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+--- Thread: Generic pirate vs faction pirate (/showthread.php?tid=11966)
Generic pirate vs faction pirate - Baltar - 09-10-2008
Hulk was not "necessarily" OORP ... however ... a pirate attacking a Junker is not smart. He would be OORP if he killed or even taxed the Junker and then chose to dock on Yanagi.
Hulk has no business in Blood Dragon turf ordering people around ... but ... if you go to New York you see indie lawfuls doing the exact same thing Hulk did. While Hulk has no authority in Chugoku ... the Blood Dragons did not take offense to him ... so the Blood Dragons must have approved. This happens in New York all the time ... LSF/SA/LPI etc allow indies to police their turf and sometimes even pat them on the back for it. And they do this to lawful traders too.
Don't feel bad ... while I despise pirates taxing allies it happens.
Generic pirate vs faction pirate - chovynz - 09-10-2008
Id like to add a chat i just had:
[12:34:39 p.m.] Nathan (Hyung Soong) says: hai
[12:34:57 p.m.] Aidan (Turkish) says: Hello.
[12:35:11 p.m.] Nathan (Hyung Soong) says: thoughts on that generic pirate thing?
[12:36:41 p.m.] Aidan (Turkish) says: I haven't read all of it.
[12:37:01 p.m.] Aidan (Turkish) says: I'm leaning towards independent pirating rights though, within reason.
[12:37:19 p.m.] Nathan (Hyung Soong) says: mm
[12:37:29 p.m.] Aidan (Turkish) says: I also dislike the NPG.
[12:39:33 p.m.] Aidan (Turkish) says: I don't think that factions aside from the BD should have rights over Chugoku.
[12:39:43 p.m.] Aidan (Turkish) says: But there should be understandings with their affiliated partners.
[12:39:49 p.m.] Aidan (Turkish) says: But also understanding for peoples RP.
[12:40:13 p.m.] Aidan (Turkish) says: What it boilds down to is understanding and willingness to interact.
[12:41:08 p.m.] Nathan (Hyung Soong) says: True. Balts example was confusing though. what i did was boil it down to its base parts. The example he gave actually has nothing to do with generic vs faction pirates. Its got to do with teh ID's that he chose as an example.
[12:41:32 p.m.] Nathan (Hyung Soong) says: if the IDs were different my reply wouldve been different as well.
[12:42:10 p.m.] Aidan (Turkish) says: His example, was very confusing.
[12:42:20 p.m.] Aidan (Turkish) says: I completely missed that it was oriented towards the IDs.
[12:42:33 p.m.] Nathan (Hyung Soong) says: ID's come first.
[12:43:47 p.m.] Aidan (Turkish) says: I would say that Hulk was stretching the very extent of his abilities.
[12:44:05 p.m.] Nathan (Hyung Soong) says: yup. I say so as well, but that doesnt make him oorp
[12:44:38 p.m.] Nathan (Hyung Soong) says: ppl are too quick to yell "OORP" without looking at the entire situation
[12:45:01 p.m.] Aidan (Turkish) says: Its true, people are very quick off the mark to flag, slag and report people.
[12:45:17 p.m.] Nathan (Hyung Soong) says: may I skype this into that thread?
[12:45:24 p.m.] Aidan (Turkish) says: You may.
[12:45:29 p.m.] Nathan (Hyung Soong) says: ta
[12:45:34 p.m.] Aidan (Turkish) says: Most welcome sir.
[12:45:52 p.m.] Aidan (Turkish) says: I would say that another thing to consider would be the stance of the Junker.
[12:46:17 p.m.] Aidan (Turkish) says: While Junkers are unisghtly members of society they aren't entirely pirates, no are they unfriendly to an etire swath of factions.
[12:47:26 p.m.] Nathan (Hyung Soong) says: And Kusari sapce is hostile to Junkers.
[12:47:32 p.m.] Nathan (Hyung Soong) says: deadly hostile
[12:47:46 p.m.] Aidan (Turkish) says: Hogosha don't take them lightly.
[12:48:19 p.m.] Aidan (Turkish) says: But its also connected to Sigma-13 which gives him an entry way.
[12:48:23 p.m.] Nathan (Hyung Soong) says: so?
[12:48:39 p.m.] Nathan (Hyung Soong) says: junkers enter kusari at their own risk
[12:48:41 p.m.] Aidan (Turkish) says: If he was RPing with the Blood Dragons that might be plausible.
[12:48:51 p.m.] Aidan (Turkish) says: They aren't so kindly towards the current establishment.
[12:49:27 p.m.] Aidan (Turkish) says: I agree completely, I just think there is always the possibility for their entry into Kusari within reason.
[12:50:41 p.m.] Nathan (Hyung Soong) says: oh yeah. im not saying junkers shouldnt go in to kusari, im saying that for a junker to sit still and stay silent IN KUSARI space is the stupidest thing ive heard of, from a junker.
[12:51:07 p.m.] Aidan (Turkish) says: Oh, absolutely.
[12:51:15 p.m.] Aidan (Turkish) says: Thats just looking for explosive decompression.
Generic pirate vs faction pirate - Baltar - 09-10-2008
Hopefully this helps:
Quote:6.6 PvP combat is allowed only on roleplay basis. The pilot who is attacking must scan for an ID prior to the attack. Relying on general reputation status (red/neutral/green) without scanning for the ID is not allowed.
Non-RP attacks are considered PvP abuse and are sanctioned accordingly.
You need to interact with other players based on their ID in consideration first. Not everyone knows how to control their IFF. While they need to get it correct based on lawful/unlawful ... first priority in role play is to acquire the appropriate ID for what you plan to role play. If you intend to role play a pirate ... get a Pirate ID.
Here are a few examples:
Pirate ID with no IFF = Pirate
Pirate ID with Blood Dragon IFF = Pirate with close relations to Blood Dragon
Lane Hacker ID with no IFF = Lane Hacker
Lane Hacker ID with Liberty Rogue IFF = Lane Hacker with close relations to Liberty Rogues (although he should really have a Lane Hacker IFF)
Now ... lets throw in the ships and equipment:
Lane Hacker ID and IFF with a Liberty Rogue Gunboat = Lane Hacker ... he doesn't become a Rogue simply because he owns one of their ships ... you can be friends or even allies with a faction to purchase ships and equipment and still not be one of them
Liberty Rogue ID and IFF with Outcast Destroyer = Liberty Rogue ... the Outcast Destroyer was a joint venture between the Liberty Rogues and the Outcasts ... read the infocard ... and makes sense with the Liberty Rogue Destroyer in New York
Red Hessian ID and IFF with a Beetle = a Red Hessian Trader ... but ... how the heck can he get a Beetle if the Kusari are Lawful? Well ... are the Kusari and Red Hessians enemies? Which corporation is it that actually sells that ship again? Check the infocards and you be the judge
Liberty Police ID and IFF with a Large Train = Liberty Police ... strange ... why would the police have a transport? While they "can" ... RP says "what?" ... especially when you see one of these in Sigma 13
EDIT: I'd like you all to know that I have a much better understanding of the unlawful factions than the lawfuls ... so while I may be factually wrong on the lawful ships and such ... I'm pretty familiar with the bad guys and most of the neutrals.
Generic pirate vs faction pirate - chovynz - 09-10-2008
What is this thread actually about Balt?
Because now you've introduced ID stuff, and tags and ships.
It still doesn't have anything to do with generic pirates versus faction pirates.
Are you asking a question? Asking for help? Asking for information?
Starting a forum I-told-you-so? Informing new players?
Please clarify your thread intent:)
Generic pirate vs faction pirate - Primus Avatar - 09-10-2008
' Wrote:What is this thread actually about Balt?
Its about "Generic pirate vs faction pirate" as the name says, stay tuned. I now see that I haven't made myself too clear so ill try to explain.
' Wrote:Because now you've introduced ID stuff, and tags and ships.
First and obvious reason for trying to go into detail is to remove speculations from this thread. I don't want people to misunderstand my question in terms of straying from the initial problem.
' Wrote:It still doesn't have anything to do with generic pirates versus faction pirates.
I play a Generic pirate with no-tag too. You wouldn't believe how often people PM me with sanction threats.
I had lots of situations similar to what "hulk" expirienced. The Junker was silent the whole time and once he chose to leave he PMd "Hulk" something like "//screenshots taken, sanction follows."
"Hulk" was sure he wasn't ooRP but it made me wonder of my own actions since i was sitting in the same boat many times. No-one likes to be considered ooRP, we would all like to set up a good example right?.
As for generic pirates versus faction pirates my question was if generic pirate indies can start conflicts with pirate factions if they so wish (lets pretend that they are suicidal). As hulk though the junker to be mocking him and it had pissed him off. But even if it weren't like this. And in general, a pirate chose to tax a junker (factionised pirate/smuggler) in a fighter (which makes little to no sense to tax a fighter but has happened lots of times)
' Wrote:Are you asking a question? Asking for help? Asking for information?
you guys were kind enough to debate on my initial question but i still have a question.
Can a generic pirate, if he's suicidal, start killing blood dragons in chugoku (just an example) to clear the trade rute and tax any powertrader coming by?
This question should fill the magical circle of life of this thread.
' Wrote:Starting a forum I-told-you-so? Informing new players?
I-told-you-so forum? Well i wont lie here, i intend to keep this thread for future reference. For people constantly calling me and my partner "Hulk" ooRP just because they don't like us taxing where we damn please.
Informing new players is good right? I don't see why they should avoid this thread.
Generic pirate vs faction pirate - chovynz - 09-10-2008
Much Better! I see where you are going now.
Disclaimer: I will state my opinions as I understand the rules and admins previously stated replies.
' Wrote:Its about "Generic pirate vs faction pirate" as the name says, stay tuned. I now see that I haven't made myself too clear so ill try to explain.Just make sure you know the Server rules, and dont break them.
First and obvious reason for trying to go into detail is to remove speculations from this thread. I don't want people to misunderstand my question in terms of straying from the initial problem.
I play a Generic pirate with no-tag too. You wouldn't believe how often people PM me with sanction threats.
I had lots of situations similar to what "hulk" expirienced. The Junker was silent the whole time and once he chose to leave he PMd "Hulk" something like "//screenshots taken, sanction follows."
If they threaten you with sanctions, ignore it and keep right on RPing. They are the ones going OOC, not you.
Don't even grace their single line "//thanks for the screenies. Look forward to you gettting banned," stuff with "I wasnt ...whatever."
As soon as you reply back to the OOC you lose. You get into a waste of time arguement.
I know its tough not to reply, but if they get you angry, the best thing you can do is be quiet.
Get away from them, and pretend their negative "//" doesnt exist. (if they say //gf! than thats cool:D)
Quote:"Hulk" was sure he wasn't ooRP but it made me wonder of my own actions since i was sitting in the same boat many times. No-one likes to be considered ooRP, we would all like to set up a good example right?.I would say so. Admins have said they wont interfere with inter-factional squabbles if it is in roleplay.
As for generic pirates versus faction pirates my question was if generic pirate indies can start conflicts with pirate factions if they so wish (lets pretend that they are suicidal). As hulk though the junker to be mocking him and it had pissed him off. But even if it weren't like this. And in general, a pirate chose to tax a junker (factionised pirate/smuggler) in a fighter (which makes little to no sense to tax a fighter but has happened lots of times)
you guys were kind enough to debate on my initial question but i still have a question.
Can a generic pirate, if he's suicidal, start killing blood dragons in chugoku (just an example) to clear the trade rute and tax any powertrader coming by?
This question should fill the magical circle of life of this thread.
I would presume that if an Indy pirate can clear out those BD's for his own piece of the pie then go for it.
There's nothing "OOC" of trying to muscle in on another gangs turf.
However be prepared to be hunted and shot, probably for eternity ever after doing that act....
Have another look at the pirate ID. It allows you free reign to try something like what you suggested. "Unfriendly pirates."
Quote:I-told-you-so forum? Well i wont lie here, i intend to keep this thread for future reference. For people constantly calling me and my partner "Hulk" ooRP just because they don't like us taxing where we damn please.Sorry, I wasn't being rude, just asking what your intentions were.
Informing new players is good right? I don't see why they should avoid this thread.
Generic pirate vs faction pirate - jpo - 09-10-2008
so the relationship in game mechanics would be white to white. Neither would be friendly nor hostile. That means the junker could be taxed but not open fired upon w/o being asked for tax first. And of course theres the 'you can shoot but you cant destroy until you ask' clause.
seems that it was within the rules but poor rp if any as he didn't ask for tax from the door.
doesen't really matter who claims authority over a system, thats a different issue. You step on someones toes you deal with the consequences.
Generic pirate vs faction pirate - Primus Avatar - 09-10-2008
Thanks for your feedback guys. This topic is closed.:cool:
Generic pirate vs faction pirate - Baltar - 09-11-2008
' Wrote:What is this thread actually about Balt?
Because now you've introduced ID stuff, and tags and ships.
It still doesn't have anything to do with generic pirates versus faction pirates.
Are you asking a question? Asking for help? Asking for information?
Starting a forum I-told-you-so? Informing new players?
Please clarify your thread intent:)
ID, ship, equipment discussion came up partly because of the in-game discussion you posted ... ahem ... that I was responding to ... *cough*
Anyway ... my "point" was ... there's a difference between the "generic" pirate and the "faction" pirate because their ID's are different. Pirate ID is different from Liberty Rogue ID ... get it? Pirate ID can buy a Liberty Rogue ship and still not be a Liberty Rogue. Pirate ID can buy a Liberty Rogue GB and put Corsair weapons on it. True ... Corsairs may not like this but you can actually buy the Corsair turrets at Junker and Zoner bases. And just because you have that ship or those guns ... it doesn't make you a part of either of those factions.
@ Balthazzar: I think he was talking to me ... but now that I see the first 4 letters of your name is the same as the first 4 letters of mine ... I can see how Hyung has made it a bit confusing.
Baltar ... Balthazzar
Generic pirate vs faction pirate - sovereign - 09-11-2008
' Wrote:Pirate ID can buy a Liberty Rogue ship and still not be a Liberty Rogue. Pirate ID can buy a Liberty Rogue GB and put Corsair weapons on it.
Wanna bet? That example is even mentioned in the server rules by name, or really close anyway. Not hard to find sanctions for such. OC alliance gear + Sair alliance gear on same ship = no, even if you have a generic ID. Actually, I know you saw it because it was a person named Black_Pearl who was generic pirate ID with sair and OC stuff and you posted in the thread to keep it clear that it wasn't your Black.Pearl. Ship and gear say a lot. ID says more, but you have to take the whole package in.