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+--- Thread: 2020 Mining Overhaul, Phase 1: Price and Sellpoint Adjustments (/showthread.php?tid=179657)
RE: 2020 Mining Overhaul, Phase 1: Price and Sellpoint Adjustments - Lythrilux - 05-13-2020
No more sell points for ores outside of Houses? Is this to combat and diversify pure ore runs?
RE: 2020 Mining Overhaul, Phase 1: Price and Sellpoint Adjustments - Karlotta - 05-14-2020
Quote:
Yellow squares are the buyers. Colored circles are systems containing mining fields, which then lead along their quickest route to their two buyers, grouped into regions.
Dark Blue, Taus source (Molybdenum, Niobium, Raw Hydrocarbons) -> Rheinland, Omicrons
Light Blue, Sigmas source (Helium-3, Uranium, Aluminum, Platinum) -> Liberty, Bretonia
Grey, Liberty source (Military Salvage, Premium Scrap, Copper) -> Gallia, Omicrons
Red, Bretonia source (Gold) -> Kusari, Rheinland
Diarrhea brown, Omegas source (Uncut Diamonds, Cobalt, Silver) -> Gallia, Kusari
Dark Green, Omicrons source (Iridium) -> Liberty, Bretonia
It does not show the routes for Xeno Relics or Azurite Gas (since they go to all houses), and it also does not consider fences, in the cases in which they are not in the capital system, where the main buyers are. Including those would totally overload the map.
Good job posting a picture without saying what it shows.
I didnt study the details closely yet (mainly because of the reason above and I needed a legend that is useful), I see a few problems:
- Omicron Gamma, a system that is supposed to be secret not too long ago and home to a pirate fatcion, is a travel highway for 2 things
- Routes that lead through empty jh-only access systems when they could lead through tradelane highway systems (for example leading through kansas and vespucci instead of Cortez California, and omega 5 omega 41 instead of o7 stuttgart)
- Why are there 0 ore routes that lead through the liberty-bretonia tradelane highway???
- Routes that lead through leeds, when leeds supposed to be a neuclear wasteland or sometihng
Overall, routes still need to be around fewer highways. Also, more sell points is good, not bad. You can have as many sell points as you like, as long as they lead players along the same route(s). Having acquired something only to find out you dont have a place to sell it, or very few options to sell, it, is frustrating. That goes also for non ore commodities. Its better to have fewer commodities and more places to sell them at.
RE: 2020 Mining Overhaul, Phase 1: Price and Sellpoint Adjustments - Venkman - 05-14-2020
Well done @Karst .
RE: 2020 Mining Overhaul, Phase 1: Price and Sellpoint Adjustments - Hokan - 05-14-2020
Malta's Import market be like
RE: 2020 Mining Overhaul, Phase 1: Price and Sellpoint Adjustments - Sava - 05-14-2020
Nice to see dev efforts finally being put into this very important thing.
Mining and trade used to generate predictable activity zones, which were later killed with tweaks to the economy and system design. I hope we can see the benefits of hotspots once again.
Also, I second Karlotta in this:
(05-14-2020, 12:31 AM)Karlotta Wrote: Overall, routes still need to be around fewer highways. Also, more sell points is good, not bad. You can have as many sell points as you like, as long as they lead players along the same route(s). Having acquired something only to find out you dont have a place to sell it, or very few options to sell, it, is frustrating. That goes also for non ore commodities. Its better to have fewer commodities and more places to sell them at.
RE: 2020 Mining Overhaul, Phase 1: Price and Sellpoint Adjustments - Groshyr - 05-14-2020
(05-14-2020, 12:58 AM)The Only Hokan Wrote: Malta's Import market be like
No more niobium ore, silver ore or uncut diamonds to snifferland
RE: 2020 Mining Overhaul, Phase 1: Price and Sellpoint Adjustments - conmann35 - 05-14-2020
I feel compelled to say that this... is stupid.
RE: 2020 Mining Overhaul, Phase 1: Price and Sellpoint Adjustments - NOVA-5 - 05-14-2020
Well done Karlotta, thanks for making that a bit more clear to understand.
RE: 2020 Mining Overhaul, Phase 1: Price and Sellpoint Adjustments - Spectre - 05-14-2020
What was wrong with the Iridium sellpoint on Sabah? Not sure why it needed to be moved to inside Bretonia when Coronado worked just fine.
RE: 2020 Mining Overhaul, Phase 1: Price and Sellpoint Adjustments - Karst - 05-14-2020
(05-14-2020, 12:31 AM)Karlotta Wrote: - Omicron Gamma, a system that is supposed to be secret not too long ago and home to a pirate fatcion, is a travel highway for 2 things
Yeah, I'm not a huge fan of the Sigmas-New London route through Gamma, but unless we do system changes there's not much we can do about that.
At least we don't have any routes that go through both Hispanic capitals like the old Diamond-Lyonnais route did.
For the record, going through Rheinland normally is only about a minute longer, so you aren't losing a ton of profit if you want to avoid Gamma.
Iridium through Gamma is okay though, I think, since the source is also in the deep Omicrons.
Quote:- Routes that lead through empty jh-only access systems when they could lead through tradelane highway systems (for example leading through kansas and vespucci instead of Cortez California, and omega 5 omega 41 instead of o7 stuttgart)
Again, unavoidable without system changes. Liberty source is a particular problem for this with its weird mining location in Kansas.
Quote:- Why are there 0 ore routes that lead through the liberty-bretonia tradelane highway???
I thought about ways to do this, but there really aren't any. Dublin-NY would be the shortest ore route by over a minute and a half, paying less than 8000c/u. Liberty's sources are so far apart, they wouldn't even go to Bretonia the same way - NY going the normal route, Kansas doing the weird Magellan thing, and Bering going through Rheinland (iirc). And we wouldn't be able to keep relatively equal numbers of incoming ores for all houses. Lib-Bret just doesn't really fit into the system, and maybe it's for the best that the houses only have to pay attention to the Tau and Omega, and Kusari and Rheinland borders respectively.
Quote:- Routes that lead through leeds, when leeds supposed to be a neuclear wasteland or sometihng
That's actually a good thing. Leeds is a desolate and unsafe system, which could become quite scary for its traffic.
Quote:Overall, routes still need to be around fewer highways. Also, more sell points is good, not bad. You can have as many sell points as you like, as long as they lead players along the same route(s). Having acquired something only to find out you dont have a place to sell it, or very few options to sell, it, is frustrating. That goes also for non ore commodities. Its better to have fewer commodities and more places to sell them at.
That's more or less true, but it's also heavily reliant on the mining fields being relatively compressed, which they currently aren't. Especially not the super spread out Sigma and Liberty sources.
Generally as long as everybody can sell what they're getting, it should be working as intended. With there now being no inter-house wars, your typical miners and haulers should generally be able to pick either of the two primary buyers - or at the very least, one of them. And I don't think there's any faction that wouldn't be able to dock on any of the fences for any ore.
(05-14-2020, 01:55 AM)Spectre Wrote: What was wrong with the Iridium sellpoint on Sabah? Not sure why it needed to be moved to inside Bretonia when Coronado worked just fine.
Basically, that's what was wrong with the entire system. Every faction wanted to have their own buyers, resulting in every ore going to very nearly every place.
When implementing a streamlining process like this, you either do, or do not. There is no try. No more half measures, Walt.
Five houses, ten fences, one independent. We cannot have four of the houses using the capital as their buyers, while Bretonia is using something in Coronado. We cannot commit to this basic setup, but add exceptions for every faction desirous of their own buypoint, that's pretty much what happened before and look where that left us.
It's also a deliberate attempt to keep the ores away from factions as much as possible, which is why the houses use the most diplomatically basic buypoints, their capital planets. Gallia is only an exception to save players from having to remember which of New Paris' docking rings is the correct one.