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+--- Thread: Quickdocking, boon or bane? (/showthread.php?tid=76747)
Quickdocking, boon or bane? - Ninefour - 03-20-2012
It would ruin my pirate fighting and base running in transports so... NO.
Quickdocking, boon or bane? - Diomedes - 03-20-2012
In terms of base defenses, they need to be able to hit a raiding bomber first of all. Most of the automated defenses in the game can be fooled by standing still and strafing left-right, let alone boxing and evading. I'm not sure if improving this is possible however, except for making the bases shoot more or less steady death streams that only need to hit a couple times. Currently, if you're paying attention you could fly around outside Manhattan with a Rogue ID'd Starflea and the bases/NPCs would never kill you unless you sat still. And I'm including the cap patrols.
The problem then with current defenses, becomes the same as escorts. Vessel gets stuck in docking queue. Bomber swarm which should, inRP, be engaged by defending snubcraft and wiped from space by defensive cannons proceed to dodge/snac until docking vessel is dead, taking no damage themselves.
On top of this, most base defenses do hardly any damage. Anything with a class 10 fighter shield won't blink at a handful of hits and freighter shields can ignore many bases. Stationary battleships tend to be better in terms of damage.
Quickdocking, boon or bane? - AeternusDoleo - 03-20-2012
Valid points so far. Let me address a few questions/concerns:
- Jumpholes not able to take certain craft could be limited to specific jumpholes. Plugging up every Outcast and Corsair capship in their respective homes wouldn't do anyone any good. But I frankly do not see a reason why battleships would be using the New Berlin - Sigma 13 hole to give an example. Or transports for that matter. Same deal with the Omicron Minor / Alaska hole. Specific "big shortcut" holes could thus be limited to smaller craft, creating viable runs for freighters and easy avenues of escape for pirate raiders who are fleeing from caps. Which I wager will be more fun to fly then transports. And yes, unlawfuls blowing up a freighter could likely snatch that loot for themselves...
- Base defenses: Not really put much thought into this one yet, but a mix of pulse cannons, light guns that more or less resemble standard Solaris, and one or two heavy hitters with firepower comparable to a battleship primary (depends on -what- base too, a tiny outpost has less firepower then a huge freeport model) should give most bases a bit of allround firepower. Solaris to take on bombers and snubs straying too close, pulse and heavies to take on anything else. But nothing is certain yet on this subject.
- Models with docking issues fall outside of the scope of this. Touketsu was bugged and is fixed in update 4. If any other big ships are difficult to dock due to their docking point not being at the forward area please report those as model bugs.
- "Or docking at Buffalo Base in a slave liner (which happens often), there are certain large asteroids in the way, making it difficult for the AI to align the ship properly, and it often needs several attempts before being able to dock. That can take a good few minutes." -> Stuff like this needs to be reported as a system bug. It just means the exclusion zone around that base is a bit too small, all of a minute of work to adjust that.
Quickdocking, boon or bane? - Ursus - 03-20-2012
' Wrote:I frankly do not see a reason why battleships would be using the New Berlin - Sigma 13 hole to give an example. Or transports for that matter. Same deal with the Omicron Minor / Alaska hole.Because its fun to try and run sidearms from detroit t dabadou in a transport without getting destroyed by navy and/or nomads and/or corsairs. Slowest ship class with worst weapons... are you man enough?
Quickdocking, boon or bane? - SA_Scavenger - 03-20-2012
I'm all for adding new JHs for freighters and raiders only but cutting existing JHs from transports kinda sticks it to smugglers.
Quickdocking, boon or bane? - Gman513 - 03-20-2012
To be honest, after seeing some of the upgrades the discovery team has pulled off already I have full faith that they can pull this off and improve the game greatly. Of course if they go through with this they will have to make capships unable to go through asteroid fields. No more slash stucking. And for all the miners, just get a new base outside the field and use smaller transports to move the stuff to a base outside the field where a larger ship could take it from you. That in itself would improve RP and cooperation.
Quickdocking, boon or bane? - Jack_Henderson - 03-20-2012
I think many do not see the consequences: A drastic shift in balance away from the group that is already the group beaten up worst: Transports
Transports turn slowly.
Transports can be bumped out of the docking process.
Transports take forever to correct a docking approach.
Transports are already weak.
This adds another 30 seconds or with a few bumps a minute to the ordeal of trying to get away from an attacker.
So... devs say:
> Transports should not fight off enemies.
> Transports should not cruise away (no cms on most serious transports)
Now another strike:
> Transports should not be able to dock when they make it under fire to a base? For surviving 30 k, you need a CAU6-8 and a combat transport. And even then it can be a close run! Now add 30 seconds under fire and you will hardly ever make it.
Sorry, this is a very very bad idea. Why?
It hurts the "food basis" that all activity is linked to. Less trader, less pirates, less lawfuls, etc...
It puts the weakest group with the worst chances of making it (and the highest risk when not making it) yet at another disadvantage!
It will dramatically increase the QQ because traders will very often die very close to the docking port. That hurts especially. More QQ.
Quickdocking, boon or bane? - Stefan - 03-20-2012
Very solid points. I stopped to think about it and something occurred to me... What exactly happens when someone docks? The ship poofs, okay, but did it cloak? Did the station shields got extended over it? Its ok to say a fighter got inside the cargo bay, but theres no way to convince me capships can simply DOCK inside anywhere.
Quickdocking, boon or bane? - Mr.Broke - 03-20-2012
I accidently voted no (don't ask) when it should been "Yes, Keep the current setup"
as a example :
when a scout VHF leaves Java in T-23 going to Kyushu via the JH, and there are caps and cruisers on the other side, how are the caps in T-23 supposed to help that scout? TL 2 systems around to Kyushu?
another one :
When the GRN pull a very heavy invasion force invades Leeds, BAF calling for LN support, is the LN supposed to TL 4 systems (CA-Cortez-Manchester-NL-Leeds) instead of only 2 systems currently? (CA-Magellan-Leeds)
*edit*
yet another Example :
when the LN are in TX and RM are in Hamburg. the RM moves to Bering and LN moves to Hudson, what are they supposed to do? LN back up and then RM backs up and were back to square one. currently they'd both go to the opposing JH to see who can wait for the other or catch the other off guard
Quickdocking, boon or bane? - Stefan - 03-20-2012
Yea. I voted maybe, but now I'm really inclined to say I'd like it to stay how it is.