+- Discovery Gaming Community (https://discoverygc.com/forums)
+-- Forum: Role-Playing (https://discoverygc.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?fid=9)
+--- Forum: Official Player Factions (https://discoverygc.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?fid=60)
+---- Forum: Kusari (https://discoverygc.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?fid=75)
+----- Forum: GC- (https://discoverygc.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?fid=537)
+----- Thread: Golden Chrysanthemum Gen'an Cell - Feedback (/showthread.php?tid=169341)
RE: Golden Chrysanthemum Gen'an Cell - Feedback - Hemlocke - 06-14-2020
(06-14-2020, 02:58 AM)E X O D I T E Wrote: Some expectation of lorewise consistency.
The faction lorewise has been inconsistent with interaction, because rarely is every encounter the same. When we shot the order, BD| got pissed, and then my radical character "Katsuki Hanako" did damage control and went peaceful diplomat with her allies.
Recently an interaction popped up where the Coalition built a base in Kyushu or is building one, and the response was immediately go to war with BD| if they refused to remove the abomination, my character fell into silence, unwilling to kill her ally and fall back on pacifism to search for answers in Matsuda's text.
The faction's own lore remains consistent, but interactions change on a case by case basis, as any faction would very well know. A faction that never brings anything new to the table and remains predictable in every circumstance is a faction nobody will be interested in, just like characters without any dynamic quirks or depth of character will not be interesting to anyone.
RE: Golden Chrysanthemum Gen'an Cell - Feedback - E X O D I T E - 06-14-2020
(06-14-2020, 03:28 AM)Hemlocke Wrote:(06-14-2020, 02:58 AM)E X O D I T E Wrote: Some expectation of lorewise consistency.
The faction lorewise has been inconsistent with interaction, because rarely is every encounter the same. When we shot the order, BD| got pissed, and then my radical character "Katsuki Hanako" did damage control and went peaceful diplomat with her allies.
Recently an interaction popped up where the Coalition built a base in Kyushu or is building one, and the response was immediately go to war with BD| if they refused to remove the abomination, my character fell into silence, unwilling to kill her ally and fall back on pacifism to search for answers in Matsuda's text.
The faction's own lore remains consistent, but interactions change on a case by case basis, as any faction would very well know. A faction that never brings anything new to the table and remains predictable in every circumstance is a faction nobody will be interested in, just like characters without any dynamic quirks or depth of character will not be interesting to anyone.
That's not the faction being inconsistent, that is a senior member of the group attempting to clean up a mess that absolutely nobody on either side wants to deal with. Said senior member had made personal friendships with the Dragon members in question, all easily found in existing roleplay. You did a good job with her, any faction would do well with a character like her in its roster.
Compare to: "I am a former KSP officer who won't fight other KSP if I can help it." as a backstory. It's passable, and gives the character some depth, but KSP has for literal decades had a "we kill every GC who falls into our power out of hand" policy in infocards, and GC routinely has to screen out female infiltrators from the Kusari authorities in news articles. To flat-out admit to being police personnel should invite far more scrutiny than what we are seeing. Again, I am not telling people "how to RP", I am merely pointing out that with the lore given, such a character would appear sketchy to the actual literal cult that is GC. It is ultimately Meg's faction, but I fear that the newbies are in for a rude surprise down the road when they apply their flawed understanding of the canon lore (some of which Meg is actually rewriting) unless Meg puts together some sort of "GC introductory booklet" or something for them to read before they roll up their characters.
(I would have done it myself, but Meg definitely isn't sharing those new infocards she wrote with me now >.<)
EDIT: Okay, to give the tl;dr to end all tl;drs
I want the players to do well, they are newbies and do need some gentle guidance. Every official faction I partook in ever had me at the very least read a lore doc before I could even apply (Core|'s was pretty entertaining back in the day, ngl), and the faction itself is having developments in its lore that make it appear more moderate outwardly, which I believe should be reflected in its information. I admit that my expectations of "read the lore even the old infocards and news articles" seem a bit outlandish, but at the same time, MEG IS REWRITING SAID INFOCARDS, so of course members and people wanting to join should have some knowledge of what the lore is beyond "all female group of terrorists who want a matriarchy".
RE: Golden Chrysanthemum Gen'an Cell - Feedback - Megaera - 06-14-2020
(06-14-2020, 04:08 AM)E X O D I T E Wrote:(06-14-2020, 03:28 AM)Hemlocke Wrote:(06-14-2020, 02:58 AM)E X O D I T E Wrote: Some expectation of lorewise consistency.
The faction lorewise has been inconsistent with interaction, because rarely is every encounter the same. When we shot the order, BD| got pissed, and then my radical character "Katsuki Hanako" did damage control and went peaceful diplomat with her allies.
Recently an interaction popped up where the Coalition built a base in Kyushu or is building one, and the response was immediately go to war with BD| if they refused to remove the abomination, my character fell into silence, unwilling to kill her ally and fall back on pacifism to search for answers in Matsuda's text.
The faction's own lore remains consistent, but interactions change on a case by case basis, as any faction would very well know. A faction that never brings anything new to the table and remains predictable in every circumstance is a faction nobody will be interested in, just like characters without any dynamic quirks or depth of character will not be interesting to anyone.
That's not the faction being inconsistent, that is a senior member of the group attempting to clean up a mess that absolutely nobody on either side wants to deal with. Said senior member had made personal friendships with the Dragon members in question, all easily found in existing roleplay. You did a good job with her, any faction would do well with a character like her in its roster.
Compare to: "I am a former KSP officer who won't fight other KSP if I can help it." as a backstory. It's passable, and gives the character some depth, but KSP has for literal decades had a "we kill every GC who falls into our power out of hand" policy in infocards, and GC routinely has to screen out female infiltrators from the Kusari authorities in news articles. To flat-out admit to being police personnel should invite far more scrutiny than what we are seeing. Again, I am not telling people "how to RP", I am merely pointing out that with the lore given, such a character would appear sketchy to the actual literal cult that is GC. It is ultimately Meg's faction, but I fear that the newbies are in for a rude surprise down the road when they apply their flawed understanding of the canon lore (some of which Meg is actually rewriting) unless Meg puts together some sort of "GC introductory booklet" or something for them to read before they roll up their characters.
(I would have done it myself, but Meg definitely isn't sharing those new infocards she wrote with me now >.<)
"She prefers not to kill her erstwhile colleagues if she can avoid it, but the consequences for her family would be severe if she were ever properly identified. She will fight on their behalf even as they think her dead."
Its a KSP pilot that turned against the KSP and saved a couple of GC pilots while doing so. But by this logic your own character is sketchy aswell as being a daughter of a Hogosha family. Also prefering not to fight someone is not the same as not fighting someone.
And don't worry, I educate my members well on the lore.
Also:
In order to serve our cause, you must pass the Trial of Severing. Do you agree to pass the trial?: Yes
Do you agree to have your character addicted to cardamine?: Yes
"GC routinely has to screen out female infiltrators from the Kusari authorities in news articles"
Done.
RE: Golden Chrysanthemum Gen'an Cell - Feedback - E X O D I T E - 06-14-2020
(06-14-2020, 04:27 AM)Megaera Wrote:(06-14-2020, 04:08 AM)E X O D I T E Wrote:(06-14-2020, 03:28 AM)Hemlocke Wrote:(06-14-2020, 02:58 AM)E X O D I T E Wrote: Some expectation of lorewise consistency.
The faction lorewise has been inconsistent with interaction, because rarely is every encounter the same. When we shot the order, BD| got pissed, and then my radical character "Katsuki Hanako" did damage control and went peaceful diplomat with her allies.
Recently an interaction popped up where the Coalition built a base in Kyushu or is building one, and the response was immediately go to war with BD| if they refused to remove the abomination, my character fell into silence, unwilling to kill her ally and fall back on pacifism to search for answers in Matsuda's text.
The faction's own lore remains consistent, but interactions change on a case by case basis, as any faction would very well know. A faction that never brings anything new to the table and remains predictable in every circumstance is a faction nobody will be interested in, just like characters without any dynamic quirks or depth of character will not be interesting to anyone.
That's not the faction being inconsistent, that is a senior member of the group attempting to clean up a mess that absolutely nobody on either side wants to deal with. Said senior member had made personal friendships with the Dragon members in question, all easily found in existing roleplay. You did a good job with her, any faction would do well with a character like her in its roster.
Compare to: "I am a former KSP officer who won't fight other KSP if I can help it." as a backstory. It's passable, and gives the character some depth, but KSP has for literal decades had a "we kill every GC who falls into our power out of hand" policy in infocards, and GC routinely has to screen out female infiltrators from the Kusari authorities in news articles. To flat-out admit to being police personnel should invite far more scrutiny than what we are seeing. Again, I am not telling people "how to RP", I am merely pointing out that with the lore given, such a character would appear sketchy to the actual literal cult that is GC. It is ultimately Meg's faction, but I fear that the newbies are in for a rude surprise down the road when they apply their flawed understanding of the canon lore (some of which Meg is actually rewriting) unless Meg puts together some sort of "GC introductory booklet" or something for them to read before they roll up their characters.
(I would have done it myself, but Meg definitely isn't sharing those new infocards she wrote with me now >.<)
"She prefers not to kill her erstwhile colleagues if she can avoid it, but the consequences for her family would be severe if she were ever properly identified. She will fight on their behalf even as they think her dead."
Its a KSP pilot that turned against the KSP and saved a couple of GC pilots while doing so. But by this logic your own character is sketchy aswell as being a daughter of a Hogosha family. Also prefering not to fight someone is not the same as not fighting someone.
And don't worry, I educate my members well on the lore.
Also:
In order to serve our cause, you must pass the Trial of Severing. Do you agree to pass the trial?: Yes
Do you agree to have your character addicted to cardamine?: Yes
"GC routinely has to screen out female infiltrators from the Kusari authorities in news articles"
Done.
Then I will leave them in your hands. I look forward to interacting with your members on a character who isn't psycho Chihaya.
Also Chihaya killed her father specifically because she disagreed with how the Hogosha does business, and didn't want to be married off like chattel, so by the logic you have presented, every GC member in existence would have been subject to scrutiny, unless GC members just come out of the void with no previous baggage.
RE: Golden Chrysanthemum Gen'an Cell - Feedback - Drake Averos - 06-14-2020
As one of the people you seem to be using as an example of "station camping" I have to confess, that I am confused. You caught me as I was undocking, and we sat and RP'd. My character isn't going to randomly attack people they don't know, especially if their IFF shows they are also GC, even if it's a different cell. And since we were sitting there having a chat, just up and leaving seemed rude...
I am even more confused by your view that ALL GC must be raging nuts who attack everything like a rabid dog. Every network of terrorists has a support group who builds/appropriates their gear, supplies their bases, and builds their fighters. While my character has never avoided battle (Despite my piss poor PVP skills) she doesn't just run around killing innocents, or attacking everything that moves. The fact that other people have chosen to play something other than kamikaze pilots seems to grate on you.
In your head you seem to have a view that all GC must be suicide bombers. But the group in vanilla still had all the support base of NON nut jobs that build stations, and ships and such.
Just because people are part of a movement marked as "terrorist" doesn't mean they've forgotten how to think, or how to operate as a unit, or how to create. After all, in order to install a Matriarch, there has to be planning, and things arranged to make it work.
Also.... Chihaya spent so much time trying to convince a mechanic to assassinate people she literally owes her life to. To convince her to turn on the sisters she swore to protect.... And because she refused to she isn't "extreme" enough for your preferences?
Your logic has some pretty serious flaws. Maybe you really should go start your own Cell, because it is obvious that no one is every going to make something "extreme" enough for what you clearly want.
RE: Golden Chrysanthemum Gen'an Cell - Feedback - E X O D I T E - 06-14-2020
(06-14-2020, 04:57 AM)Drake Averos Wrote: As one of the people you seem to be using as an example of "station camping" I have to confess, that I am confused. You caught me as I was undocking, and we sat and RP'd. My character isn't going to randomly attack people they don't know, especially if their IFF shows they are also GC, even if it's a different cell. And since we were sitting there having a chat, just up and leaving seemed rude...
I am even more confused by your view that ALL GC must be raging nuts who attack everything like a rabid dog. Every network of terrorists has a support group who builds/appropriates their gear, supplies their bases, and builds their fighters. While my character has never avoided battle (Despite my piss poor PVP skills) she doesn't just run around killing innocents, or attacking everything that moves. The fact that other people have chosen to play something other than kamikaze pilots seems to grate on you.
In your head you seem to have a view that all GC must be suicide bombers. But the group in vanilla still had all the support base of NON nut jobs that build stations, and ships and such.
Just because people are part of a movement marked as "terrorist" doesn't mean they've forgotten how to think, or how to operate as a unit, or how to create. After all, in order to install a Matriarch, there has to be planning, and things arranged to make it work.
Also.... You spent so much time trying to convince a mechanic to assassinate people she literally owes her life to. To convince her to turn on the sisters she swore to protect.... And because she refused to she isn't "extreme" enough?
Your logic has some pretty serious flaws. Maybe you really should go start your own Cell, because it is obvious that no one is every going to make something "extreme" enough for what you clearly want.
There we go. "player = character".
Chihaya the character was mentally unsound, and that made her a horrible judge of character. OF COURSE your character would never backstab Meg's character, I knew this oorply because Meg would slap something like that down in seconds. Yet my character, with her stated goal of "punish Gen'an for a perceived betrayal", will not care, and your character's ears were open, or seemed to be open. And that's the point. Not all RP on Disco has to lead somewhere mechanically. My character was trying to lay a web of intrigue, hoping to have Mariko suffer an ironic punishment, but all involved knew it would go nowhere.
Honestly, that whole episode of even trying to join GC- was an oddity for me, because Meg asked me to join in the first place. I almost never RP on Disco for the RP of it, I RP whilst doing literally anything else, be it trading or shooting things. For GC-, I RP'd for the sake of the RP itself, to see where it went, and all it got me was... this. Lesson learned, I guess.
Also
"In your head you seem to have a view that all GC must be suicide bombers. But the group in vanilla still had all the support base of NON nut jobs that build stations, and ships and such."
Vanilla rumors Wrote:<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-16"?><RDL><PUSH/><TEXT>The Golden C. are dangerous fanatics who do not care if they live or die. The Cardamine has made them mad. One tried to ram my ship. Fortunately, I dodged her attack and blew her craft to pieces.</TEXT><PARA/><POP/></RDL>
<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-16"?><RDL><PUSH/><TEXT>If you are looking to kill Golden Chrysanthemums, head north to the Kyushu Hole in Saiun. The Golden C. also use the clouds to move through the system. I get paid good money to vaporize those ladies. Watch out, if they sense that they are about to be destroyed, they have no problem ramming you.</TEXT><PARA/><POP/></RDL>
I read these infocards and lore bits when I made my character. Did you? (It's entirely fair to say you didn't, or at least you did then disregarded that anyway, but the point I am trying to make is that the character is surrounded on all sides by fanatics. She lives alongside an actual high priest of the cult. If you develop the character, do keep in mind her day to day surroundings, all right?
)
RE: Golden Chrysanthemum Gen'an Cell - Feedback - jammi - 06-14-2020
I've seen enough inane nitpicking. @
RE: Golden Chrysanthemum Gen'an Cell - Feedback - Drake Averos - 06-14-2020
My statement still stands true . Yes there are Kamikaze pilots, but that does not mean they ALL are. I HAVE read the lore, believe it or not, and even played may moons ago.
One can be a fanatic and NOT be suicidal. After all, the goal is to make the enemy give their lives rather then kill yourself. Yes, crashing into a foe to take them WITH you could also work.
If ALL GC were suicidal fanatics, there never would have BEEN a movement. They would have all exploded and that would have been the end. Instead there is an actual movement. People planning, advancing the cause to make the Empress goal HAPPEN.
I have not said there were NO suicidal pilots, merely that you should open your mind, and realize that the GC movement is more than JUST the self destructive types.
Also, I never said Aika wasn't extreme enough for Chihaya. YOU are the one stating characters are not extreme enough, not your character. While I may have misspoke, and said you, when it should have been Chihaya spent the time, the statement is still legitimate. (I will correct the mistake.)
You keep complaining about "pacifists" Yet Aika has flown, and fought on several occasions, without hesitation.
I have read much of the lore, and have yet to see anything that says that all terrorists must self destruct on their foes immediately.
It is unfortunate you've decided to be condescending, as that has seriously impaired my desire to even attempt to talk to you at this point.
I hope you have a wonderful night.
RE: Golden Chrysanthemum Gen'an Cell - Feedback - Grumblesaur - 06-14-2020
(06-14-2020, 05:38 AM)E X O D I T E Wrote: Chihaya the character was mentally unsound, and that made her a horrible judge of character. OF COURSE your character would never backstab Meg's character, I knew this oorply because Meg would slap something like that down in seconds. Yet my character, with her stated goal of "punish Gen'an for a perceived betrayal", will not care, and your character's ears were open, or seemed to be open. And that's the point. Not all RP on Disco has to lead somewhere mechanically. My character was trying to lay a web of intrigue, hoping to have Mariko suffer an ironic punishment, but all involved knew it would go nowhere.
Judging by the rest of this discussion, the actual issue here is not the core of any particular character's roleplay. The issue is that you were rude:
(06-14-2020, 02:57 AM)Megaera Wrote: Ever since I denied his app, he has been harrassing my members with hateful comments. When I banned from the GC- channel because of this, he started pming me toxic comments or posting them in my non faction related channel.
Every time someone posted an app, he was pming me about how bad that person was or how bad their app was. so when I silenced him completely, he came here to whine.
People in my faction were amazed with how much I let slide from Exodite in the past, but I am done with it. I posted several times in this thread to let it go and do something else. Stop obsessing over this faction and anything that is being posted on forums. Its getting really creepy.
The consistency and lore-appropriateness of one's character is not the only factor that gets one into factions. Factions recruit outside of roleplay, as a player construct, as well as in roleplay, as a character construct.
It's easier to take a weak roleplayer who can get along with others than to take a strong roleplayer who doesn't seek inter-player cooperation. It's easy to get people up to speed on lore and faction diplomacy, but it's a lot harder to teach someone manners.
The world is not a meritocracy, and it shouldn't be. Skill, be it in work, sports, or games, is not the only qualifier (nor even the most important qualifier) for membership in a team. Everyone who plays a game even remotely like Freelancer would do well to remember this.
RE: Golden Chrysanthemum Gen'an Cell - Feedback - Xenon - 06-19-2020
Excellent write-up and lore updates... I like your colors and your spirit as good players role-playing an evil faction
Best of luck @Megaera - I like your replies and your fight against the usual toxic suspects
I would vote for you to be a GM or a Dev or both actually. Cheers