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+--- Forum: Discovery RP 24/7 General Discussions (https://discoverygc.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?fid=23)
+--- Thread: Keepers (/showthread.php?tid=55383)
Keepers - Akura - 02-21-2011
' Wrote:So what is acceptable? Why is ***(Warmth)*** not ok?
Warmth is a cliche Nomad Term like Darkness and Darkones that Morphs developed somehow because they thought it was how Nomads talked.
Warmth and such are equal to the human RP equivilant of "engaging". It doesn't make any sense, no Nomad would ever say it, and it's misinterpretation of how Nomads should be.
' Wrote:That's basically saying "I dont care about you or your attempts at RP"
Reading only helps lore knowledge.
Not ways to act like a Nomad in game.
No, it's more like saying "You're not ready to be a Keeper yet, you don't understand the fundamentals well enough"
With a small amount of work, it's fixed.
Keepers - AeternusDoleo - 02-21-2011
No, I've never applied. I simply can't figure out how Keeper roleplay works fundamentally so it would be pointless to try.
No, under NO circumstances should Nomad/Wilde gear become public. It is VERY powerful in terms of firepower. If this stuff becomes public usage it'd open up a PvPwhoring can of worms... couple of trolls get together and buy themselves some nomboats, nomcruisers and a nombattleship, and basically frag anything that's thrown at them? Can you imagine a party like that making a system like Dublin unusable for anything but Nomads, repeatedly, only to withdraw one jump to Chester to resupply?
No. Thank. You. Not without a serious rebalance of all nomad ships and weapons.
Keepers - Camtheman - 02-21-2011
Quote: how Nomads should be.
Which is exactly why the Nomad ID -should- be freed.
So there can be a million, bazillion different RP definitions of how a nomad 'should' be RPed.
Nobody. Should. Be. Able. To. Judge. Anothers. RP.
Keepers - Akura - 02-21-2011
' Wrote:So there can be a million, bazillion different RP definitions of how a nomad 'should' be RPed.
Nobody. Should. Be. Able. To. Judge. Anothers. RP.
You're forgetting that Treewyrm made the Nomads playable, as oppose to random Nomad ships being used by everyone.
He made lore that made sense, he invented the modern Nomad RP. He is the one who judges it, because you can't adlib Nomad RP like you can human RP.
Nomads are all connected, and act in a similar fashion, only when you understand the Nomads can you understand that only what Yuri approves can ever be Nomad.
There is a certain way Nomads should be played, their RP is just too special to be made up and adapted by indies. Only following what already exists can indies ever work.
' Wrote:No, I've never applied. I simply can't figure out how Keeper roleplay works fundamentally so it would be pointless to try.
No, under NO circumstances should Nomad/Wilde gear become public. It is VERY powerful in terms of firepower. If this stuff becomes public usage it'd open up a PvPwhoring can of worms... couple of trolls get together and buy themselves some nomboats, nomcruisers and a nombattleship, and basically frag anything that's thrown at them? Can you imagine a party like that making a system like Dublin unusable for anything but Nomads, repeatedly, only to withdraw one jump to Chester to resupply?
No. Thank. You. Not without a serious rebalance of all nomad ships and weapons.
This is why I suggest nothing above Gunboat be put on a public ID. There would be no capspam, as the Nammu is balanced fine, and the fighters are fine. VHF is broken admittedly, and the LF is strange.
The public ID would also only allow the indies to be in the Nomad Worlds, where Nomad NPCs are, they'd only be able to leave that area with Keeper/Wild escort.
This would rebalance the whole Nomad Worlds, making them as dangerous as they should be.
Keepers - Boss - 02-21-2011
' Wrote:Which is exactly why the Nomad ID -should- be freed.
So there can be a million, bazillion different RP definitions of how a nomad 'should' be RPed.
Nobody. Should. Be. Able. To. Judge. Anothers. RP.
There aren't a million, bazillion ways to RP a Nomad.
That's the thing when you're dealing with a bioengineered race of mentally linked critters.
Keepers - Jinx - 02-21-2011
"That's the funny thing.
Nomad gear is balanced.
Now, you might look at the stats and say BS! It's better than X. Very true. However, Nomad equipment is NOT balanced 1:1. It's balanced 1:3 or 1:5, since the overwhelming majority of fights involve massive numbers of opponents." ( Boss )
just to chime in
exactly THAT is the problem. - the balance was done so it is not fair in a 1:1 situation - forcing normal players to "gank". the problem is... no one likes ganks. but one simply does not win a 1:1 against a voidrunner ( lvl10 shields, fastest ship in the entire game, 15.5k power [like a super heavy fighter] torp slot and superior nomad lasers )
plans are that the balance is to be adjusted though. - especially, cause a special faction should "do" special but not "be" special ( statwise )
when a system is balanced 1:3 / 1:5 - it is no wonder to always fight 1 vs. 5 ...
Keepers - Akura - 02-21-2011
' Wrote:just to chime in
exactly THAT is the problem. - the balance was done so it is not fair in a 1:1 situation - forcing normal players to "gank". the problem is... no one likes ganks. but one simply does not win a 1:1 against a voidrunner ( lvl10 shields, fastest ship in the entire game, 15.5k power [like a super heavy fighter] torp slot and superior nomad lasers )
plans are that the balance is to be adjusted though. - especially, cause a special faction should "do" special but not "be" special ( statwise )
when a system is balanced 1:3 / 1:5 - it is no wonder to always fight 1 vs. 5 ...
That's cause the Voidrunner is broken by being too good, and the Assassin is broken by being too bad. And we mix the too.
No gank is nessesary, if 4 Bastet go against 2 Voids and 2 Assassins, it's a fair fight.
You don't need to gank Nomads to win, because the tech has enough weaknesses to combat them.
Voidrunner needs a smaller plant, like a HF, with the torp removed. Then it'll be fine. The Assassin needs a proper, smaller and better hitbox, which it is getting. And the Scorpion shouldn't exist.
Keepers - ryoken - 02-21-2011
' Wrote:The BS itself has a twofold issue:
Bots/bats/armor for its size (it's a HUGE target) and the fact that it has 15 guns that can't shoot more than 3k, while everyone else has 12-22 guns (The Venator has 22 guns, okay?) and can shoot them from 4.5k away and just lol away in a straight line.
Well comparing a ship Only keepers can get,to a ship NO ONE can get is kind of pointless. Venator is not availible on Discovery to anyone but Admins.
Now i see you keep saying Nomad ships have weaknesses,and strong points. Only Keepers will know this,as only Keepers fly them.
Those who think opening nomad gear to all will make gank squads were not around in past. They were open to all,and had restrictions.(wayyyy back in the day) Their was the odd moron who would go into NY,and try to gank,but he would die very fast,or if breaking the restrictions sanctioned just like any other ship's now.
People do make a few good points here. If the ships are balacned 3:1(5:1 hard to believe) then they should be fighting those odds.
Keep up the good points. I am learning alot here.
Keepers - Mao - 02-21-2011
' Wrote:Well, I'd like to see the results.
The main reasons for closed and selective recruitment is,
1. Most Morphs don't 'get' the Keepers, and would end up roleplaying them really, really poorly.
*looks at indie LNS, GRN, etc players that RP very very poorly*
2. Nomad RP is unlike any other RP, it requires practice and some knowledge of Nomad Lore.
*looks at all other lores*
3. Nomad Speech is a pain, and not many people can nail it.
***.. this .. true .. (sadness) ..***
If you do put enough thought and creativity into it, it's not hard to get in, just show you're smart and willing to learn, and take the tips you can get from Keepers.
So, if you apply and you don't get accepted, there are 2 possible reasons:
1. You don't have the imagination. Sure thing...
2. You're stupid. Like... very very stupid for not being able to RP an alien how the Keepers want.
The Keepers are more like a collection of Nomad indies who've been approved to fly, as oppose to a faction.
Skype group chat... check
Seen in groups on the server... check
Have a tag in their name... check
Appear in the "Official Factions" section... check
Hey, look... a faction called Keepers. What a coincidence.
Yeah... and the argument that keeper ships/equipment are OP. Oh please... look at Gallic weapons. They are open to all. As always, my opinion concerning this is:
"Either we have all factions official and no more indies (so, RP story required to play on the server), either we have every equipment from every faction open to indies."
Keepers - AeternusDoleo - 02-21-2011
' Wrote:This is why I suggest nothing above Gunboat be put on a public ID. There would be no capspam, as the Nammu is balanced fine, and the fighters are fine. VHF is broken admittedly, and the LF is strange.The nomad gunboat guns are one of the weapons that are heavily imbalanced. Doing more damage as the Cerberus for 2/3rds the power, and with a projectile speed like standard gunboats - chainfire them and you can wail at fighters indefinately. The nomad gunboat guns do damage like faction cruiser turrets, and you could argue that the gunboat is thus a light destroyer class vessel.
The public ID would also only allow the indies to be in the Nomad Worlds, where Nomad NPCs are, they'd only be able to leave that area with Keeper/Wild escort.
This would rebalance the whole Nomad Worlds, making them as dangerous as they should be.
Nomad fighters are excessively agile and therefor hard to bring down when used in numbers.
Both these issues need to be sorted before any of these ships should go public. Balancing something for 5:1 is fine and dandy, until you end up with issues where there's 5 powerships present - and you don't have the 25 players to counteract this.