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+--- Thread: Proposed In-RP Punishment System (/showthread.php?tid=15877)
Proposed In-RP Punishment System - sobuor - 01-29-2009
BAFlENS.Joe.ARmstrong
yeah this sounds good i like the plan guys
i'm self have had no luck in game to get any orders at all no one ever has any and i'm lowest on the list
i well be reporting for more training that was offerd in the forum but as far as in game none and i've been asking
but for the main time i will try see if i can get that more training
Proposed In-RP Punishment System - Evyn - 01-29-2009
' Wrote:There are some people who get targetted by people really good, and then they can't shake them. If there ordered to attack someone else, then it's like a death wise for them, because there easy targets for the person/s chasing them. If they don't chase the person because they know that, then it looks like there violating an order.
Dodging these people will not violate the targeting orders. If you are attacked by a superior pilot and can't shake them, it is within bounds of your orders to break off your target and go evasive. However, turning to fight that superior pilot would not be allowed, as thats where we lose the most of our pilots. They get attacked and turn to joust them, and end up eating a missile, mine, or supernova. The point of this is for those pilots to dodge and alert the battle coordinator that they are under attack and need assistance, then dodge the opponent. This way the battle coordinator can choose several different actions.
He can choose to switch the group's target to that pilot, taking down a good one with focus fire, which reduces the chance of losing pilots to him. He can choose to send only a few pilots after him to keep him busy, damage him, and hopefully distract enough so that he cannot kill any friendly forces, and then the group can take him out once the current target is destroyed. Or he can give the attacked pilot permission to change and duel him. But the point is to use the focus firing to help kill the better pilots faster and with fewer losses. I know from experience that most of our mid-battle losses not related to missile or mine spam is because a pilot is attacked, turns to fight, and the joust kills them because the opponent is a better target. A fleet works better when they work together, not when they are split up.
People will have the chance to explain themselves. We aren't just going to be slapping a punishment on somebody because of what we see and not wait to hear their side of the story, or reasons.
' Wrote:Most of that is what the BPA does(except for self-fining), however, and we often do have a good time doing it.Is that because of the system locations? Those are just examples. Leeds and Dublin aren't the only systems allowed for anti-smuggler duty. There will always be smugglers, and those are just the two most-frequented locations for them, and the ones in need of the most anti-smuggler patrols. Once the new version comes out, this can be changed easily. See below.
I'm all for the idea, but I think that it would be better if you revised the punishments to something else.
EDIT:
Also, it's not 4.85 yet, but once that does come around the corner, point 1 is not going to work out. Better to change it now than to cause confusion later.
' Wrote:Zees hombre, elgatodiablo...he speak da truth.The punishments we decided on were chosen not just to punish people for disobeying orders.. They were chosen because of RP value and the fact that they can aid the faction at the same time. In a real life military, soldiers and pilots can lose a certain amount of pay for infractions. Since we don't pay our pilots, we can fine them, getting the same result.
Now what would be really punitive? How about a patrol of Newcastle? It's huge and ....nothing happens there. They could bring screenshots of the alien ruins as proof with timestamps.... kind of like laps of the barracks ....
And for the escorts and anti-smuggler patrols, these also aid the faction and house. Our traders get fighter/bomber escorts, protecting them from pirates and helping our house's transport factions gain more money. Money that sometimes gets used to help BAF/BPA. And the anti-smuggler patrols are pretty self-explanatory. Catching smugglers is a police job, and low on BAF's priority level, but BPA could use the help, and the fact that its a low-priority mission and not exactly an exciting one is another mark in its favor as a use of punishment that isn't too harsh.
' Wrote:er... right. I hope you remember that the Privateers independence form the regulars chain of command allows them an arrogant elitism eventually resulting in not obeying the regulars orders without any punishment? :>Well, in fact, Privateers may find their 'lip giving' to be a bit more difficult in the future.. My character also talks back often with her superiors, and even gets into arguments with the Privateers. But so long as the backtalk is in-RP and not OORP, its dealt with in an in-RP manner. Because of its nature, punishments will be given out for repeated and continuous backtalk, not just a few comments. And even then, its a pretty soft punishment. Escort duty and anti-smuggler duty. Privateers would likely be given anti-smuggler duty, since they are almost all bombers and because that is something they are familiar with, since its similar to the piracy they do in Bretonia.
I wouldn't overly worry about it, since no one is likely to get punished unless the admiralty needs to make an example of someone.
For everything else, Bjorn brings up several good points. I'll add that to the battle coordinator post in the piloting manual thread, assuming he doesn't have a problem with it.
Proposed In-RP Punishment System - Bjorn - 01-29-2009
' Wrote:For everything else, Bjorn brings up several good points. I'll add that to the battle coordinator post in the piloting manual thread, assuming he doesn't have a problem with it.
None what so ever, I wouldnt post it if it was so secret. Advanced tactics werent included for that reason.
Proposed In-RP Punishment System - MrHeadphones - 01-29-2009
Well, I suppose that there would have to be some kind of penalty for breaking faction rules. Although, like several others, I am concerned about the rigid adherence to the "Do what a superior officer says" Rule. For example, on one occasion, I was ordered to retreat by one of the Ltcdrs. I retreated a little way (using thrusters) before returning to the fight and likely saving said Ltcdr's life by aiding in destroying the enemy ship.
We're not all military commanders here. We may have some experience from Freelancer, but I doubt even our highest ranked members make 100% perfect decisions. That's why I feel that some autonomy should be allowed, and the rules should be bendable.
Proposed In-RP Punishment System - Vic - 01-29-2009
This has my approval, I think all the military factions should do something like this in their own way. Because in short Military's and Naval forces all implement some sort of self guiding discipline. All with a proper punishment, of course theirs are a lot more harsh and drastic than one would want in a game. But if this is done correctly as you have already laid out this would weed out the unworthy and improve your RP standings as well as combat efficiency. You should give the higher ranked members an administer status, depending on how big your faction is it would be 3-10 people that have this. Then you do a majority vote and what to do about repeat and major offenders. Exile from house space? Demotions? Knocking them down a ship level? Cutting their pay check? Etc. Etc. Etc.
Again this is something all House Police factions and the Bounty Hunters should install into their already set systems of running and self-administrating ways.
' Wrote:and thats the reason i left BAF, cus some of their higher ranked people are jsut outright Dumb,
(in 1 of the KNF fights where both sides had caps, you thought it would be gud 2 hold the bombers back and lets cap VS caps, and guess which caps died? ours, and then we all got gunboat/missle spammed, Nice work peeps!)
Learn to use proper grammar moron, in fact, if I had someone in my faction who typed like you; I'd kick them out. Lest we mention a 1 on 1 fight is more enjoyable to both parties involved rather than 1 cap ship versus 1 cap ship with a bomber support squad. That's just unfair and none to fun, I play this game to enjoy the PVPRP it has to offer. I do prefer to win and smother the lawfuls like the dogs they are but in short, I prefer having a good fight with some wonderful RP before and afterwords. When some brat fails to give me any good sense of RP I'm tempted every time I PVP abuse him just because he annoys me. But I would never do such a thing, as fun as it would be to watch him cry in local chat.
/rant over*
Proposed In-RP Punishment System - Etaphreven - 01-29-2009
' Wrote:Learn to use proper grammar moron, in fact, if I had someone in my faction who typed like you; I'd kick them out.
Learn to be nice, you <copy paste Vic's retarded attempt at an insult here>. In fact, if I were an admin here, you'd be banned forever. Calling people names doesn't make you smarter, so keep that crap to yourself. Seriously, noone really gives a damn about it.
EDIT: And yeah, that does, obviously, go for Cosmos too.
Proposed In-RP Punishment System - Coin - 01-29-2009
my two cents:
1. RP punishments are a good idea. You've joined a clan that gives orders - not following them should have consequences.
2. There's no such thing as a bad student, only bad teachers. *Anyone* can learn to point a ship and fire their guns, and anyone can learn when it is appropriate to do so. Learning the difference makes you ideal for the role of teacher.
2.5. If you're in a fight and have been told to lay fire down towards 'X', and you find yourself getting pwnt by 'Y', take evasive action, tell your commander what the situation is, ask for new orders. Battle is a complex and fluid thing; those commanders who push on with the original plan regardless often taste the bitter fruit of defeat. BUT, they don't know the situation has changed if you keep schtum. It's YOUR responsibility to be the eyes and ears of the unit; everything you see and hear should be communicated to the leader. This is called 'Battle-Comms'.
Proposed In-RP Punishment System - Evyn - 01-29-2009
' Wrote:Well, I suppose that there would have to be some kind of penalty for breaking faction rules. Although, like several others, I am concerned about the rigid adherence to the "Do what a superior officer says" Rule. For example, on one occasion, I was ordered to retreat by one of the Ltcdrs. I retreated a little way (using thrusters) before returning to the fight and likely saving said Ltcdr's life by aiding in destroying the enemy ship.You still disobeyed an order. That would've gotten you a punishment. Due to the circumstances, a light one, but one none-the-less. When a superior officer orders you away, whether its a good decision or not, you're supposed to obey it. You could have just as easily been killed as easily as you won.
Proposed In-RP Punishment System - bluntpencil2001 - 01-30-2009
Lacking the alliteration of a certain officer, I must still approve of such.
Punishing the character is fine, but not the player. Make sure to stress to all new recruits the difference here.
Proposed In-RP Punishment System - Dieter Schprokets - 01-30-2009
' Wrote:Punishing the character is fine, but not the player. Make sure to stress to all new recruits the difference here.
That is precisely what this is about.