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+--- Thread: Rheinland and Liberty (/showthread.php?tid=18489)
Rheinland and Liberty - Ceoran - 03-28-2009
Well, If it comes to the lawfuls only, Rheinland needs more numbers, but Military + Hessians would make the numerical advantage of Liberty vanish. Plus the Rheinland factions are more experienced in combat, so I think Liberty will bleed like hell in whatever Rheinland system they try to get in.
But I doubt the Hessians will support any offensive movements of the military, so I think the war won't move much out of the border systems. I voted that Rheinland would win the war, but winning the war from the Rheinland point of view is in my opinion only to defend their borders, not to rush into Liberty.
And as I've already seen some WW2-comparisons I'll give some numbers for the people that think Rheinland is a Sirius version of the 3. Reich (though I still don't side with that opinion):
Losses Axis: about 5 millions
Losses Allies: about 15 millions
... So for all "Rheinlanders are fascists": Liberty has the numbers to fight 2 houses? Rheinland has the experience to beat 3...
edit: yes, I'm biased.
Rheinland and Liberty - Mastermind - 03-28-2009
Voted Rheinland on both.
They lack players, most of the RM are either camping planet New Berlin or capwhores, with also camp planet New Berlin.
On the victory part,
Rheinland will win, if there is going to be a victory anyway. Rheinland has a lot more experience in combat in their past, and have learned a lot in each fight. Their experience and Liberties arrogance will bring Rheinland victory.
Rheinland and Liberty - Xing - 03-28-2009
What experience and which arrogance? A humiliating 80 years war defeat?
Rheinland is -certainly- more arrogant than Liberty as well. They bought this war upon themselves by refusing to pay tax and augment their military effort instead in an open act of defiance against Liberty.
Liberty has, arguably, the largest starfleet of all time, with seasonned troops who fight in the Alaska sector against nomads and Order (duno if they still kill each other really), and who faces off a powerful outcast alliance.
Rheinland' experience would come from majorly the Red Hessian, the Wilde, and the Corsairs. I might be wrong, but there are no outcast presence in rheinland except in the form of players.
Rheinland had to recently rush the rebuilding of their entire fleet.
Liberty... has been increasing their fleet at normal rate. The LABC description seems to suggest they were already readying for this eventuality since a little while already. The Libertonian arsenal and Rheinland arsenal both are immense, and their quality, comparable... although the rheinlander does have a very effective capkiller, I believe the RM has no intention on using it and will mostly be left in the hands of indies. But indies seem mostly wandering about in cruisers and battleships from what I've seen... which is somewhat despairing.
Rheinland and Liberty - Cellulanus - 03-28-2009
Another thing, the gigantic Rheinland fleet the Nomads made was built using Rheinland shipyards and resources being set up in a matter of months, they did this by overclocking production on all levels and I'm sure they could do it again if it came to it, on a lower scale then they did under the Nomads granted but it would still be quite the turn out.
Also as for Libertys advanced alien technology, Rheinland has been working on acquiring Nomad technology for years now behind the scene, the expedition that found the live Nomads was only one of many and due to the fact that they have two research stations that seem to have the study of Nomads on their mandate indicate that they did find something useful.
Quote:although the rheinlander does have a very effective capkiller, I believe the RM has no intention on using it and will mostly be left in the hands of indies. But indies seem mostly wandering about in cruisers and battleships from what I've seen... which is somewhat despairing.
You are very mistaken here, many RM, myself included, fly this ship.
Rheinland and Liberty - Ceoran - 03-28-2009
Yes, there is no outcast presence in Rheinland. The reason is following to rumors an agreement between them and the red hessians. To get their assistance against the Corsairs they had to promise to stay out of Rheinland, especially not smuggling cardamine there.
But I myself would consider the main strength of the outcasts concentrated in the omicrons and only a few raiders and smugglers down in Liberty.
I think not to pay Liberty any more is a very reasonable reaction on being abused for a long time and has nothing to do with arrogance. Despite this, in my understanding the war started because of Libertys intentions in Hudson and Bering and not because of money. That's just a bad excuse from Liberty.
Rheinland and Liberty - Xing - 03-28-2009
I hear the war started because the Rheinland Military made an incursion within Libertonian system. On the other hand, I've never seens anywhere anything about Bering and Hudson.
The abuse as well has been bought upon Rheinland by its own bad management of economy. So, by going for a militaristic approach instead of paying due debts (bought to themselves by the 80 years war), they are showing immense arrogance.
Rheinland and Liberty - Alehandro - 03-28-2009
I think Liberty needs more good pilots, but Rheinland will win
But it's only my point of view...
Rheinland and Liberty - RedEclipse - 03-28-2009
Quote:I hear the war started because the Rheinland Military made an incursion within Libertonian system. On the other hand, I've never seens anywhere anything about Bering and Hudson.Check a news in Rheinland bars "Rheinland Under Threat"
Rheinland and Liberty - BaconSoda - 03-28-2009
' Wrote:The LR will work with anyone if it gets them cash, that is all they care about. As for the war, i believe liberty is going to win. Lets face some facts here, yes liberty doesn't have allot of resource fields, but what they lack in that they more than make up with the fact that have several pieces of technology that no other house can get its hands on. Gate/lane parts for instance, if in the war against rheinland liberty decides to take on the lanes and gates, rheinland wouldn't be able to repair them because only DSE and Ageira know how to do that.
You forget that Libertonian greed goes beyond anything in any other house. DSE and Interspace have their hands everywhere, and continue to operate in area that are hostile (Tau-23) and places that have an immense dislike for them (Hokkaido). DSE might not be able to ship through Bering and Hudson, but they'll still ship things through Bretonia, just like Kusari shippers will ship things to Liberty through the Sigmas. Freistadt (One of the main consumers of lane parts near Rheinland) is also in an independent world. If Liberty did ban sale of Gate/Lane parts to Rheinland completely, Interspace (Having a big hand in Freistadt) could more than easily pop by and get some.
' Wrote:As for kusari joining in to attack liberty, that to is something i don't see happening. If kusari does that, they openly show that they support rheinland, and i am pretty sure the GMG wouldn't be happy about it. If the GMG then erects a blockade of its own between rheinland and kusari, what i think they would surely do, kusari would lose all access to foreign trade, as they are fighting liberty and bretonia, GMG blockading trade with rheinland. In other words, the end of the kusari war machine, as i am quite sure bretonia would then be able to push back kusari forces due to lack of reinforcements on the kusari side.
The question of this is, though, why would Kusari do this? Liberty is currently neutral to them, and as Liberty is a large consumer of Samura luxury foods and other such products, I don't think Kusari would ever take any military action against Liberty. To do so would just be...Dumb....
Furthermore, the GMG wouldn't hurt Kusari at all, ever. If they did that, they too would become useless and impotent. They need Kusari like the rest of Sirius needs them. Without Kusari, they can't ship their H-Fuel, and they will die out like Kusari would without any trade partners. To think otherwise is just...Silly.
' Wrote:Just an idea, if Rheinland was so superior on the ground, with the tanks and all, what would stop Liberty battleships, to bombard the planets?
Energy weapons die out quickly in atmospheres? Good question, but, it might be considered immoral. The Corsairs doing it to the Mollys is one thing, but a civilized house vaporizing a planet is another...
Rheinland and Liberty - Cellulanus - 03-29-2009
' Wrote:Just an idea, if Rheinland was so superior on the ground, with the tanks and all, what would stop Liberty battleships, to bombard the planets?
Can you imagine the controversy? Both of the other houses would get on Libertys back and news reports would fire it up at and the result would be a fair deal of civil unrest and opposition to the war I'd imagine, just like what would happen if the US just destroyed a city in Iraq.