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+--- Thread: Junker Bomber Hybrid (/showthread.php?tid=15500)
Junker Bomber Hybrid - Syndic - 01-20-2009
' Wrote:The Russians were anticipating a war with the US, so what did they do? Build lots of things that can kill Americans, Humans. They didn't go and build weapons specialized in beheading midgets now did they? Why not? They didn't really come across angry midgets very often to warrant such technology...
Actually I am quite astounded that you underestimate the great midget threat.
They are low and close to the ground--stealthy--you wouldn't see them coming. Who knows what they are doing down there? Such short sightedness could be the midgety death of us all!
And you made my point for me.
The "Americans" are Renegade pirates with ever increasing powerful ships, Nomads, terrorists and the Wild. It isn't a static universe.
And the MARKET for a ship for export like this would appeal to the business man. Why not build a ship that you alone can cheaply build to sell at a profit and gain the advantage of base defense from renegades?
Junker Bomber Hybrid - Muleo - 01-20-2009
' Wrote:Actually I am quite astounded that you underestimate the great midget threat.
They are low and close to the ground--stealthy--you wouldn't see them coming. Who knows what they are doing down there? Such short sightedness could be the midgety death of us all!
And you made my point for me.
The "Americans" are Renegade pirates with ever increasing powerful ships, Nomads, terrorists and the Wild. It isn't a static universe.
And the MARKET for a ship for export like this would appeal to the business man. Why not build a ship that you alone can cheaply build to sell at a profit and gain the advantage of base defense from renegades?
Because disco doesn't need another free for all ship to deal/balance with.
This was a point Mjolnir brought up, any ships that junkers get needs to be carefully scrutinized, as almost all pirates gain access to it.
I've never seen .:j:. actually use bombers, have you?
Junker Bomber Hybrid - Rudo - 01-20-2009
' Wrote:Because disco doesn't need another free for all ship to deal/balance with.
This was a point Mjolnir brought up, any ships that junkers get needs to be carefully scrutinized, as almost all pirates gain access to it.
I've never seen .:j:. actually use bombers, have you?
*raises hand*
We have a few around. Mostly for driving off the encroaching cap fleets that ignore our Collectors telling them to bugger off from the no-fire zones.
Junker Bomber Hybrid - MarvinCZ - 01-20-2009
Do you want to have a junker specific ship or a generic "sold to everyone who doesn't shoot us first" ship?
Comparison with Americans.. they were an arch-enemy to the Soviets. There is nothing even close to that for Junkers. Sure, there are nasty things crawling around, but no imminent capital ship assaults. Nothing that would warrant a dedicated super-bomber.
I find it funny that you are trying to "correct" me about the Salvager while repeating my point in different words: It is a Transport/GB hybrid. Something that has a use for the Junkers in their everyday life. Nowhere near a Cruiser.
BTW, the model itself is very nice.
Junker Bomber Hybrid - Grumblesaur - 01-20-2009
I'd say it needs two class 8 guns, just for the sake of mounting a few debilitators or something.
Otherwise, it's a decent idea.
Junker Bomber Hybrid - Drake - 01-20-2009
I personally think it would be best left Junker-specific. A last line of base defense against unruly capships. Multi-purpose ships are great, yes, but tend to be somewhat inferior when compared to more focused ships. This would obviously be extremely focused on killing capships, with almost zero anti-fighter/bomber capability. One purpose, which it does well, but in relatively small numbers (like I suggested earlier, sell in the Junker Guard system).
And remember, if the Junker/Gallian connection is well-known, the Junkers may start needing some increased defenses, because their 'neutrality' is going to be shot to hell. If certain Junker families got wind of Gallia going public before it happened, or knew that there were Gallic factions working towards those ends, they may very well have started developing some more combat-focused ships, rather than multi-purpose ships.
Junker Bomber Hybrid - Syndic - 01-20-2009
Nobody paid me $5 so this isn't an argument.
It was actually just a discussion. I'm not the decision maker here so I'm not saying anybody "has" to do this. No reason to start reacting to imagined plays to push in an ubership. Its just a suggestion for discussion--hopefully not one shut down by entirely dogmatic one-sided views.
You learn nothing by refusing to consider how to do things. I simply made a ship MODEL for fun and proposed what it might do. Some people liked it and asked me to talk about it further for consideration in the game. No "evil plan" here.
Junker Bomber Hybrid - MarvinCZ - 01-20-2009
I like the model and I am all for having it added. I just dislike the proposed use and discussed that. Yes, I was stronly against that, but not against the model. We even proposed other uses...
And I don't fear it would get in as an uber-ship, there's enough people to watch over that.
Junker Bomber Hybrid - Syndic - 01-20-2009
' Wrote:I personally think it would be best left Junker-specific. A last line of base defense against unruly capships. Multi-purpose ships are great, yes, but tend to be somewhat inferior when compared to more focused ships. This would obviously be extremely focused on killing capships, with almost zero anti-fighter/bomber capability. One purpose, which it does well, but in relatively small numbers (like I suggested earlier, sell in the Junker Guard system).
And remember, if the Junker/Gallian connection is well-known, the Junkers may start needing some increased defenses, because their 'neutrality' is going to be shot to hell. If certain Junker families got wind of Gallia going public before it happened, or knew that there were Gallic factions working towards those ends, they may very well have started developing some more combat-focused ships, rather than multi-purpose ships.
This was also part of my reasoning. We don't have a "transition point" in game for the Gallia revelation--one day it will not be there and the next it will. But one would occur. The new ship changes can be seen as "steps forward" in technology and that would progress--not just "happen". I see this as part of the progression.
It wasn't conceived as an add to the current server but as a result of the changes in 4.85 where it might actually fit very well. there will be MANY new ships and balances there--this would be only one.
The Junkers just happen to be using a lot of caps and don't have a bomber or gunboat. Mod updates happen when they happen so it was a good time to present it.
Junker Bomber Hybrid - MarvinCZ - 01-20-2009
Just a note, all the time I was considering it against 4.85 balances and ships.