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+--- Thread: Are outcast cap ships now open to any ID? (/showthread.php?tid=8711)
Are outcast cap ships now open to any ID? - podcof - 05-23-2008
well there is no point in arguing this. you have said your piece and the we have said ours....so we disagree. if what the 101st is doing is wrong a ooRP then they will be addressed by the admins.
but wether or not you or anyone else agrees with this or not, doesnt matter, were going to keep doing what were doing until were told to stop by an admin. and i dont see that happening soon, so get used to it or deal.
so keep calling us fascists, pvp whores, or "dancing indians", or whatever nothing is going to change.
Are outcast cap ships now open to any ID? - Jihadjoe - 05-23-2008
All the same... if these people keep getting shunted around then they might realise that pvp whoring isn't a good move.
The RM has rather good capships at its disposal, and you don't see many of them do you... why? 'cos they are policed.
And here is the other thing... Since we have done this I have actualy watched three cruisers dock on malta and palermo and switch their cruiser for a sabre and falcatas. Now if that ain't progress I don't know what is...
they none of them had RP stories for their ships, and they all said... "You're right, these capships must take a massive amount of resources to run, they shouldn't just be flaoting around doing nothing..." "I don't want to write a story about my ship, lets get a fighter instead"
Edit: Ok I may well have slightly edited the words said there in order to suit my tone, however it was words to that effect.
Are outcast cap ships now open to any ID? - AdamantineFist - 05-23-2008
' Wrote:You have no real evidence, and are ignoring logic to support a powergrab that isn't needed to begin with based on the evidence you haven't provided.
I think you have it backwards. You're ignoringour logic, buddy. Blunt, Eppy, and JihadJoe have given marvelous, logical arguments, and you have completely ignored them. So have other people. Guess who's been around longer than you, seen the effect that these restrictions make, and seen it happen not once, but several times? These people who have been trying to explain the situation to you, that's who!
EFIT: Actually, you seem to be describing yourself there...
Are outcast cap ships now open to any ID? - bluntpencil2001 - 05-23-2008
' Wrote:That's evidence that it doesn't work, that the same problem players, if they exist at all, are still there.
If there is an oorp capship player in an outcast cruiser and you force him into a BH BC, you have accomplished zero.
The other thing is that the OC destroyer has a rep of being the most powerful destroyer, so the lack of these people flying a Bretonia cruiser for instance (which is a poor fighting platform as cruisers go), is not evidence.
You have no real evidence, and are ignoring logic to support a powergrab that isn't needed to begin with based on the evidence you haven't provided.
No, I'm saying everyone should follow this example. You're twisting my words to say what you want, attributing the worst intent to them, which I do believe is poor form in a debate, too, if that's the game you're playing.
Are outcast cap ships now open to any ID? - sovereign - 05-23-2008
Don't mind if I drive this home.
' Wrote:All the same... if these people keep getting shunted around then they might realise that pvp whoring isn't a good move.
The RM has rather good capships at its disposal, and you don't see many of them do you... why? 'cos they are policed.
And here is the other thing... Since we have done this I have actualy watched three cruisers dock on malta and palermo and switch their cruiser for a sabre and falcatas. Now if that ain't progress I don't know what is...
they none of them had RP stories for their ships, and they all said... "You're right, these capships must take a massive amount of resources to run, they shouldn't just be flaoting around doing nothing..." "I don't want to write a story about my ship, lets get a fighter instead"
Edit: Ok I may well have slightly edited the words said there in order to suit my tone, however it was words to that effect.
Read it. Then read it again. Telling us that it doesn't work is like saying that because you aren't sweating there is no global warming. Its you vs. everyone, and I trust everyone. Bye now.
Are outcast cap ships now open to any ID? - Akumabito - 05-23-2008
' Wrote:All the same... if these people keep getting shunted around then they might realise that pvp whoring isn't a good move.
And they might not, if so called pvp whoring in caps is what they like to do, then that's what they will do absent actual sanctions.
' Wrote:The RM has rather good capships at its disposal, and you don't see many of them do you... why? 'cos they are policed.
Actually I've seen at least one rhiendland BS, but the RM ships aren't that good. The BS is tough but can't use trade lanes, a crippling drawback, and I haven't tried any others but if the other house ships serve as an example they have crippling blind spots that the OC and BH ships don't suffer from.
And that's still beside the point. This restriction won't reduce problem players because they still have options. Plus at the root of this I haven't seen any evidence that there is a problem to begin with.
Are outcast cap ships now open to any ID? - bluntpencil2001 - 05-23-2008
' Wrote:And they might not, if so called pvp whoring in caps is what they like to do, then that's what they will do absent actual sanctions.
Actually I've seen at least one rhiendland BS, but the RM ships aren't that good. The BS is tough but can't use trade lanes, a crippling drawback, and I haven't tried any others but if the other house ships serve as an example they have crippling blind spots that the OC and BH ships don't suffer from.
And that's still beside the point. This restriction won't reduce problem players because they still have options. Plus at the root of this I haven't seen any evidence that there is a problem to begin with.
The Rheinland Cruiser is pretty strong, one of the better ones. The gunboat is good too. They both lack blindspots. Anyway, Outcast ships shouldn't be using TLs either.
Are outcast cap ships now open to any ID? - Akumabito - 05-23-2008
' Wrote:Don't mind if I drive this home.
Drive what home? The complete lack of evidence that these restrictions do anything positive?
The facts are there exists no evidence that this power grab does anything at all to improve the server. Lets spell it out for you since you are not following.
1. Player X likes to PvP in his cap ship without RP (we'll assume he actually exists even though there is no evidence)
2. You drive Player X out of that cap ship (again we'll assume, even though there is no evidence of this either)
So, your case depends on Player X suddenly, at this point, having some catharsis, his very nature changes and he gives up cap ship whoring.
Isn't it more likely that he simply buys another cap ship that is less restricted? That's what suits his nature, right?
So logically, this power grab seems likely to be completely ineffective, because it hasn't addressed the root of the problem, which is Player X's nature.
And in fact the evidence (even though you haven't provided any real evidence) of the observation that there are more outcast cap ship whores (whatever that is) than rhiendland cap ship whores tends to prove that these type of problem players don't go away, they simply move.
In fact, if you think about it, this power grab, if successful, is likely to fill sig 13 with bounty hunter cap ships, which could make things worse than ever.
It seems like at best this a poorly though out knee jerk reaction.
Are outcast cap ships now open to any ID? - bluntpencil2001 - 05-23-2008
' Wrote:they simply move.So do it everywhere. Like I said. Repeatedly.
Are outcast cap ships now open to any ID? - sovereign - 05-23-2008
The idea is actually to show them a taste of RP, and point them toward the forums, not shunt them toward other PvP-whoring, which happens less than you might think.
As far as evidence, I think the word of what, 4? well-known Outcast authorities is sufficient. Do you want a FRAPS documentary and dissertation on forum politics? Would that illustrate the point? I'm SURE no one EVER minds doing those.
Seriously, learn to trust people, they aren't malevolent bastards, they're trying to help...