all just join LWB and Farmers will own all of Rheinland?
So you think that giving everything to Liberty will be a better idea? Because that's literately what you just said.
RE: End of the Liberty-Rheinland conflict - Highland Laddie - 10-24-2014
(10-24-2014, 04:50 PM)Timmy Wrote:(10-24-2014, 04:38 PM)Highland Laddie Wrote: Which, if everything followed this precedent, then LN would have invaded and taken over Rochester long ago due to the Outcasts docking there, Rheinland would have taken over Breisen (Omega-7) for letting Hessians dock there, etc.
It's certainly understandable that people don't WANT to lose their stuff, whether it's bases, status, etc. But, I'm saying that simply coming on here and whining about it is not any kind of real answer to the problem. Folks need to be more pro-active and FIND a working solution that both sides WILL agree to. And if they never agree...then fine. The storyline remains in the hands of the Devs. You wanna change that? Become a dev. Otherwise....deal with it.
And that's literately where you have been leading. Whole the way around to end up in this very place we started. And they say I am wasting the space.
Ah yes, the link that you actually did seen...
PS: Relying on the wish of players is a tricky thing. You will have to chose one half and show a middle finger to another. No faction leader wants to loose stuff but for some reason one looses it and other gains without any oportunity for the first one to change it. Why? And for some reason Liberty was constantly on the gaining side for last several updates. And it still is, and no step against it is accepted because of crap loads of unlogical reasons.
And yeah, Rochester. Whenever you see LR or OC or w/e official landing there, then you can actually start saying something like that. But before, it's senseless. In my example I actually mentioned that it was CR| taged stuff, not a random indie.
Your idea is similar to what I said, but as has been pointed out in the comments on that thread, it also opens up different problems of how such events are organized.
Example: What limits would BAF have on what kind of events they could do, based on lore? Supposedly, they would not have enough ships/material to launch an actual counter-offensive on their own to retake Leeds....so...what really could they do? This kind of event would only seem to benefit either the lore-wise stronger factions (like GRN and Liberty), or the factions with the better PvPers.
Haste actually had a good reply to that link idea you posted:
Quote:Gameplay trumps lore at many, many times. Yet in the end, the lore remains unaffected.
It's simple and I don't get the problem. Raids are fun. Raids result in lots of blues. People enjoy raids. However, they don't have any impact on the lore and I don't see how that harms anyone.
As for this:
Quote:So you think that giving everything to Liberty will be a better idea? Because that's literately what you just said.No, I actually didn't say that at all. And that's not even a true statement. What does Liberty even "own" that's actually outside of Liberty? It's not like Liberty owns Hamburg or anything. What you seem to be irrationally upset about is simply lore...which is all devs.
RE: End of the Liberty-Rheinland conflict - SkyNet - 10-24-2014
(10-24-2014, 03:33 PM)Pammy Wrote: By the way, in my opinion, it is the time for Gallia to take over Magellan, and the time for Liberty to lose something.
Indeed. I think a Gallia/Kusari/Rheinland alliance would be an interesting possibility. Gallia and Rheinland fighting against the same enemy. An alliance would be logical.
If Bretonia get known of a possible alliance with Rheinland and their worst enemies, they might want to hinder Rheinland to continue the negotiations and
could declare war with Rheinland. (Btw, negotiations between the GRN and BDM have been made already. They have not been finished yet.)
Since Kusari is allied with Rheinland, they are forced to jump in and assist Rheinland against Liberty and Bretonia. I think they would not realy want to join the alliance with Gallia becouse they had some problems with them in the past. But Bretonias war declaration with Rheinland might be a good reason for Kusari to interfere.
Conflicts between all those houses could also force the GMG and IMG to interfere.
Liberty can't withstand bombardment from three directions. Especially if they will loose important business partners and suppliers. Their economy will break down slowly.
But hey... they can still build their ships with Platinum, right?
RE: End of the Liberty-Rheinland conflict - Highland Laddie - 10-24-2014
Here's another GOOD response by Laura C on that link you posted:
Quote:So to the topic - problem is you need limits. Maybe there can be fights over a certain systems, but you can´t let for example Rheinland to conquer Bering, Hudson, Texas and then start invading New York because that would not make sense inRP, despite I believe it would be possible to achieve it ingame (because LN has three bases in Hudson, Bering and Texas, so three battles and RM is on the doorstep of Liberty capital system).
Or imagine GRN finally conquering New London and then Cambridge and Manchester...and then suddenly Bretonia is no more on the server. This would make more harm than good.
RE: End of the Liberty-Rheinland conflict - Timmy - 10-24-2014
Too much to quote I will just put it out straight. The same Laura C have offered limits with which I agreed, in case you didn't read to the end.
And BAF offensives iRP and by any sense are not to be solely BAF offensives, so events will include jointed forces of BAF and someone. Is that easy enough explanation?
And you did quoted the text with a words like "Should we all give everything to Rheinland then?" even though no one ever mentioned that, people just were saying that give factions a right to challenge each other over pieces and then see the result. So yeah, why would that be mentioned then? Oh and if you start quoting that as "Unfair, unballanced" read again my event proposition, cuz I am tired of saying all the same again and again. You just seem to see the text and nothing that have been said previously matters.
So there. And I don't see any problem with Bretonia loosing their name for a while? BAF can just turn into a group like HF, it's not like I offer to delete the groups.
Ah yes, Liberty don't own anything outside Liberty, but they do "own" any of it's oponents without any as it seems losses. Fight with Rheinland was literately no impact on LN numbers as far as I hear from those speeches like "Liberty have mightiest fleet with superpowered tech." That annoys me too. And admins or story developers don't enter discussions and don't even answer the questions such as "Is it true?" So I take it as they agree. From here you can see why I am so unhappy and why I consider story developing to be wholly supporting one single faction which actually doesn't know how to fight even. Including officials.
RE: End of the Liberty-Rheinland conflict - Highland Laddie - 10-24-2014
Quote:So there. And I don't see any problem with Bretonia loosing their name for a while? BAF can just turn into a group like HF, it's not like I offer to delete the groups.
Now...change the word Bretonia to Rheinland...and then you have a problem? Because that's what it sounded like you were griping about a few pages ago. You don't like it when Liberty doesn't get pwned and taken over by Rheinland, but you have no problems with the BAF ceasing to exist? To me, that just seems like hypocritical player bias.
Quote:So I take it as they agree. From here you can see why I am so unhappy and why I consider story developing to be wholly supporting one single faction which actually doesn't know how to fight even. Including officials.
Again...this simply sounds like you think PvPers should determine all the outcomes on an RP server. That's not what Disco is, or has ever been since its inception.
RE: End of the Liberty-Rheinland conflict - SnakThree - 10-24-2014
It's sad to see people dividing mod into houses as if they are the reason they play here and arguing over it.
It's one game, one mod, one server and one community that should bring us together and not push apart.
RE: End of the Liberty-Rheinland conflict - An'shur - 10-24-2014
(10-24-2014, 05:02 PM)SkyNet Wrote: Liberty can't withstand bombardment from three directions.
Liberty can withstand everything. Devs are making love to Liberty, don't you know?