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+--- Thread: about the (A)utarks (/showthread.php?tid=9123)
about the (A)utarks - Boss - 06-06-2008
The (A)utarks are tolerated in Liberty, at the very least.
about the (A)utarks - eristikophiles - 06-06-2008
' Wrote:Those aren't anarchist values, they are just values. Plus why would an anarchist want to CREATE a society? Generally they want anarchy, which is chaos, which is definately not as ordered as a society.
you are a moron. you probably think fox news is 100% accurate. do some research.
' Wrote:Anarchists want anarchy yes? If not, the name's wrong.
Sorry If I'm not very nice on the forums, I try to be a bit more respectable than a I usually am >.<
It would be a very good faction probably but I worry that It'll just seem like the SCRA.
ok i'm sorry i called you a moron. your post just sounded stupid to me.. like a 15 year old who hasn't learned anything about something and wants to go with their preconceptions. but really, i recommend you do more research on anarchism. it seems like you're not understanding what it's really about at all.
about the (A)utarks - eristikophiles - 06-06-2008
' Wrote:not bad, But the "I stole it" isn't something considered good, You will have to develop more about how you got those vessels.
Also an Anarchist Society cannot exist. Anarchism is the oposite of a society. When a Human is in the nature he is naturaly Free to do what he wants(very close to Anarchism). But once he is in a society he must get rid of this natural liberty (part of it), so at this point there is no more anarchy.
we didn't steal the ships, just the plans. getting out of Rheinland with a bunch of ships is bizarre. a covert strike team getting in and stealing plans (and not for all their ships, only a few), is relatively plausible. eventually, if we can, we'll customize the ships so that they are only loosely based on the original designs (mostly in appearance i think. but that is a long way off). perhaps we can write a nice short story on the covert operation, and the hairy escape under fire. that would be fun, and help explain this line of RP.
the argument about anarchist society you're using is the one developed by Nozick. unfortunately, Nozick operated with several starting assumptions which are erroneous, and have been shown to be either irrelevant or simply wrong by anarchist thinkers, both before and since. ultimately, this argument is the result of a failure to actually examine anarchist thought as described and practiced by anarchists themselves. Nozick instead creates his own starting premises which have no basis in anarchist thought, and are therefore prey to several problems, which he develops at length into a treatise on why anarchism cannot function in a society. part of the problem here is the neoberal concept of 'human as free in nature'. there is no such thing, as anarchists (and many others) have made clear. there are only human groups. without a group a single human cannot survive. therefore all the neoberal starting assumptions about 'life in the wild' are based on a total fiction. if you look up even a cursory description of anarchist social theory you'll find that it is robust and describes human society rather well.
about the (A)utarks - eristikophiles - 06-06-2008
' Wrote:Wait... so you got Rheinland ships, which you are duplicating... and you say you're saving up for a "Utopia" system... how are you going to incorporate that in-game? I doubt we'll make a new system just for you.
i've been told that established factions with a certain amount of in-game players active can become recognized by the server admins, and that systems can be added for huge fees, such as billion credits, or something along those lines. we're recruiting members, and are rapidly expanding our numbers. we will soon post a request for official recognition. as for making a system, creating the model of it so that it works with FL/D can be something done by us. we're planning to save at least a billion credits to have it added. any further requirements of the administration for such a thing is something we can figure out and (at least try to) do.
about the (A)utarks - eristikophiles - 06-06-2008
' Wrote:I see this as the 2nd religious-sounding faction appear in a week! Jihad!
or not...
From dictionary.com Anarchism: The theory or doctrine that all forms of government are oppressive and undesirable and should be abolished.
Reading this, I don't think you should use Rheinland ships, they are a very strict government and if you take their ships and speak out against them you'll end up fighting what may the the most powerful house in Sirius.
So I would say stay with Zoner and Civilian ships. Maybe some pirate ones, but no house ones as they are the governments you are trying to "undermine"
Did I even get the definition right or am I just speaking jibberish?
the definition accepted by most anarchists (and note that dictionaries are mostly not written by anarchists), is that anarchy is the absence of hierarchy. which is simple, yet leads to many things. part of that is that governments are inherently oppressive, because they are rooted in the monopoly on use of force and social hierarchies. but there's more to it than that.
as for using Rheinland ships, our intention here is to subvert the most powerful hierarchical society in Sirius' research and use it against such entities. as for speaking out against them, we aren't actively doing that. well, Mikuru wants to kill anything that so much as says something mildly offensive to us and rants about things sometimes (that is the character, very trigger-happy and hotheaded). but in general, we aren't. for the most part the plan is gradual change, which most likely would not provoke most factions to war.
also, when you say we shouldn't use house ships precisely because we're trying to undermine them, that makes no sense to me. how better to undermine than to use their own tools against them? .. of course, we are not attacking Rheinland. if they decide to declare war on us that will be another matter.
about the (A)utarks - Magoo! - 06-06-2008
Please note, our Founder is anarchist. So its like a Democrat talking to a Republican. It he can... passionate.
about the (A)utarks - Heartless - 06-06-2008
' Wrote:also, when you say we shouldn't use house ships precisely because we're trying to undermine them, that makes no sense to me. how better to undermine than to use their own tools against them? .. of course, we are not attacking Rheinland. if they decide to declare war on us that will be another matter.
Well if you are taking someone's ships and then using them to "undermine" the people who really make and own the ship... you're asking for a fight. Then you would have that faction plus their allies on you, and maybe the other houses as well because they don't want that to happen either.
Do you really expect to steal something and get away with it? Especially Rheinland?
about the (A)utarks - Lunaphase - 06-06-2008
' Wrote:Well if you are taking someone's ships and then using them to "undermine" the people who really make and own the ship... you're asking for a fight. Then you would have that faction plus their allies on you, and maybe the other houses as well because they don't want that to happen either.Seems rheinland is currently gearing for war with liberty. plus economic problems.... i think they may have a lot on their hands at the moment, and perhaps we can rp a change, at a later date. also, i would note a faction without an opponent is completely redundant. also, we cant use outlaw ships because then we would be outlaws.... so its either house ships, or nothing, unless theres a civilian cruiser lurking around that we havent found....
Do you really expect to steal something and get away with it? Especially Rheinland?
about the (A)utarks - Heartless - 06-06-2008
Well who said you need to use capital ships? There are plenty of good figthers around, and the Zoners have their own lot to choose from. What's wrong with all those ships?
I think taking ships from Rheinland is just asking for trouble.
By the way, what does your name even mean? I can't figure it out, hehe. XD
about the (A)utarks - Magoo! - 06-06-2008
Well... Anarchists aren't much liked anyways. And like Boss said, we're tolerated at best in Liberty. You know...
Anyways, but yeah. Stealing ships from the people and then fighting them. Well they initiated the hostilities. Albeit with good reason, but nontheless.