' Wrote:I know what you mean by calling people uncomplimentary names, I was there on one occasion and I warned the ones using them. You're right about that but you have to let the one that looses to feel a little bad, after all they lost. I don't tend to call people names when I loose and also don't like to be called names when I win.

True one fighter isn't supposed to be able to do anything on it's own except annoy a battleship. But a group of fighters should be able to do something... and so on, not to repeat what should hurt what. But, using RP as an excuse... let me ask you a question: Suppose Igiss makes the Kraken 2 do 80000 hull damage and 40000 shield damage, fire 4.00 and use 0 energy and projectile speed of 1500m/s (I wish!:lol:) and I come with 3 of my GoR to Kusari and start killing everything in sight in a matter of seconds and say 'It's RP Outcasts have such a weapon! I CAN use it, I won't impose unRP limitations to my faction'. How would you feel?

I rest my case!

' Wrote:You make good arguements and you have good points. Contradicting points but good ones nonetheless...

Now, i'm sure you've read my posts about the missiles and such. Are you grouping me in with the ones moaning, complaining and insulting in system chat? I hope not since I haven't done that. A single fighter shouldn't be able to hurt a battleship...that's only common sense.

Now a fighter should have a good fight against a gunboat...to at least be able to take the shield down (right now that doesn't even happen) It should be extremely hard to kill the GB and, if victorious, the victory would be that much sweeter for the fighter pilot. I do think that a wing of fighters whould have some chance..but no chance against the KNF missile gunboats.

I only have fighters, that's all I fly, they're what I enjoy flying. I can't go anywhere in game these days without encountering capital ships. Shall I stop playing, as you say the fighters should...until it's fixed? It will not be fixed, players are still going to use the biggest and baddest ships they can get their hands on.

When the GoR and Phantoms go 'hunting' (the 2 characters I use most) we bring a well rounded battlegroup in. Not a fleet of capital ships! And I am, as always, the fighter support. I can't go in any longer to these fights since there are no targets for me to fight...no fighters to take down. And I can't do anything to the missile boats either. That is ALL there is lately. When I don't last long enough to launch the first countermeasure when coming out of cruise....that sucks big time. I don't have enough CM's to last the first couple of volleys coming from your gunboat pilots.

I'm not saying to get rid of them by any means. What I am saying is that it's not fun being blown up, repeatedly and then being called names in system chat and hearing "Phantoms suck! We killed a Phantom!" Nor do I like hearing "You're a coward, Phantom! You don't want to fight us cause you're a chickenSh*t Phantom!" No, i'm a lone raven claw and i'm trying to make it to a base to do missions (cause that's all I can do anymore) and I have 4 people flying capital ships in the system wanting me to fight them for their sole purpose of bragging rights.

There are others out there like me, who only fly fighters and are sad that we can't do anything. We've talked about it, it sucks.

' Wrote:Nadir, you say your not encouraging people to come after you in BSs, but thats exactly what the KNF is doing. Every time fighters show up you don't go hop in your own to duel. More than half your members traded in their only fighters for gunboats, and then put as many missiles on them as could be. True, your changing your ships to deal with what you face more often, but when you go to the extent where your using ships and equipment that DO need balanced (Miner with GB weaps in Honshu anyone?) than thats what is making people mad. Misfit is using 5 missile turrets and simply spamming fighters non stop 'just because he can.'

Quote:This isn't about losing, but about people abusing things that need balanced. You know when the Viper became near-invincible, people started using it because they KNEW it was half-impossible to kill without spamming torpedoes. Then there were the other players who (some even had the ship) refused to fly them until the version came out to fix them. These players were not mad about losing. They were made that a bunch of noobs just went out and grabbed the best and buggiest fighter they could because they knew they would win almost any fight against another fighter.

Quote:Thats the problem with spamming with 5 missile turrets. You don't want to encourage them from bringing battleships, but spamming missiles IS going to do that. I planned to make a Blood Dragon fighter so I wouldn't always have to use my cruiser, except against cruisers. Now I HAVE to use that cruiser whenever I enter Kusari because all I expect is being spammed. Its ruining the game for everyone. Adjusting your loadout to your enemy is one thing, using an unbalanced one just so you can win is something completely different. It IS unfair and it should be fixed. Not because it beats other loadouts, but because it shouldn't be able to kill a fighter in 5 seconds, gunboat or not. True, a cruiser can hurt the GB more now without getting as much damage, but what cruiser can effectively hit a GB in the first place? My Talarca is a light cruiser, meaning less armor and more agility, and I still have a hard time. If the GB is attacked by a larger ship it can just cut and run until enemy is out of CDs.

Quote:This is an uber-loadout used by those interested in just winning, as is the missile spamming 'tactic' and needs to be balanced with everything else in the game. Its still going to be a very effective fighter killer loadout, but it should NOT be this good. Thats all there is to it, and you can either accept it or deny it, its your opinion, but what is a fact is it IS unfair to anyone in a fighter. True, upon seeing a GB a fighter should run or get some backup, but with this missile spamming loadout a fighter is dead upon sight.

Quote:If this continues unbalanced (which it won't) fighters, the thing FL was made to use, will be useless and never touched. You'll see capships, capships, and more capships. Then GBs will die off as their are no fighters to use. Then it will either be tons of BSs or BSs and cruisers. Maybe with fighters coming back.

The fact is we don't want cycles, we want everything to be used equally and for everything to be able to survive a fight fairly. Already I've seen the numbers of fighters reduced in such a way its sad because all SF, SA, or KNF does is missile spam. I have a great respect for RM because of the way they fight and not use unbalanced or out-of-RP equipment. The fact that they do not go out in tons of RH GBs and missile spams earns them a great deal of my respect. They have more fighters than anything else, unique among the player house factions. They are not interested in winning so much as they are in having fun and the other players having fun. SA, SF, KNF, you three factions are only interested in winning (or in SA's case, making sure they 'appear' to win no matter the cost, as is obvious from their 'buggy' battle reports.) and that fact becomes evident in the ships your use and/or the equipment and tactics. You aren't interested in other people's fun, but only your own, and more importantly (for you), winning.

' Wrote:Well, I only have a destroyer and a gunboat in this server, and the rest are fighters. Im avoiding most pvp encounters right now, if not all of them. My fighters are going to shoot only at npcs, no pvp situation anymore, except for clan battles. In BK I had used battleships but I think they suck, so I dont plan to have one in disco. My trader is making money more to buy a collection of fighters, but it will comes to be that I will only be shooting at npcs, as people only want battleships.

' Wrote:I'm not going to comment on the armament thing, both my 'missle ships' had missles back when they sucked, and will continue to have missles once they've been changed. I'll refrain from using them for now, and won't be putting missle turrets on my other ships.