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+--- Thread: Junker - "NO PIRATING ALLOWED" (/showthread.php?tid=14395)
Junker - "NO PIRATING ALLOWED" - Baltar - 12-11-2008
' Wrote:I always thought that junkers are generally not going far from their operating areas (system with base) and that they use small vessels so that they remain unnoticed while doing any kind of half-lawful activity.
Therefore junker groups in multiple Pirate trains hauling goods over half sirius != roleplaying as junker to me.
Well ... according to rumors, Liberty ignores Junker activity because Junkers tend to provide intelligence information on smugglers and other activity. I'm still waiting for the Liberty official who ignores me as I fly by. I still get the "halt" ... so much for the hard core vanilla role play. Can you tell me the difference between LN, LSF and LPI? I have a hard time figuring out who's military and who's cop. Where I live, the military don't pull people over to check for illegal goods. Now maybe if Liberty had a Coast Guard ... I could see that.
Ok ... back to your question. Junkers (according to what I've read) have a mysterious background and pretty much keep to their own. Just because you only see them in one spot doesn't mean their always in that one spot. Many species are on the endangered species list because humans can only find them *ahem* where they see them. Then all a sudden they find a new herd of that species in a place they've never looked before. Wow ... so much for being endangered. Ok ... being a bit trite here ... but I hope you get my point. How can they be mysterious and you know everything about them?
I do agree with you to a point ... if we were on a vanilla server. But the Disco mod has introduced new ships, bases, planets, systems etc. There is no Bornholm Depot in vanilla FL. Junkers don't sell capships in vanilla FL (nor do any other factions in vanilla FL). With the evolution of Disco on FL, there are some tweaks to factions that are acceptable.
I'd like to see more people dump the Trader ID for a Republic Shipping ID or some other specific corporation ID. But until the Trader ID is deleted, we got what we got.
Quote:About a year ago there was a working junker faction here, flying a few collectors doing their business, mostly standing next to pirates and looting what was left of the trader if he didn't pay or simply asking him to drop say 100 units of his cargo. Looting things around and delivering small "packages" to major planets.
That imo was perfect junker RP.
Yup ... before the Diamond/Niobium run, Junkers had all that debris near Yanagi to mine ... not to mention the loot from those ships in Sigma 13 would have been taken by Junkers and not *ahem* Liberty Arms dealers.
Quote:Yes I don't roleplay junker myself, cause I don't think I could do it (for same reason I never applied to keepers cause I simply can't RP a Nomad properly).
Anyway junkers are getting the salvager which is meant exactly for what the name says.... salvaging. So supporting collectors in looting scrap metal or other things or even in occasional pirating. It is not meant for "Junker powertrading" but as of now I'm very sure it will be used for such things.
Power trading as a Junker? Well ... you see numerous "lawful" Trader ID's moving in and about the Omicrons with Liberty Police IFF and nobody says a word about it. A real eyesore to see a Police IFF and Trader ID docking on Crete or Malta to bring contraband back to Manhattan. Ok ... whatever.
EDIT: Ok ... there's a fine line between role play and uber-role play. Lets not go saying Liberty Navy has the right to control Magellan simply because the trade lanes say they belong to Liberty. I've heard that one before. Magellan is an independent buffer system between Liberty and Bretonia. And just because you have a jump gate or trade lane that is in a system doesn't make the entire system your ZOI. Role play does require we stay true to the faction your ID represents ... but it doesn't mean you are pinned in so much that you cannot be a slight bit creative.
Junker - "NO PIRATING ALLOWED" - jimmy Patterson - 12-11-2008
i hardly get hit hard but i just like to point ou my trader the "LuckySevem" is NOT powertradeing the IMGIFF is broken as per my rp i run military vehicles and passagers the people to hegoland then i go to bonn for mil lvehicles yet evry pirate i see charges me a powertraders price save for like two people 2 mill is fine3 thats high but il lpay it but 4 or 5 or die then you better not go and demand 4-5 millas youl lonly need to kill me anyway UNLESS i have passagers people say find another run well i would if there were escourts sig 13 is the safest i can go
Junker - "NO PIRATING ALLOWED" - Navycross28 - 12-11-2008
' Wrote:As the 'official' leader of .:j:., I say shoot those Junkers who don't pay. False Junkers are as bad if not worse than false Zoners.
I don't know how often I've been puttering about Rochester when a Junker tagged Advanced Train comes barrelling in from Alaska with 4995 Artifacts, a Navy wing hot on his heels and he speed docks. This is almost as bad as Manhattan in general RP, and far worse for Junkers in general. I'll often be asked by said Junker to help cover his escape. :dry:
(Side note: These are the guys we're happy to hand over on a silver platter if 'pressured'.)
Well said boss. As a .:j:. member it is very hard not to open fire on these "wanabe" junkers who give us congressmen a bad image.
Could it be possible to make a list (and bounty?) of all traders we see with lack the skill to use a simple communicator...
Junker - "NO PIRATING ALLOWED" - Hawk - 12-11-2008
There is no reason for us to take ANY action against foolish indie Junkers. I think the pirates can handle that one on their own. We do look out for the interests of all Junkers, but those who act foolishly are on their own. Remember that part of being a Junker is low profile and we don't want any part of those screaming "you can't touch me" in system chat.
As for Junker RP, we have no control over the indies. They play the game as they see fit. The RP of .:j:. is clearly stated in our faction page. It's been approved, there is no reason to debate it here. Let's not take this thread too far of topic.
Junker - "NO PIRATING ALLOWED" - Baltar - 12-11-2008
Yes ... lets not get to the point where we question an approved faction's role play.
Junker - "NO PIRATING ALLOWED" - Rudo - 12-11-2008
' Wrote:Here comes the question what is junker RP.
I always thought that junkers are generally not going far from their operating areas (system with base) and that they use small vessels so that they remain unnoticed while doing any kind of half-lawful activity.
Therefore junker groups in multiple Pirate trains hauling goods over half sirius != roleplaying as junker to me.
About a year ago there was a working junker faction here, flying a few collectors doing their business, mostly standing next to pirates and looting what was left of the trader if he didn't pay or simply asking him to drop say 100 units of his cargo. Looting things around and delivering small "packages" to major planets.
That imo was perfect junker RP.
Yes I don't roleplay junker myself, cause I don't think I could do it (for same reason I never applied to keepers cause I simply can't RP a Nomad properly).
Anyway junkers are getting the salvager which is meant exactly for what the name says.... salvaging. So supporting collectors in looting scrap metal or other things or even in occasional pirating. It is not meant for "Junker powertrading" but as of now I'm very sure it will be used for such things.
I've probably said it before, but roleplay evolves. I myself am of the belief that Junkers should be seen in Collectors and TR Freighters first and foremost, scrapping and scavenging and running small-time rackets. Real small game, not enough for the law to bother with.
But when we're not seen, who's to say what we do? There's more to the faction than most are aware of. We have eyes everywhere, we are connected in almost every part of Sirius. What will we do with such a broad perspective on matters?
Keep in mind that most factions would be far more limited than they are if they stuck by the very definition of their faction. Xenos would be flat-broke and unable to field bombers, or throw over 700k in expendable ordinance at a lone Collector to bring him down (Silly XA!:P). Hogosha and Farmer's Alliance would not run smash & grab privateering runs through Bretonia. The Bretonia Armed Forces would not have chartered privateers doing the same in Kusari. The SCRA, Keepers, Phantoms, Harvesters, and Das Wilde would not be allowed to exist.
My point is that we as a general rule should stop saying 'this shouldn't be', and instead ask 'so why is it like this?' Often times not only will the answer be satisfactory, you'll gain an appreciation for the deeper layers of a faction.
Junker - "NO PIRATING ALLOWED" - Derkylos - 12-11-2008
Pirates are out to hinder/stop trade. Most also have an ulterior motive.
As such, whenever you encounter a pirate, your ID/IFF is of very little concern to them. The most important thing is what you are carrying and where it is going.
If you are supplying a Junker/Zoner base with essential materials, most pirates sould probably let you pass unmolested. If you are supplying their bases, they should probably escort you to ensure it gets there in one piece.
However, as soon as you begin supplying neutral/enemy bases, you become fair game, no matter what your ID/IFF. By carrying cargo to an enemy, you yourself automatically become an enemy (barring certain cases-eg: Cardi/Arti to Manhattan).
So, anyone making the diamond-niobium run is an enemy to Bundschuh, Hessians, Dragons and Crysanthemums, be they Junkers, Zoners, Bowex, Outcasts, whatever.
As a trader, your actions define you.
Junker - "NO PIRATING ALLOWED" - pchwang - 12-11-2008
Right, before this turns into a bash junkers thread, allow me to inform you that this was not the intention.
This thread was aimed at the fact that I was accosted by two extremely oorp traders who were hauling Boron to Leeds. My pirate is a Molly, and regardless of what your tag is, if you're bringing goods to a BMM base, I'm going to be extra angry on you. Now, when I told the trader this, he responded by saying that he was doing to Kusari with the Boron. Being a hater of Kusarinese nevertheless, I ordered him to dump his cargo on Leeds, while he continues complaining: "why u harass friendly?"
Guess what happens?
His friend comes over, and orders his Outcast escort to engage me, then engages me himself.
This is not targeted at the Junkers who do roleplay.
I'm disappointed that you think that I would not consider things like,
Quote:Don't just look at their cargo ... examine their origin and destination.Because I did, and it was totally correct for me to do something about it.
Junker - "NO PIRATING ALLOWED" - Tenacity - 12-11-2008
A good junker knows how to talk his way out of getting pirated, and a good pirate knows to play along so everyone has fun. If the pirate is one of those "2mil or dai!" noobs, he doesnt deserve to get any money to begin with. Pirates arent exempt from RP on this server.
I have been pirated many times on my junker, or at least attempted on. Most of the time, I'm able to work my way out of it without losing too much money, and I -never- give raw credits no matter what faction you are. If you ask me for credits, you arent getting them, plain and simple. Sorry chap, I dont keep cash on me.
Most of the time, I offer to smuggle for the pirate or his/her faction on my next 'run'. As an example, several months ago a corsair attempted to pirate me while I was hauling VIP's. My response was "Well, these VIP's are pretty sour chaps, not sure you'd want a bite of them, but tell ya what... after I drop their lousy carcasses on kurile, I'll haul a load of luxury food out to crete for no cost." - he took the deal, like a good corsair would, and let me go with that in mind. I held up my end of the deal, after dropping off the vip's and returning to cambridge, i brought a full load of luxury food to crete (which you make almost no profit on there), and even offered to let the corsair escort me to the planet.
Of course, after dropping off the food for a few measely credits, I made a haul of artifacts to hawaii which made up the difference.
Basically, a junker (or smuggler for that matter) has to learn how to appeal to the pirate's wants. The problem is that most pirates nowdays do not want to RP, and know little to nothing about their faction - they choose a faction for the best ship possible or the best guns possible, and pirate so they can make easy money at another's expense with no consideration of the RP involved.
When caught by outcasts, I offer to haul cardamine for them on my next few runs at 'no charge' (of course the 'no charge' is only RP, I still make the money). When caught by GC, or even when in the same area, I tell them i'll bring them a full truckload of cardamine to sate their cravings.
The only pirates (other than the no-RP ones) that i've had problems with are hogosha and farmer's alliance - and both of those are directly opposed to junkers, which is ok. Most of the time they dont care what i can do for them, they want me dead =P
Smugglers require thinking, any way you slice it - if you're in the game for quick and easy credits, you arent going to be an effective smuggler. Learn to manipulate people, be devious, but always hold up your end of a deal lest someone hunt you down for being a two-tongued traitor =)
Junker - "NO PIRATING ALLOWED" - Baltar - 12-11-2008
' Wrote:I'm disappointed that you think that I would not consider things like,
Because I did, and it was totally correct for me to do something about it.
I can only go by what you wrote in your post ... cannot read your mind. And that comment was to the general population ... not necessarily to you directly.