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+--- Thread: My thoughts concerning factions/Indies and other such stuff. (/showthread.php?tid=9747)
My thoughts concerning factions/Indies and other such stuff. - n00bl3t - 06-25-2008
' Wrote:Who does? Only the mentally ill or treasonous are liable for that.
Mental illness is a point of view.
My thoughts concerning factions/Indies and other such stuff. - Praetyre - 06-25-2008
And the vast majority of psychologists do not define "Giving an order in a military" as mental illness. Who is mentally ill?
My thoughts concerning factions/Indies and other such stuff. - n00bl3t - 06-25-2008
' Wrote:And the vast majority of psychologists do not define "Giving an order in a military" as mental illness. Who is mentally ill?
Giving an unreasonable order however, that will result in the severe loss of life with minimal gain.
I think that qualifies the person who gave the order as crazy.
My thoughts concerning factions/Indies and other such stuff. - Praetyre - 06-25-2008
There's provisions for overriding said orders in RL militaries. If Nathan is arguing these shouldn't exist in FL, then I'd disagree.
My thoughts concerning factions/Indies and other such stuff. - worldstrider - 06-25-2008
I wanted to mention something that I haven't seen addressed in all this.
There are Battlestar Galactica rp elements included in Disco. Some Star Wars ships. I read the backstory of the Helghast and it included a fleet equipped with a planet destroyer (and note, the Helghast have their own ID as an actual part of the mod). Read some of the old rp stories or bios--some are unbelievably fantastic and close to over the top.
Discovery has obviously evolved but what we are dealing with here is legacy.
Playing BSG was fine when it was a new show, all the players were well acquainted with one another and it was a small fellowship. Now its barely tolerated borderline oorp to play the BSG universe here.
These are legacy--left over--issues. The old ships, out of place stories and technologies, et al. are all part of different moments in the server's history that flared then subsided.
So is the current clan tolerance and allowance.
Server rules are not put in place or overridden so as to satisfy the legacy of the old clans--who have come to think such deference is a perpetual right.
Just like the old ships and stories, it doesn't accomodate the new players and role play. Just as the mod has changed and evolved, its time for the legacy clans to be re-examined and codified and defined by server rules to a new standard.
If I was in a clan, I probably would be scared of this too. But change is good.
Imagine if we started from a server wipe today and a whole new blank slate. I quickly get together some mates and we form factions for each house and declare ourselves "the" government for all involved factions. People would have a cow!
The legacies don't want to lose what they have, as Praetyre said, "If you do that, its over".
I beg to disagree. No, it will start over...and if it starts over right it will be great.
I don't want existing clans to "go away" or vanish and I don't begrudge them their influence. It is just time to open up the server to everyone else here too.
My thoughts concerning factions/Indies and other such stuff. - Reverend Del - 06-25-2008
I doubt Nathan is suggesting that you should not be able to question an order that seem stupid. However what he is suggesting, it seems, is that unless you can get the folks to agree with you you may find you accusations falling on deaf ears.
I just want to raise a point I saw in brief earlier on it's only just popped into my mind which is why i rasie it now.
Either n00blet or Akumabito mention the words "faction leaders and their puppets" I'd like to ask faction leaders how the lead their factions, because I know for a fact if I tried to demand my Rogues follow my orders without discussion outside the game, they'd lynch me. They joined my faction. They ahve accepted my way of leading, but should they not have accepted it I would have had to alter my style of leadership in order to maintain control of my faction. In othe words my faction members allow me to lead them. They hold the keys to my "power" not I. If anny puppets are involved in my faction then it is I. I wonder if this si the same with most other factions, seeing as members choose to join and then choose to play how would any faction survive if they tried to impose a military like rule on their faction outside of the game environment...
My thoughts concerning factions/Indies and other such stuff. - worldstrider - 06-25-2008
Errrr..I thought they were muppets?
cAn I hAz pUpPetz?
My thoughts concerning factions/Indies and other such stuff. - Praetyre - 06-25-2008
The comparison to Battlestar Galactica, a whole different universe, is not a valid one. Battlestar Galactica came as the result of adaptation to lack of ship designers and a different RP atmosphere. Having crossovers is totally against the intent of Discovery to be an unofficial expansion pack.
Militaries are unilateral, COC oriented organisations, are in Sirius, were on Earth, and remain so in just about every work of fiction and every real life incarnation imaginable. What you will require is:
The ceasing of roleplay in top positions like Grosseadmiral. At best, the RM will be the Nord/Sudkriegsmarine with one Grosseadmiral leading it all, and more likely a single fleet under an Admiral. The Kanzler will no longer be roleplayed, and the RP around him will stagnate, as will the KDGA and Rheinland's history as a dictatorship. The very name, ranks, structure, long standing roleplay stories based in reality will have to change.
That's just one example.
This is practically confirming Morgan's beliefs:
' Wrote:It isn't a witch hunt, it's an insurgency by a small group of overly loud greenhorns who think that anarchy is the best kind of fun, and wish to trample on three years of Roleplay painstakingly crafted by the older players and the factions.
My thoughts concerning factions/Indies and other such stuff. - worldstrider - 06-25-2008
' Wrote:What you will require is:
The ceasing of roleplay in top positions like Grosseadmiral. At best, the RM will be the Nord/sudkriegmsarine with one Grosseadmiral leading it all, and more likely a single fleet under an Admiral. The Kanzler will no longer be roleplayed, and the RP around him will stagnate, as will the KDGA and Rheinland's history as a dictatorship.
Well that's ok. Stuff happens, things change. It also doesn't have to be that way. Create a referendum and see if some factions can have officially appointed clans. Then open it to a server vote.
I personally think it would be wonderful if each lawful faction had a government, represented by voting players.
If they like your play of the RM, you'd stay in power and if not, they would appoint a new leader or faction.
The only difference is others would decide, not just your own faction.
I think that models fairness and would be a plus.
I'm also not saying such positions couldn't be rped by factions--just that they can't unilaterally claim them.
I also am not making credits in game with this forum debate. Must...go..trade.
Adios. Good discussion.
My thoughts concerning factions/Indies and other such stuff. - Praetyre - 06-25-2008
There's an issue there, though.. Rheinland is a dictatorship and Kusari is an Empire. But, it could work for other nations like Bretonia or Liberty.
In any case, that just sounds like trial-by-forum on a large scale.