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+--- Thread: Does a Faction's Rank-Limitations keep you away from joining? (/showthread.php?tid=15722)
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Does a Faction's Rank-Limitations keep you away from joining? - Cawdor - 01-25-2009
This poll is basically inspired by my beloved VF. We only allow VHFs like the popular Sabre at very high ranks. The thought was to get our members motivated by showing them a goal to work for. On the other hand, when I for one browse through the faction status pages and see stuff like the XA, I think "hm, tasty", but then I read on about the rank limitations and I'd go like "lololol icanhaz indiz razer".
So what do you guys think? Does someone have to be in love with such a faction like VF or XA to play it until the "end of the line" or is it just me being all keen on the fighters?
Do you even have the same concerns with a cap restriction?
Should some factions eventually change their rank policies to attract more players?
Discuss.
Does a Faction's Rank-Limitations keep you away from joining? - Linkus - 01-25-2009
I believe a lot of factions currently work that way, especially about capital ships.
Often though, a lot of ships aren't actually capable of being 'ranked' in that they are all useful, just different classes.
Does a Faction's Rank-Limitations keep you away from joining? - swift - 01-25-2009
CR is one of the factions that work this way.
I voted Yes, Of Course on both counts.
What it encourages is working to achieve something, it gives the player a goal to work towards, gives him a purpose.
Not to mention it almost eliminates possibility of cap abuse.
I remember how proud and happy I was once I got my captain rank, I thought how all the hard work paid off.
I don't even like flying gunboats, but when I am in it, I am reminded of my achievement.
And seeing as we have 30 members at this moment, I don't think we have a recruitment problem. They just come to us, we test them, if they prove good, they become good additions to the faction.
Does a Faction's Rank-Limitations keep you away from joining? - Carlos_Benitez - 01-25-2009
The Benitez familia fly Fighters and Bombers almost all the time, and these are the ships given to new members. Members aren't permitted to have a Benitez-tagged Gunboat until they reach the rank of "Benitez Elder"/"Capitan" which can take between 6 months and 1 1/2 years depending upon vacancies that open up. Members ranked Elder or above also have theoretical access to our shared Osiris Battleship, the Talos, but only if they can get their head round the FLID Changer.
In short, when you join the familia, you do so with little to no hope of flying a clan-tagged capital ship. If you're lucky and get to the role of Elder, you may make yourself a gunboat and might get an opportunity to fly the Talos. However, there is next to no chance of any Benitez owning a personal clan-tagged battleship or Cruiser.
Despite these harsh-sounding limitations, our experienced members set an example and reduce any issues of jealousy by almost never using their gunboats and hardly ever bringing the Talos out of it's garage.
In short, the ships all Benitez fly daily are the same; fighters and bombers, and we're having no trouble getting members. Capships just aren't what our familia is about, and our experienced members and recruits understand and support this. We try and set an example to each other and to independents about use of ship classes.
Other than an NPC-based introductory challenge in a Legionnaire, we don't restrict anyone to anything smaller than a Titan; as, to be fair, the Corsair shipline isn't exactly versatile.
Basicly, there's little chance of recruits being allowed capships, and yet the clan's stayed healthy for almost 2 years. We've also recently had an influx of recruits, and it's heartening to know they seem to be joining for the right reasons. People shouldn't join clans as a means of getting capital ships.
Does a Faction's Rank-Limitations keep you away from joining? - Angelfire - 01-25-2009
I'll answer this one as honestly as possible.
I love disco, none of these comments are meant in any negative light. I merely hope to shed possible light on facts that may be of assistance.
When I (and some of my friends) joined disco, it was because the mod advertised that you could fly any of the Capital Ships and Gun Boats.
I strongly suspect that this is true for most (or at the very least - many) players who join up.
Finding the RP element was a bonus. It was fresh, exciting and challenging.
And here begins the journey of challenges.
Joining a faction was difficult. I remember applying to 4 over a period of 2 weeks and finally getting a reply and a complicated test from 2 of them.
We (myself and my 2 friends at the time) went through with it and struggled along by ourselves in this strange new RP universe until we passed the tests etc. (all necessary by the way - as in a good thing!)
The big excitement was to fly all these new and cool ships that were all over the place - like the Ravon's Talon... Which all three of us flew around happily until we wanted to try Gunboats.
This is where our faction life ended.
As n00bs, we had no clue how, who or where.. besides being indies of course. We wanted to be part of a faction with our Gunboats though... it semed a lot more fun.
The three (mainstream) factions that we joined had us flying light fighters for a set amount of time and various other trials and tests... we never got to fly those gunboats!
My friends eventually went back to WOW calling Disco 'an elitist cesspool of nerd w***kers' (Direct quote). Naturally I stuck around because I enjoyed this new found RP element.
I then fell in love with the community and joined one or two factions where I enjoyed my limited play time. (as most of you know, I have very little play time - none lately).
After a year on Disco, the only Gunboats, VHF's and Capships I have been able to enjoy have been as an Indy.
Unless you have huge amounts of play time or have made friends (as I have now) it is extremely difficult to enjoy both ship and RP elements of Disco as a N00b.
Upon my third application to RM I was accepted but simply had no time to run the gauntlets.
The unfortunate truth is that those who have experienced all the fruits of Disco tend to forget how excited they were in the beginning about the ships, the RP and the PvP.
A sense of guilt is projected onto well meaning N00bs when the desire the same experiences (not talking about lowutter douchebags).
I don't have any answers to these concerns because I am neither admin nor faction leader.
there is probably not much that can be done about it because the community is growing so fast.
Possibly the Need for Speed approach - Where you get to test a really cool vehicle right in the beginning before working your way up the ranks to that and better.
Anyhoo... twas all just rambling about my experience... I am not even sure if it is pertinent to this thread.. but there you have it!
Does a Faction's Rank-Limitations keep you away from joining? - Athenian - 01-25-2009
An interesting topic. The real question is : why would someone willingly submit to the set of self-imposed restrictions of a faction? It might be a liking for the faction's RP; the possibility of teamwork, and whatever. No one is stopping them from doing their own thing (...well....not always...but you know what I mean).
Members come and go in Disco factions, because they are just factions and not clans - the ability to move on when you get bored or jaded or just get more interested elsewhere is actually one of Disco's great strengths.
Much depends on what you intend to achieve with your faction. Are you deliberatley setting out to recruit new players or veterans?
I personally think that there has to be some possibility for advancement within factions for people that show skills. That advancement doesn't always have to be reflected in bigger ships. In fact when I promoted a few people, there was a pretty even split between thsoe who would be willing to have access to a shared account with a gunboat on it and those who had no desire whatsoever to fly one, simply because they either didn't like them or sucked in them.
Having said that, it might be worthwhile explaining why the restriction exists. For me, the good rep of a faction can be easily destroyed by the poor behaviour of one single member. The extent to which that person's behaviour can affect others on the server is much more easily contained if they were unfair to someone in say, a bomber rather than a Cruiser.
Disco's engine attempts to adapt to create a system where you can have both small fighters and huge battleships. Most players of Freelancer played it and enjoyed it as a fighter oriented game, hence a lot of the problems, both in terms of game engine and player interaction, with the bigger ships.
If someone opts to join up with us, considering how awkward I have made our recruitment system, it sends me a clear message: this is someone who is willing to try a different route and approach to the game; one that I think is worthwhile. Having said that, shared accounts might be an idea. I think flying a larger ship shouldn't necessarily be discounted out of hand or reserved for experienced players or superiors in a faction. Often, very experienced players can be total dicks.
My basic rule is this - if they stick it out in a small ship, learn to survive, and don't act like nubtards when things go awry, then they can fly the same VHF or bomber as everyone else in the faction. Following these restrictions can often re vitalise someone's experience of Disco. I still love flying my Hussar with the BPA, the first faction I joined. Right after I sold my Corsair Praefect. It completely transformed my experience of this game.
Great topic to discuss.
Does a Faction's Rank-Limitations keep you away from joining? - Robert.Fitzgerald - 01-26-2009
If I wanted to join another official faction, it'd be so I'd get teamwork with other fighter/bomber pilots (something I miss out on flying independently). The Lane Hackers are one example of a very roleplay/teamwork-heavy faction. It's worth it to join them and other similar factions for those two qualities, even though you're restricted in ship choice.
If I want to use a capital ship, I'd rather stay independent and work with the faction if possible.
Does a Faction's Rank-Limitations keep you away from joining? - Kambei - 01-26-2009
1. yes of corse
2. yes of corse
Why?
First good reason is RP. Anarchy inside military faction? Are you sure it is right RP? Im not, all organized social groupes on the world in RL have hierarchy and restrictions what certain rank can or cant do... why not in RP game?
Second good reason is event... as member of ofi faction you have an acces to events a.k.a planed battles which are allways better than random encounters.
Third good reason is armory.
Fourth good reason is cooperation with same ppl which bring to your gameplay fun and increase efectivity of your fighting skills.
Fifth nice reason is the fealing my work have sense. Ranks are reward for your work.
Sixth nice reason is comand. higher rank allow you to comand lower ranked persons which give you new perspective into a game and different experience.
Seventh good reason is respect... players from offi faction have much higher respect than indies around. Gues what happend if indie LN order an registerd merc to kill someone and taged LN say "no":)
Does a Faction's Rank-Limitations keep you away from joining? - MrHeadphones - 01-26-2009
My opinion is that having restrictions on fighters isn't such a good idea. I can understand needing clearance for large ships, seeing as in RP there would be huge costs involved in making even a single gunboat, but restricting fighters, in my view, is just annoying, since if you're in a faction which restricts fighters at a low rank, you're going to have little chance against factions which give you the mk. 2 ships from day 1. That said though, I do see a few factions which could feasibly have restrictions on fighters, since they have a lower grade fighter which is still quite good e.g. Rheinland military, Corsairs etc. Restrictions on caps though don't matter to me, since I personally prefer flying fighters, since they can actually fit through asteroid fields, and don't manoeuvre like cows on roller skates which have been set on fire.
Does a Faction's Rank-Limitations keep you away from joining? - pchwang - 01-26-2009
Angelfire, you bring up a very interesting point.
I do not want to compare discovery with WoW, but personally, I believe that your friends made an error in judgment. The amount of time it takes to get to a high position in WoW is rather long and tedious. I remember playing for months before I was even close to level 60(I didn't play every day...)
Freelancer is similar in such a way. It takes a while to develop here, like in WoW. At the same time, its also easier to access a capital ship, only time consuming, instead of some of the ridiculous things you must do in order to get a good mount in WoW.
Powertrade for 3 weeks, you haz capship with gunz.
Powertrade for 3 moar weeks, you haz cap 8.
(The above is not referencing you insane people who powertrade for 48 hours straight and burn their eyes out...yes, I'm looking at you, OsoRojo...)
Factor in serious pirating, and it might take you around 2 months to do it. It's still far easier than certain things in other MMORPGs.
Now, as Athenian said, people join factions for things that the factions offer. Like any scale, for one side to tip, the other must rise. Any positive effect comes with a similar negative effect, in this case, ship restrictions.
The BPA has a self-imposed restriction policy that's built around the principle of the scale mentioned above. Some of our members do things of all sorts.
Certain officers choose not to use weapons, certain others are members of our "SWAT/Counter Terrorist" team and face significant danger for the same pay(but slightly better health care[You get free Earl Grey in the waiting rooms]), and the CCD, who fly Percherons and interdict smugglers.
So, technically, we don't impose anything on players, but at the same time, its the fact that we have this "self-imposing" rule on people that turns them away.
This is, indeed, an interesting topic.