+- Discovery Gaming Community (https://discoverygc.com/forums)
+-- Forum: Discovery Development (https://discoverygc.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?fid=7)
+--- Forum: Discovery Mod General Discussion (https://discoverygc.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?fid=37)
+--- Thread: getting back on course or keeping it... (/showthread.php?tid=61778)
getting back on course or keeping it... - Hone - 06-19-2011
erm, ok... hopefully I got most of that:
Freelancer operate out of house space aswell, zoners operate in house space aswell. Freelancers cant pirate, they can escort and trade just like zoners escort and trade. I dont think your got it right about differences.
You say "You dont agree with the practises of a COMPANY but you dont attack everyone from their COUNTRY"
As a way of saying my dislike of different relations between factions, and the different zoner factions (I think that makes sense) is wrong, but I say you are just highlighting my point. Which is that the problem is that these different factions have seperated the zoners so that you would consider OSI and TAZ only countrymen, whereas in vanilla they WERE the same "company" - as you put it.
I dont get your lastpoint, never did I say the zoners shouldnt do those things, I simply said they shouldnt do them so seperatly. Perhaps you missunderstood.
You make a good point about "No going back" but that isnt how this mod works, remember the zoner/corsair/BHG war? That got "NOPE"d by the admins, when the devs/admins dont like RP, It gets gotten rid off. Thats just how this mod works, in an attempt to keep it stable.
getting back on course or keeping it... - Akura - 06-19-2011
' Wrote:1) have zoner factions screwed up?
2) what EXACTLY have they done wrongly?
3) if so ... what should be done to better things?
( 4) how would a perfect inRP reaction would have looked like in last years events ( which is why we still argue about it ) ) <--- only if you do know the background
1) Not nessesarily 'screwing up', but they've changed the Zoners from what they really were in Vanilla. The TAZ are recluses and the OSI act fine. What isn't fine is the [)c(] / [)o(] portrayal of the Omicron Zoners and the introduction of Zoner Capital ships. You're lovely people and all, but you've changed the meaning of Zoner quite a bit.
2) The Zoners are just people who aren't too big on house laws and like to live in anarchy, in a fragile political system where no one can tell them what to do.
Furthermore, the Zoners are lovely and all, but they shouldn't have capital ships, or any kinds of ships really. Perhaps a couple of small ones, which are fairly open market, but not massive warships.
Zoners shouldn't be cowardly pacifists like you make them out to be, if someone messes around in their space, they kick them out with force, if someone breaks one of their few, loose laws, they shoot them.
The Zoners also shouldn't hump the leg of the Order so much, as the Nomads aren't actually too interested in the Zoners. The Nomads are actually on the defensive in the Nomad-Order conflict, it's the Zoners who throw the punches by assosiating with the Order and making themselves targets.
3) Stop being so rude and protective of your space, no offense. Get violent every now and again, enforce your survival by being the baddest motherloves in the area, not by asking politely. People shouldn't look at the threat of the [)o(] attacking them and piss themselves laughing, nor should you hide behind Faction Right 5. Then again, learn the balance and apolagise where needed, so Corsair fleets don't rain down on you again, for example.
Cut down on the capital ships, sorry indies, but they're really stupid and just make you a threat to those around you, and not the good kind, it makes people nervous. What need have Zoners for warships anyway, it's already proven that capital ships are an offensive tool, snubs are a superior defensive force. Which brings me to the next point.
Stop assosiating with the Order so closely. Currently the Zoners are the only real ally of the Order, and the Order have a lot of enemies. The Nomads have no interest in you if you just leave them alone, the Zoners shouldn't care if the Nomads were a threat to humanity anyway, they live on the fringes of space to escape the bullcrap of humanity, not encourage it. You're just sticking your hand in a fire for no real reason on this one.
4) wat?
getting back on course or keeping it... - Arioch - 06-19-2011
Quote:Freelancer operate out of house space aswell, zoners operate in house space aswell. Freelancers cant pirate, they can escort and trade just like zoners escort and trade. I dont think your got it right about differences.
True, I guess what I mean is that I see many who IFF Freelancer, but have a seperate ID's that don't match. But, this is going into another thread I saw abouit locking IFF with ID. BUt along that. Most Zoners do and should ID AND IFF Zoner.
Quote:Which is that the problem is that these different factions have seperated the zoners so that you would consider OSI and TAZ only countrymen, whereas in vanilla they WERE the same "company" - as you put it.
I guess how I see it, is that Zoner, imo, represent a county. You have a people (Zoner) but multiple types of people within that, who may not all agree with on another, but still are part of the larger whole, even if vastly different. Take a Democrat or Republican. Two VERY separate ideologies, but still are united under one country. You follow? So if TAZ and OSI are countrymen, and operate separately from one another, or from Croners, I say... why not? As long as they follow the ZOner way... which they are imo.
Quote:I dont get your lastpoint, never did I say the zoners shouldnt do those things, I simply said they shouldnt do them so seperatly. Perhaps you missunderstood.
Quote:It just makes me think;
"You guys arnt playing zoners! Your making freelancer factions with caps, or trying to get your own ID" The indies are may not be better PLAYERS than you, but they are better ZONERS.
No where in that last quote did you say they shouldn't act so separately. I see that and read that you are saying that the factions are wrong in their RP of Zoners, which I have to disagree with you on.
Now in regards what you said about it being a mod. Again, its just my opinion, and I think that is wrong and unfair to discredit and remove an effort to RP something. Now, if it a bunch of players that get all "LOLWUT" and do things COMPLETELY out of character, then ok... make amends. But what has happened within the Zoner circle I think has evolved naturally and could very well happen within the Zoners, had this been real life/ACTUALLY happened.
My point is Jinx/everyone. Keep what has happened. Lets not change what us players, indie or faction, have put a lot of work into. Taking away Cap ships I think is a very wrong move.
Quote:Zoners shouldn't be cowardly pacifists like you make them out to be, if someone messes around in their space, they kick them out with force, if someone breaks one of their few, loose laws, they shoot them.
How then could Zoners protect and enfore their law/rules without ships to enforce that? I don't think a few fighters and bombers are going to keep them out. Plus, the Zoners biggest capship, the Jinkusu, is supposed to be a Mobile Freeport FIRST, and a battleship SECOND. Granted many don't RP this that way, but those who try and follow Zoner RP closely do try and incorporate it as such. (At least I have and do in mine, and I am an indie.;)) Also, Lane Hackers, LR, and others don't have caps in vanilla... if one faction is made to go back to vanilla, ALL should then. Fair is fair if we go to extremes here.
Now, uniting the Zoners under a large conclave/banner/council, as was tried before? Sure... why not try it again... but let it evolve inRP. I don't thinking deciding OORP what should happen with a faction is fair or should be done. It should happen inRP, and naturally, with all the mistakes and curveballs one would expect/unexpect.
getting back on course or keeping it... - Hone - 06-19-2011
' Wrote:1: No where in that last quote did you say they shouldn't act so separately.
2: I see that and read that you are saying that the factions are wrong in their RP of Zoners, which I have to disagree with you on.
1: That is my entire point, look at my first post.
2: I never said that what the zoner factions were doing was wrong, simply HOW they were doing it - by being seperate.
I really like diversity in a faction, I just think it should be A faction, not 3.
I think, if zoners want to RP as different "companies" from the same "country" then like Bowex and Gateway, there should be different IDs and npc factions for each.
getting back on course or keeping it... - n00bl3t - 06-19-2011
Just for the people who have sent me messages requesting I take a look at this thread, I am here and I have seen it.
I will go and address it later.
Not going into any depth here, because I will do that later, but Hone pushing Zoners off as Freelancers is just as laughable as Akura's nomads are peaceful agenda.
getting back on course or keeping it... - Hone - 06-19-2011
' Wrote:pushing Zoners off
Anyone know what that means?
getting back on course or keeping it... - Arioch - 06-19-2011
Push off... as in trying to turn or compare(Push) one thing to another (Zoner to Freelancer...)
getting back on course or keeping it... - Akura - 06-19-2011
' Wrote:Just for the people who have sent me messages requesting I take a look at this thread, I am here and I have seen it.
I will go and address it later.
Not going into any depth here, because I will do that later, but Hone pushing Zoners off as Freelancers is just as laughable as Akura's nomads are peaceful agenda.
Well, it's not intentional really, the Nomads actually don't really play much. A shadow of about two years ago, and the loss of Yuri hasn't helped.
The Nomads aren't peaceful, they're violent, they just don't give a damn about humanity. It's free TV and it's right next door. It's pretty clear by now that the Nomads aren't wiping anyone out, or there would be large planets missing from all our favourite houses.
getting back on course or keeping it... - Hone - 06-19-2011
' Wrote:Push off... as in trying to turn or compare(Push) one thing to another (Zoner to Freelancer...)
Ok thanks, I'm not saying Zoners are freelancers, I'm saying the official factions are treating them as though they are, and that its bad.
' Wrote:Well, it's not intentional really, the Nomads actually don't really play much. A shadow of about two years ago, and the loss of Yuri hasn't helped.
The Nomads aren't peaceful, they're violent, they just don't give a damn about humanity. It's free TV and it's right next door. It's pretty clear by now that the Nomads aren't wiping anyone out, or there would be large planets missing from all our favourite houses.
The Nomads arnt wiping out humanity; as Juni says:
"Because we're too strong"
They've probly given up by now, and have phonecalled the dom kavosh for help, thats who gallia really is.
getting back on course or keeping it... - michiyl - 06-19-2011
' Wrote:[...]1) No, it's almost 20 years after the Freelancer campaign. Things evolve in this time (compare computers now and to 1991, or the "western" world from 1918 to 1938)
1) have zoner factions screwed up?
2) what EXACTLY have they done wrongly?
3) if so ... what should be done to better things?
( 4) how would a perfect inRP reaction would have looked like in last years events ( which is why we still argue about it ) )
[...][/color]
2) See 1)
3) Less mysterious Juggernauts;)
Zoner factions haven't "screwed up". You can still play the vanilla Freelancer Zoner pilot, flying around in his or her freighter or fighter.
As it was said, factions like OSI and TAZ let you explore the evolved Zoners. Probably everyone will know that they don't represent the whole of the Zoners, and that there are Zoners who have nothing to do with the factions.
After all, Freelancer is not the finished game. Who can say how their infrastructure should've been and how they do things 20 years later?