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+---- Thread: Always a bigger fish? (/showthread.php?tid=5441)
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Always a bigger fish? - RickJames - 01-12-2008
' Wrote:Ok I have to comment on the part about using a CD. Am I the only person who realises how pointless it is to shoot a CD in combat unless to stop them from running away?
It's a common opinion. However, there are a number of very special tactics you can use a CD for in combat.
If you do not know what they are and want to; join a PG with a good combat instructor.:)
Always a bigger fish? - RickJames - 01-12-2008
Also, Cruisers are often used as screening elements for BS's/Carriers and to take on other Cruisers.
They are also much much cheaper than a BS. While one on one a BS is almost always going to win against a cruiser; 2 Cruisers against 1 BS is much much different. And if we take mk8 armour out of the equation a group can afford 6 Cruisers for the cost of 1 BS. If we put mk8 armour on a BS...then a force can afford to field 12 Cruisers for that 1 BS.
So would a force rather lose one 1-2billion credit BS..or send 3 Cruisers and lose 1..maybe 2 of the cruisers if the cruiser pilots suck and the BS pilot is good. Thats only a loss of 150-300 million credits.
Always a bigger fish? - X-Lancer - 01-12-2008
k..my idea is..make all battleship's hull stronger..replace all those regular turret as fast refire AA guns..Battlerazor/Motar become battleship main gun/heavy main gun (the main gun should deal tons of damage to hull/shield..and the difference is its refire rate..battleship's energy supply should able to handle main gun with 40~60% of its total turret numbers, so player needs to make their ship as anti-cap or anti-fighter and refire rate, speed and range..)
Always a bigger fish? - chopper - 01-13-2008
Ok, kiggles, let's sort this the nice way, shall we?
Right. Let's go.
Quote:And that you said about CD's still does not change the fact that if you CD a GB even when it is turning all the pilots has to do is to press the "Z" key and your CD has had no effect and I am pritty sure most people can press the z key in under a second so it really does nothing.
No, i know what you are talking about. But you are not. If someone CD's you while you are turning, he stops your engine kill.
Right.
Now, if you press Z again, you will be going in which direction exactly?
Let me remind you, you are on 60% of the turn when CD hits you.
You press Z and what happens? You are going away from your target = you never see him.
If you are going backwards and shooting, he fires a CD, kills your engine, you press Z...
What happens? Do you still go backwards? Nope.
I don't know if you studied this game long enough, or you just haven't fought the right people, but the fact is.
CD is the ultimate Gunboat killer weapon. Yes, it is. Better then Inferno, in many ways.
You don't have to believe it, but it is, really.
You are very wrong on this subject mate, and you have to test it properly before you start guessing around.
Next one.
Quote:Well about the GB pilot being good, but bomber pilot being better. I would consider my self as an able Bomber pilot (not as good as I used to be but still pritty good) and Jamez (Skyshark) is definately a good (probaly the best) GB pilot and of all the times I have fought against him I think I might have won once maby twice.
And the point is exactly what i said.
He won because he is "probably the best GB pilot", and you are "an able Bomber pilot".
Again, believe it or not, a good bomber pilot has better chances of killing a good gb pilot then otherwise.
But again, it first of all depends on pilots, and then on ships.
Quote:As for a GB taking on a BS? what kind of BS pilots are you flying against? as I said earlier Jamez is most likely the best GB pilot on the server but if he fought me in my BS I would not feel even the smallest bit in danger, though 2-3 GB's are a danger to a BS that is true.
I never said it would be a fair fight. I only said it is possible. Very possible.
Quote:A cruiser taking on a BS? once again I greatly doubt it unless it is a BS pilot who depends far to much on heavy infernos, battlerazors and mortars so when faced with a cruiser that turns like a GB can't hit it.
If a Cruiser pilot knows his job well, this can be a fair fight, if he has a good ship and right loadout.
Quote:True the Corsair GB is large (though smaller than the Bretonia GB) and has alot of weapons and armor, though it will generaly still lost to a cruiser purely due to firepower and armor values.
Wrong, it is actually a lot bigger.
It depends on the angle you'r looking at it.
Brettonian GB is a box, while Corsair GB is thinner but much longer and taller box.
And please stop talking about poor pilots, someone can be offended;)
Always a bigger fish? - globalplayer-svk - 01-13-2008
corsair gb can kill cruisers,and sometimes also battlecruiser,all is on pilots who are in fight
Always a bigger fish? - Kazyumi - 01-13-2008
' Wrote:Also, Cruisers are often used as screening elements for BS's/Carriers and to take on other Cruisers.
They are also much much cheaper than a BS. While one on one a BS is almost always going to win against a cruiser; 2 Cruisers against 1 BS is much much different. And if we take mk8 armour out of the equation a group can afford 6 Cruisers for the cost of 1 BS. If we put mk8 armour on a BS...then a force can afford to field 12 Cruisers for that 1 BS.
So would a force rather lose one 1-2billion credit BS..or send 3 Cruisers and lose 1..maybe 2 of the cruisers if the cruiser pilots suck and the BS pilot is good. Thats only a loss of 150-300 million credits.
Well if you compare the costs to their performance, then one could atleast expect 1 thing to be better then the other if it's more expensive.
If we apply that formula, we'd have BS>Cr>GB.
However, in current form its more like: BS>GB>Cr if you get what I mean.
Statistically and numberically a fleet of 2 GBs can take down 1 Cr as it should (technical and numberal advantage). However a Cruiser just can't take a GB down because of their technical disadvantages - that isn't the statistical.
But there are other factors, yes numberically if there was a fleet worthy of the same cash but divided of more players that one should obvious win.
I suppose it's all a mathmatical equation in the end - and the Cruiser being left done maybe..
Always a bigger fish? - amigo7 - 01-13-2008
' Wrote:I might be quite new here, and this topic might be posted mostly because I'm disappointed with my latest purchase, but still I'd like to get something straight...
That, or just find out what you guys think.
Please don't make me out for a whiner because I feel disappointed about my purchase, it's not that I am really that bothered about wasting 120m with my trader char...
From what I've experienced, 2 gunboats can face any bigger ship, for example: a Battleship. (I've done it, and seen it done before)
Why?
Let me put it like this, the Gunboat has:Cruiser:
- ++Agility, comparable to a fighter (turning is quite formidable, when compared to anything of a higher class)
- +-Firepower, comparable to a cruiser (not same but almost as strong anyways)
- -Armour (can't last long against bigger ships, but with its agility it won't be hit much anyways)
Battleship:
- +Firepower
- --Agility, comparable to that of a battleship (not same but close)
- --Armour, comparable to that of a gunboat
1BS vs 1Gb or 1Cr, the battleship is the obvious victor over both - as it should be.
- ++Firepower (if it wouldn't have it, it would be toast!)
- ++Armour (making survival easier)
- --Agility
1BS vs 1Cr, -can't say that I know, but judging from its Agility and Armour there's NO chance - though I might be wrong so correct me if I am.
1Cr vs 1Gb, Gb wins due to it's great agility and equal firepower.
So... what can be done to make the cruiser worthwhile?
Hey got just one thing to say....i live in a part of the world where the lag and ping rate generally limit most performances. Lag is the real killer in most fights ....in ideal situations lets say your maybe close.....ish.
But yeah two gunboats can take a Battleship, but it's tough sometimes.
Definanetly a cruiser....
Two bombers well flown can take a gunboat. Two fighters well flown can take a gunboat. Two fighters well flown could take a cruiser
4 or more fighters/bombers in a pack can do well against most things indeed.
.....Having said that .........throw in some lag and 1 bomber can take two gunboats.
Sigh!.... that little red square always seems to pop up when it matters.
Always a bigger fish? - chopper - 01-13-2008
And that's lag abusing;)
Anyway, if the point of the subject is that Cruisers are underpowered, i agree.
Always a bigger fish? - Ryan Hanson - 01-26-2008
' Wrote:.....Having said that .........throw in some lag and 1 bomber can take two gunboats.
Sigh!.... that little red square always seems to pop up when it matters.
Thats because some people are so important to the server they have created there own character shields :P
While even gunboats are so far ahead of me in my finance state for now I would hate to have my hard-earned credits be brought down by one fighter/bomber.
Anybody ever play freespace? wings of bombers were deployed to take on one destroyer. I'm not suggesting anything THAT extreme, but capitol ships are supposed to be, well, capitol.