+- Discovery Gaming Community (https://discoverygc.com/forums)
+-- Forum: Discovery General (https://discoverygc.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?fid=3)
+--- Forum: Discovery RP 24/7 General Discussions (https://discoverygc.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?fid=23)
+--- Thread: Corsair - Zoner (/showthread.php?tid=73664)
Corsair - Zoner - spikefin - 02-09-2012
oops multi post
**removed**
Corsair - Zoner - spikefin - 02-09-2012
' Wrote:So by your logics that should go for lawful forces too:DNewsflash, it doesn't work like that
You have a valid point, As I said, It was a "how to be a pirate" post. I have no fodder to discuss that further atm. Ill look around a bit.
' Wrote:Corsair law was already enforced and has been enforced within Theta for .......a very long time.
Hmm, Granted ive only been playing again for 6 weeks, but that whole six weeks ive had a zoner fearless in theta. Before the "Blow up" I never even got told there was an issue with my presence. I also used it to take food to crete everyday, because... well... I have a fearless, They want food, And to be honest never once had an issue before the blow up.
My shootings from corsairs were when I ventured for an explore into lower sirus. and Outcasts in Tau.
(I also was silly enougth not to read the rules of the area i spend all my time in, or I may have addressed the food part differently.) If I had read the rules, It would have given even more room for player interaction with the corsairs, Since i would need a transport to meet me at there JH.
Corsair - Zoner - Mímir - 02-09-2012
Yes I shall not hijack the thread.
Anyway why don't you Zoners just form a council and set some minimum standards you can agree on and get this overwith?
There is a distinct lack of accountability, borderlining the point where any relations to Zoners as a whole is nonsensical. I don't know if I should say "hey pal" or fire my guns when I see you, because you all represent so many different things and have different rules and whatnot, while still sharing the same entry in the repsheet + ID. The guy I treat as my friend might just be aligned against my faction to the point of hostility, the NFZ I counted on might not exist and so on and so forth.
Also cut back on the caps (or make sure they are 100% unfit for waging wars) - you got some really nice models, but the Zoner "fleet" is ridiculously oversized and full of lollers with an unlimited ZOI.
Corsair - Zoner - spikefin - 02-09-2012
' Wrote:Yes I shall not hijack the thread.
Anyway why don't you Zoners just form a council and set some minimum standards you can agree on and get this overwith?
There is a distinct lack of accountability, borderlining the point where any relations to Zoners as a whole is nonsensical. I don't know if I should say "hey pal" or fire my guns when I see you, because you all represent so many different things and have different rules and whatnot, while still sharing the same entry in the repsheet + ID. The guy I treat as my friend might just be aligned against my faction to the point of hostility, the NFZ I counted on might not exist and so on and so forth.
Also cut back on the caps (or make sure they are 100% unfit for waging wars) - you got some really nice models, but the Zoner "fleet" is ridiculously oversized and full of lollers with an unlimited ZOI.
TBH I see as many caps af other factions as I do zoners. And find me sheilds 5x as powerful as anyone elses, and ill take weapons 5x less powerful than any others. But thats my personal opinion I do think the guns have a negative impact on Neutral RP, But so do other people shooting at me Hence why I choose a fearless, Its not huge, It moves very well, and it puts off most one on one pew pew encounters. Which I always lose since I wont (At this stage) Fire on any player, even in self defence, thats just the way I like it.
I think it was only up there i mentioned my support for the reapplication of NFZ;s with clear uniformed rules, a clear reasoning behind it (The protect our civiys works best IMO)
If there was a "Zoner" faction, I would join it, and maybe get a say, But as nice as taz are... They are TAZ whos actions make them zoners by definition IMO of course. And The trade guys, They may be alright, they apear to have an issue with there spaceship comms from my experiance so I don't know, But if i wanted to trade, Id be a trader, as another faction trader recently said to me.
"This job would be soooo very boring without the pirates"
The "(]o[)"s well I stopped reading there stuff as soon as I saw zoner and militaristic in the same sentence.
And as much as I support a "council" everyone seems very opposed to it, and its often referenced "oorp killed it" and also referenced often is the corsairs dislike the council, Im sure theres more to it than that, but that appears to be the base.
Corsair - Zoner - Dane Summers - 02-09-2012
' Wrote:The real question one has to ask oneself is how come it didn't happen before?
Big beautiful planet hanging in the middle of nowhere, somehow gets colonized and completely taken over by the Zoners before the Corsairs.
And wtf is up with everybody and their mother getting planets?
GC, Zoners, HF, SCRA, GMG Samura, Colonial Republic, The Order.... (and those are just the ones with no planet in vanilla)
anybody who bloody wants a planet gets one, except the Corsairs.
I know, right? Truth being, Bretonia should have claimed GC a long time ago, or at least given all the zoner squatters the boot = or how about the Molly's - O49 should be a battle ground between Molly's and Corsairs.
The Corsairs should be fighting everyone everywhere for GC, since it can single-handedly usher in a new golden age for the Corsairs. My thought it, the Corsairs don't have any other planets because they dont want any other planets - Crete has forged corsair society for centuries - what happens should the corsairs shift to GC? once everyone has all they need, they'll get soft.
Keep in mind, the Outcasts don't have any other planets either, although thats really because they can't survive without good ol'e vitamin orange.
' Wrote:Anyway why don't you Zoners just form a council and set some minimum standards you can agree on and get this overwith?
Nobody liked it when we were united, and now no one likes it when were not - jesus christ Disco, make up your effing minds.
And even if we do unite, doesn't mean we'll automatically bend over for the corsairs or anyone else. Zoner unity doesn't mean you get what you want. It just means we speak with a louder voice.
' Wrote:There is a distinct lack of accountability, borderlining the point where any relations to Zoners as a whole is nonsensical. I don't know if I should say "hey pal" or fire my guns when I see you, because you all represent so many different things and have different rules and whatnot, while still sharing the same entry in the repsheet + ID. The guy I treat as my friend might just be aligned against my faction to the point of hostility, the NFZ I counted on might not exist and so on and so forth.
Oh hell, now your just being alarmist.
Here's the tip man, and listen up. Zoner's don't have friends. We have some factions we like, and that they like us - but we dont push until were pushed. Whether your a dumb ass pirate knocking over a whale full of refugee's, or a horde of bully's wanting to impose laws - we'll wait for you to make the first move. Why? because were a group of people that want to be left alone - and if thats true, why would we go stirring trouble first?
Every zoner you meet will say hi, kalliste, or greetings, or at the very least, nothing at all.
' Wrote:Also cut back on the caps (or make sure they are 100% unfit for waging wars) - you got some really nice models, but the Zoner "fleet" is ridiculously oversized and full of lollers with an unlimited ZOI.
Zone of Influence is paltry, and only really effects a couple systems. But were free to wander everywhere but Gallia, and Corsair turf.
Caps cant go into house space, and regardless, by ID, we can only act in self defense.
As well, I can guarantee you, that for as many lol'zoner caps there are, there at least three times more in the corsairs - or outcasts. Or LN.
Corsair - Zoner - Mímir - 02-09-2012
Problem is, Zoner caps are places they shouldn't be more often than not with the extremely generous ZOI, and when you kindly inform lolcappilots that they should turn around and leave, you can expect a sea of flames in return about how they are on an important scientific mission and how ppl cannot roleplay etc. etc. - I personally had that happen to me on several occations when I had an OC dread patrolling alpha and intercepted zoner caps full of nomad remains and lolpilots on "scientific missions" not really spending time reading up on why they shouldnt be hauling nomads in OC territory and flaming me like mad for shooting them up after giving them every chance to drop their cargo and turn around. I see Zoner caps in Liberty quite often as well. They are all over the place, when they really ought to stay in the omegas/sigmas/omicrons IMO. And with no accountability whatsoever, nothing can ever be done about this nuissance.
I think it would be really cool if Zoners maintained their neutrality through diplomacy/people skills/dialogue instead of capships.
I dont see the big problem in setting minimum standards and provide some form of accountability and uniformity - like every other faction on this server do - while still providing a high level of freedom.
Also why do you need warships to roleplay your part?
Edit: True OC and Corsair has lots of lollers, difference is OC is placed so far out of the way that lolcappilots cant really do any damage, and the Corsairs have worked really hard on disciplining their pilots. Because they choose to take responsibility and are accountable...
Corsair - Zoner - spikefin - 02-09-2012
' Wrote:I know, right? Truth being, Bretonia should have claimed GC a long time ago, or at least given all the zoner squatters the boot = or how about the Molly's - O49 should be a battle ground between Molly's and Corsairs.
The Corsairs should be fighting everyone everywhere for GC, since it can single-handedly usher in a new golden age for the Corsairs. My thought it, the Corsairs don't have any other planets because they dont want any other planets - Crete has forged corsair society for centuries - what happens should the corsairs shift to GC? once everyone has all they need, they'll get soft.
Keep in mind, the Outcasts don't have any other planets either, although thats really because they can't survive without good ol'e vitamin orange.
Nobody liked it when we were united, and now no one likes it when were not - jesus christ Disco, make up your effing minds.
And even if we do unite, doesn't mean we'll automatically bend over for the corsairs or anyone else. Zoner unity doesn't mean you get what you want. It just means we speak with a louder voice.
Oh hell, now your just being alarmist.
Here's the tip man, and listen up. Zoner's don't have friends. We have some factions we like, and that they like us - but we dont push until were pushed. Whether your a dumb ass pirate knocking over a whale full of refugee's, or a horde of bully's wanting to impose laws - we'll wait for you to make the first move. Why? because were a group of people that want to be left alone - and if thats true, why would we go stirring trouble first?
Every zoner you meet will say hi, kalliste, or greetings, or at the very least, nothing at all.
Zone of Influence is paltry, and only really effects a couple systems. But were free to wander everywhere but Gallia, and Corsair turf.
Caps cant go into house space, and regardless, by ID, we can only act in self defense.
As well, I can guarantee you, that for as many lol'zoner caps there are, there at least three times more in the corsairs - or outcasts. Or LN.
See people like you make me wonder if im playing zoner very wrong, Although your being defensive in your post, You make good sence about zoners potential to fight. I had this weird idea, After reading cannon lore.
"But Zoners had neither enough time, nor a real need to concentrate on developing military power, although they have always been able to develop technology to be among the best Sirius has ever seen. Their love for freedom and individual occupations as well as the wide spread areas they were living in never allowed the foundation of a common military organization. "
So, Now its getting official Corsairs are forcing us into a smaller space, and inRP TAZ and other factions have offered the refugee zoners home, and since the Corsair "TBH" Bought hostilities against us, and pushed our hand to leave our freeports (Apart from gaurdians) Dosn't this give us an opertunity in RP to
A) Have enougth time, We just got booted outta home, What else shall we do?
B) A real need, Weve been forced out, and we want our home back.
C) The technology the best sirus has ever seen.
Widespread area? two place's of rest and supplies in a chunck of sirus have been taken from us forcibly, Our area shrunk.
And lets face it, We have been attacked, They forced us back, This = Hostility, we have the theoretical right to defend, The fact we back off and let it appear inconsequential while we work on a superior retaliation, With far superior technology......
Id say its a revenge thing, But... well it would be from Brian Harris Pilot of .:Z:.Anihilator.
' Wrote:Problem is, Zoner caps are places they shouldn't be more often than not with the extremely generous ZOI, and when you kindly inform lolcappilots that they should turn around and leave, you can expect a sea of flames in return about how they are on an important scientific mission and how ppl cannot roleplay etc. etc. - I personally had that happen to me on several occations when I had an OC dread patrolling alpha and intercepted zoner caps full of nomad remains and lolpilots on "scientific missions" not really spending time reading up on why they shouldnt be hauling nomads in OC territory and flaming me like mad for shooting them up after giving them every chance to drop their cargo and turn around. I see Zoner caps in Liberty quite often as well. They are all over the place, when they really ought to stay in the omegas/sigmas/omicrons IMO. And with no accountability whatsoever, nothing can ever be done about this nuissance.
I think it would be really cool if Zoners maintained their neutrality through diplomacy/people skills/dialogue instead of capships.
I dont see the big problem in setting minimum standards and provide some form of accountability and uniformity - like every other faction on this server do - while still providing a high level of freedom.
Also why do you need warships to roleplay your part?
Edit: True OC and Corsair has lots of lollers, difference is OC is placed so far out of the way that lolcappilots cant really do any damage, and the Corsairs have worked really hard on disciplining their pilots. Because they choose to take responsibility and are accountable...
Ok, excluding the fact they shouldn't be there, What harm were these caps doing? Ohh, they had nomad remains... Im sure those nomad remains were properly isolated no? Factions all over use "proper isolation" in RP when talking about nomads.
So nomad remains in your region of space is intolerable, its a nono, and you accept no RP that may allow it.
Thats absolutely fine, Its your POV, and your entitled to it BUT...
If they flew a transport full of nomad remains wouldn't it upset you just as much? Isn't the fact its a cap ship only a small part.
Also why do you need warships to roleplay your part?
Already said this, So theres less random "pewpew's" that shoot me up. I haven't (pre the blowup) Had any RP players have issue with my ship for what it is, Most have allowed me to continue even with contested cargo (Usually a few peices) Weather i was were i shouldn't be (Because i didn't read specific rules) Or I had a bounty hunter pilot in my hold (He was left in space after Corsairs destroyed some ships, I was returning him home)
The nomad remains sometimes in my hold... Go sit outside some FP's, just sit there for 2 hours, then press "B" and wholla, the hold is full of namad remains. Now those nomad remains need to be disposed of, And the FP dosnt accept nomad remains, So a trip is required, That trip crosses a large amount of space, If it was not RP, I wouldn't have only a few dozen, And i wouldn't use a fearless with its minute hold, Id buy me a half the price transporter.
Roleplay is exactly that, we play a role, The laws about caps in house, Don't i understand that as a security measure? I heard courts has metal detectors for security, no knives or guns allowed, yet, Knives and guns are allowed in daily for all types of reasons, This is called an exemption.
Corsair - Zoner - DarthBindo - 02-09-2012
' Wrote:The Corsairs should be fighting everyone everywhere for GC, since it can single-handedly usher in a new golden age for the Corsairs.We get this much QQ for shooting zoners over hessians and mercs docking off their freeports.
Wtf do you think would happen if we started an invasion of GC?
The flames and qq and whine would reach a critical mass, transitioning into a black hole of zoners whinging about being shot and corsairs being so oorp and bullies and we're such jerks and we should all lose our caps, eventualyl culminating in an extinction-level event.
So, um, no thanks.
And that's not even to mention the super-alliance that would form for GOOD AND JUSTIS.
We'd draw in every faction from across Sirius who thinks themselves the arbiter of righteousness (which factions those would be i think i have explained to you), and that's in addition to the factions already in the Omegas that we are hostile to.
So we'd face a Zoner-Hessian-Molly-BAF-RM-BH-SCRA-Order-Reaver-MM-Outcast-IMG super alliance(and those are just the ones i KNOW would show up, we could probably add in VR-CR-Council-Gaian officials-LWB and be safe), plus a few dozen independent mercs or so.
once again, no thanks, the Hessian-molly-RM-SCRA-Reaver-MM alliance is already way too many players for us to handle.
' Wrote:My thought it, the Corsairs don't have any other planets because they dont want any other planets - Crete has forged corsair society for centuries - what happens should the corsairs shift to GC? once everyone has all they need, they'll get soft.srsly dude, we send every man in unshielded ships into a giant radioactive cloud filled with nomads and bunters waiting to kill them, just to prove they are a man.
This is done to control the population to the point we can actually feed them.
Those that aren't killed outright, get cancer, or go sterile are the parents of the next generation of Corsairs.
I can assure you, as far as any corsair is concerned, Crete can go and rot in peace like the dirty red irradiated ball of crappy farming soil it is.
But it's the only planet we got, so......
It's home.
Corsair - Zoner - Mímir - 02-09-2012
But don't forget that this problem could have been solved if there was a level of leadership, unity and accountability before it got out of hand. It could have been solved even before there really was an issue. The Zoners-who-just-wants-to-be-left-alone were pretty quick to pick up guns, throw any form of diplomacy overboard and go on a holy war (in a rather unholy alliance in-game). Really shouldn't diplomacy and not warmongering be the Zoners strong suit?
The philosophy behind the Zoner Whale should be the model for the entire Zoner faction IMO.
Corsair - Zoner - Dane Summers - 02-09-2012
' Wrote:I think it would be really cool if Zoners maintained their neutrality through diplomacy/people skills/dialogue instead of capships.
I dont see the big problem in setting minimum standards and provide some form of accountability and uniformity - like every other faction on this server do - while still providing a high level of freedom.
Also why do you need warships to roleplay your part?
I'm one of the few Zoner's who would get rid of our cap line in a heartbeat. We don't need them, and they don't make sense. It's even been stated that the zoners only have a cap line because of beautiful models that needed a place - it was an oorp thing.
As for maintaining neutrality and diplomacy with words? Yes, when it works. Pretty words wont get your everywhere, with everyone, and when that happens, you back it up. It's like chess, you back a piece, with a piece. Back up words with action, and neutrality with the potential to defend yourself should words fail. Otherwise, you have no one to blame when things fall through, and you get killed.
Si vis pacem, parabellum.
' Wrote:But don't forget that this problem could have been solved if there was a level of leadership, unity and accountability before it got out of hand. It could have been solved even before there really was an issue.
Hindsight being 20\20, but otherwise I agree. To an extent.
' Wrote:The Zoners-who-just-wants-to-be-left-alone were pretty quick to pick up guns, throw any form of diplomacy overboard and go on a holy war (in a rather unholy alliance in-game). Really shouldn't diplomacy and not warmongering be the Zoners strong suit?
It is, until diplomacy fails.
Walk softly and carry a big stick.
It's idealism to think that words will solve every problem. And what the corsairs want isn't words, it's actions - actions dictated by them.
We dont push until were pushed
' Wrote:The philosophy behind the Zoner Whale should be the model for the entire Zoner faction IMO.
Pacifism is an idealistic notion that only produces victims