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+--- Thread: Relative Faction/House Millitary Strength... (/showthread.php?tid=78296)
Relative Faction/House Millitary Strength... - dodike - 04-17-2012
' Wrote:Edit: I'm taking into account player base size, player base and faction skill, player base and faction organization, & player base and faction activityHeh, this reminds me the Gallic invasion of Taus where KNF started to push into Gallia. :D
Relative Faction/House Millitary Strength... - Knjaz - 04-17-2012
' Wrote:Well, that would be true if GMG conquered Rheinland in 80 Years War but they didn't. GMG fully relied on technology that was specialised for use in clouds which Rheinland didn't have.
I can understand why is the precedent of snubs pwning caps in vanilla role bothering you.
No, it's nowhere related to ship types.
They didn't conquer Rheinland - but they annihilated them militarily. I mean literally, the strongest and biggest military of that time suffered 99% losses, and had nothing left.
Looking at how wars changed since humanity started to rely on technology, and how they continue to develop with development of technology, that's completely mind-blowing.
Relative Faction/House Millitary Strength... - Benjamin - 04-17-2012
So's an 80 year war in general. It's clearly some Afghanistan-style war, with Rheinland sitting all its ships in a big system it dominates but is essentially impossible to fully control, and haemorrhaging money slowly over 80 years from constant harrassment.
Rheinland annihilated itself by trying to occupy land it couldn't hold from an enemy it couldn't defeat.
Also, wiping out stuff like that isn't totally unheard of. 6 day war, pearl harbour. That's stuff that happened in hours, not decades.
Relative Faction/House Millitary Strength... - Oorn - 04-17-2012
' Wrote:I'd say:Actually the most accurate list in my opinion, only correction I would make is
Gallia 1000 - blargh, 1000 is set as the "biggest military"
Liberty 700 - Said to have the biggest military from Sirius
Rheinland 600 - Left-overs from the Nomad War build up
Kusari 300 - Lost everything during the Nomad War and lost a lot again during the Gallic invasion.
Bretonia 250 - They weren't really involved in the Nomad War, but didn't have much to begin with. The war with Kusari caused trouble already, now their army's strength is even lower.
Nomads 150 - ACTIVE strength, not inactive. Because they probably have a lot more inactive "ships" around (keeping in mind that their inactive stuff is all over the whole galaxy(?), their real strength probably exceeds that of Gallia).
Corsairs 80 - Lack of ressources and only one planet with very bad conditions to grow food.
Outcasts 75 - Lower number, better technology iRP though
Council 70 - Well, they put some dents into Gallia, so...
Hessians 65 - Very big movement with quite good access to ressources actually, also decently supported. Question is, do they mine ressources?
Coalition 40 - Very centered around fighting, lack ressources and manpower otherwise.
CR 40 - Also very centered around fighting, had a lot of wars lately though and had to move all their people to Coronado.
GMG 35 - Based on snubs and skill they can even put out a good fight without a big army. Their paramilitary is still not to be taken lightly, especially with their guerilla fighting style in the Sigma-parts of the Crow nebula.
IMG 30 - Their paramilitary fought Outcasts for a long time now and thereby learned how to fight and survive in the asteroid fields with countless enemies around.
Order / Core 30 - both suffered (heavy) losses, hard to say which one has more left.
Zoners 25 - Their military strength is not much. Due to their pacifist nature they mostly lack fighting skills. Hummer though make them rather "strong".
Blood Dragons 20 - Left overs from a time before time eh...long time ago. But their fighting skill is superior.
Hellfire Legion 15 - Lack the numbers.
Liberty Rogues 15 - Too unorganized.
Mollys 15 - Too drunk. ...What?
++EDIT: Put Core and Order lower.
liberty 500
Rheinland 400
Gallia 1100
Relative Faction/House Millitary Strength... - leonidos - 04-17-2012
' Wrote:Forget RPShows you that you have no idia of player base actually is. It doesnt depends upon number of player present in certain moments but on average presence.
Lets go with reality and what is actually going on in the server:
1) Rheinland tops all. They have the skill and activity, MASSIVE player base, and organization
2) Liberty comes in with a distant second due the size of its player base.
3) Bretonia
4) Hessians due to skill, activity, size of its player base, and organization of the player base (blobo is king???)
5) SCRA due to skill, activity, and EXCELLENT organization
7) Kusari
8) BHG/Core due to numbers and ability to summon Thresher/Bomber swarms of DOOM
9) IMG- In large swarms the miners can dish out alot of pain
10) Corsairs- TBH & Benitez (and a handful of others) are the only reason why the Corsairs are considered.
Maybe it will be better for you to ask so called king.
I dont understand why the council is so down at everyones list. I too agree that it has strength a little lesser than bret but streached.
I dont remember where probably in omega 5 in the rumors said that the sairs has skilled pilots but not good in numbers where the hessains dont have much good weps and ships( as much i remember lorewise they use stillo and sabres )but they compensate with huge numbers. Kill 2 and 4 shows up. That is what makes the omega war mostly unwinnable. However the present situation for hessains and corsairs are completely opposite.
Relative Faction/House Millitary Strength... - Thunderer - 04-17-2012
The 4.86 introduction mentioned House military sizes. I remember just battleship numbers:
-Gallia: 500, 150 are invading Sirius;
-Liberty: not mentoned. Has almost as twice more as Rheinland - approximately 150;
-Rheinland: about 80;
-Bretonia: 55 - including 5 Exile battleships (yes, five. Not two. 2 are stationed);
-Kusari: beaten to the ground, probably has less than Bretonia, but more than Corsairs and Outcasts. 40 by my opinion.
-Corsairs: about 20, maybe less;
-Outcasts: about 10, fifteen if we're optimistic;
-Hessians: a bit less than the Outcasts;
-Nomads: most of their fleet is destroyed by a tennis ball sized artifact. They are also in war with everybody. A meager fleet is in their <strike>hands</strike> tentacles, even smaller after the Toledo conflict;
-Zoners: not a lot. Certainly more than 3 (including that big-huge-pre-jinkusu-alien-Persephone-thing);
-The Council: I separated them because I don't know a lot about them. Their fleet size is probably near that of the Corsairs or Outcasts. Maybe bigger. They managed to hold Gallic forces for a long time, didn't they?
I didn't include anybody else because they are out of the "strong list". But, battleships don't always win wars. Snubs actually play them. BSs are just support. I just didn't memorize snub numbers due to sheer number size, but they are mostly proportional to battleship numbers. By that, and with knowledge that Bretonians are making dozens of Templars and Challingers every day, what is higher than most factions, I would put them a little bit higher.
I don't know the accurate number of battleships for every faction. Just for Bretona and Gallia - I did a rough evaluation by knowledge that Kusari had enough battleships, before Gallia came, to make Bretonians retreat and that Rheinland had about the same amount as they did. Liberty had almost twice more of BSs than Rheinland. The whole evaluation depends on the size of the Bretonian garrison.
If a Sirius wide war happens, all Houses would wound each other badly. The side who would win will be in a desolate part of Sirius, far from any great power. They would just come to finish the others off.
Zoners tricked us all. :P
Relative Faction/House Millitary Strength... - Rosa.Klebb - 04-18-2012
' Wrote:Shows you that you have no idia of player base actually is. It doesnt depends upon number of player present in certain moments but on average presence.
Maybe it will be better for you to ask so called king.
I dont understand why the council is so down at everyones list. I too agree that it has strength a little lesser than bret but streached.
I dont remember where probably in omega 5 in the rumors said that the sairs has skilled pilots but not good in numbers where the hessains dont have much good weps and ships( as much i remember lorewise they use stillo and sabres )but they compensate with huge numbers. Kill 2 and 4 shows up. That is what makes the omega war mostly unwinnable. However the present situation for hessains and corsairs are completely opposite.
Corsairs have the largest average presence in the Omicrons sure. No doubt on that, but the skill and organization is not there.
Relative Faction/House Millitary Strength... - Azan27 - 04-18-2012
When calculating military strength, don't forget to factor in the organization of each nation's 'war machine.' Bretonia's nationalized industry and intigrated armed forces command gives it a distinct edge in this conflict. Also, Rheinland's nationalist government has consistantly listed the military as one of the country's top priority, so they receive extra funding for neat new toys. At the same time, however, if you want to get really complicated, you start factoring in the socioeconomic status of the four houses and how their supply chain acts in tandiem with their military forces, which throws the whole balance of power in Sirius into question. Is Liberty the strongest? They certainly have the best equipt ships on standard (excluding Gallia). But, it's still a toss up between who's the strongest, given the extreme battering Bretonia has received at the hands of the Kusari and Gallic forces, respectivly, the recent shakeup in Kusari politics, the imperial defeat of Rheinland and its subsiquent troubles at home, and the fact that Liberty has still not really kicked its military into high gear.
On the subject of Gallia, I left it out of this brainstorming for the most part, due to it not really being part of Sirius. It has beyond a doubt the most heavily equipt army and the largest supply chain of any force active in Discovery. That doesn't mean they are the best, though.
In short, you could put the houses in a list, but why bother? It's much more fun to examine each faction's individual strengths and weaknesses than it is to compare them to some strange standard.
Relative Faction/House Millitary Strength... - Camtheman - 04-18-2012
Holy crap this topic got huge.
I don't mean in terms of actual players on the server.
Most people got what I meant.
I meant in the storyline, where there are hundreds of millions of active millitary units Sirius wide, etc.
About the production lines being under gov't control, i'd say Gallia takes the cake on that with all of their highly nationalized corporations.
Liberty would be the lowest on that because of their capitalistic nature, but just like in WWII the US/Liberty has massive production capacity even if it would be very expensive for the G man.
Relative Faction/House Millitary Strength... - leonidos - 04-18-2012
' Wrote:Corsairs have the largest average presence in the Omicrons sure. No doubt on that, but the skill and organization is not there.I agree that corsairs has almost no organisation that is why they got killed most of the time on raids and othertime so what sairs do insted of growing fighting skills they relies on big ships most of the sairs take caps insted of snubs. But those all not about skills. They must have some better tech according to lore while all the sairs techs are average quality.