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+--- Thread: Allowed/Recommended ID/Ship list (New Version) (/showthread.php?tid=9728)
Allowed/Recommended ID/Ship list (New Version) - mjolnir - 06-24-2008
ID/Ship list:
<strike>1) Community answers the questions above and adds comments</strike> - done here:
http://discoverygc.com/forums/index.php?sh...=18326&st=0
<strike>2) I make the first version of the list</strike> - done
<strike>3) Community argues about the list and I change it accordingly - this will last some time and might get tricky, as of now I give this at least a week, more probably two weeks.</strike>
4) Admins review the list and change it if they don't like something
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NOTE: List in the attachment (end of post)
I recommend that you use the .xls version since the .pdf is a bit of an afterthought right now.
Ships are divided into 3 categories
1. Green - use for best RP, should be the only ones used by official factions and independents (without additional explanation)
2. Yellow - Allowed to use with some RP reasons
3. Red - Should not use unless very good RP reasons are provided, can get you sanctioned
My decision criteria
1) Infocard
2) Selling locations + what NPCs fly
3) Nature of the faction/ID - ex.: Junkers won't fly Luxury Liner
Note: This chart doesn't take into account current bugs/problems with some ships.
Some main points
1 Millitary ships are put as Red to both civilians, freelancers and BHG
2. BHG ships are red to all except Freelancers, Mercs and Zoners
3. Pirate ships are yellow to Mercs/FLs, except some "guarded" ones, like Blood Dragon HF
4. Civilian ships are mostly yellow to pirates, depending on the pirate faction history/style - so some are ok
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I need your help to go trough the chart and post what you thing is wrong and why you think so.
Before you post go trough the following:
1) Read the ship infocard and find it's selling location.
2) Check what other factions can use it
3) Check what other ships can your faction use.
4) Check the faction diplomacy
5) Remember that there might be many mistakes made by me simply due to the sheer size of the chart. So point them out without looking for some conspiracy.
Please try to structure your answers so that it's easy to read them!!!!
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Known issues and corrections - updated repeatedly, last 14.7.
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Here follows some explaining about some "contested" ships, main list is in the attachment
Most of those ships are so "contested" that it will come to admin decision on the final list.
LFs
Arrow
[color=#FFCC33]Yellow - corporations outside Liberty/Bretonian, Liberty pirates
Civilian made ship, Liberty Pirates can easily get one
Tigershark
Green Rheinland and Kusari corporations
Yellow Liberty and Bretonian corp., most RH pirate factions and factions with access to Omegas
Red Xenos, BD - nothing with Rheinland and far away from selling spot
Civilian made in Rheinland, "available for civilians in Border Worlds", relatively expensive
VHFs
Avenger + Raven Claw
Green - LSF
Yellow - LPI, LN, Military, Kishiro for Raven Claw
Red - everyone else
Avenger:
"Top secret development by LSF, only very few exists", so not the ship Navy would use for daily missions.
Raven Claw:
"Severak copies were build in Liberty, LSF used them for covert missions..."
Blood Dragon
Green - BDs, Phantoms
Yellow - GC, Outcasts, Pirate
Red - everyone else
"Dragons conceal the design of the ship even from their pirate brethren", + GC NPCs fly the civilian line of ships
Bombers
Falcata
Green - all BW-line users since it says "Borderworlds bomber... recent development by the outcasts".
Havoc MKII
Green - factions listed on infocard, Bretonian and Liberty corporations
Yellow - other house corporations, Liberty Pirates
Red - non Liberty Pirates
"Ageira bomber..... While Ageira intially planned to sell it only to LN and BAF, the company executives soon found it could make a lot of profit on alternative markets"
Hence Liberty Pirates could get a hold off it just like with the Arrow, but yes maybe this one should be a bit more restricted than Arrow. Open for discussion.
Taiidan Bomber
"Build by GMG", sold in Omicron Delta on a Zoner base
Green + Yellow - most corporations
Red:
- Kusari pirates since: BDs - can not be openly supplied by GMG, FA - are "unfriendly to GMG", Hogosha are hostile,
- RH pirates - hostile to GMG (Bundschuh on the infocard, others are allied with them.. and have nothing to do in Delta)
- Bretonian and Liberty Pirates - far from GMG or Delta, some hostile to them as well
- Corsairs - hostile to GMG
- Outcasts - hostile to GMG
Transports
Huge corporate ones - Adv. Train, Heavy Tankers....
Yellow - Trader ID
Red - all pirate factions
Pirate transport, pirate train and BW transport are there for a reason.
Container Transp.
Red - Bretonian Companies - "build in Kusari"
Luxury Liner
Green - OSC
Yellow - Trader, IC, Zoners, BHG?
Red - eveyone else
Allowed/Recommended ID/Ship list (New Version) - Virus - 06-24-2008
Anyway... At the list, I only really looked at the Phantom one, but some things really confuse me:
Phantoms can fly Nepthys but not Osiris? I fly an Osiris... No one has cared.
Phantoms can fly Hacker Spyglass but not Gunship?
Phantoms can't fly Red Hessian Cruiser but not Rheinland Pirate Cruiser?
Gonna keep looking at a couple others.
Noticed this: Police should be "OK" to fly Cruisers. Not "RP"
Allowed/Recommended ID/Ship list (New Version) - mjolnir - 06-24-2008
Akumabito I showed the list to an admin and was told that he already thought something like that is starting to be needed. I will leave it up to them how "easy" it will be to make an exception.
My view is that for yellow (OK) ships you don't need admin approval. For red (NO ones) you do.
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@Phantoms I didn't really check capships for Phantoms since whole Phantom faction falls into the "admin approval needed" area. So specially capships are checked heavily.
Same goes for Wild and Nomad factions.
I agree that all the ships that you posted are in RP for phantoms.
All cruisers for police are marked as troublesome. With two police factions having them "RP" and 3 as "OK". Inconsistent there yes, all should be as "OK".
I will be adding corrections in the first post.
Allowed/Recommended ID/Ship list (New Version) - Reverend Del - 06-24-2008
XA has RP for a limted number of Kushan freighters. 3 of them were purchased from the TAZ.
Ref: Post #612 & Post #613
Allowed/Recommended ID/Ship list (New Version) - Culebra - 06-24-2008
The exceptions normaly have extensive RP behind it and have been in the community for a while. Ships need to be restricted because this is not a single player game, other people have to be taken into account.
You have the Rogue gunboat as no to the Junkers. I think at the moment that one fits the Junkers the best. I would say no to the corsair gunboat for Junkers and yes to the rogues.
Allowed/Recommended ID/Ship list (New Version) - mjolnir - 06-24-2008
I hate to repeat myself, but IMHO:
Yellow ships need some reasonable RP effort and official faction approval (in case they "own" the ship)
Red need excelent RP and admin approval
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So Bretonian BS for Blood Dragon.... is Red , so it needs excellent RP and admin approval.
The RP you presented is IMO enough for the Yellow area.
If you want to discuss admin decisions, please move to some other thread.
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Now what the list will do:
1. Players can see what is "normal" for their factions to fly (or in what factions they can use that ship they love so much).
2. If they want to use different ship, they can check how much RP effort they need to get it. (And how big chance they have to have it approved)
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Quote:XA has RP for a limted number of Kushan freighters. 3 of them were purchased from the TAZ.
Ref: Post #612 & Post #613
Well Kushan freighter should be listed as OK
for the Xenos, since it's made by Zoners. Then RPs like that are enough to make it work.
My mistake
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Quote:You have the Rogue gunboat as no to the Junkers. I think at the moment that one fits the Junkers the best. I would say no to the corsair gunboat for Junkers and yes to the rogues.
Yep that is my mistake as well. But I would say it should be in the OK area. So you need to make some deal with Rogues to get one.
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Thanks for help, as I said don't look for conspiracy first.. but for mistakes.
Allowed/Recommended ID/Ship list (New Version) - Srkad - 06-24-2008
I for one think the list is great, but a thing to consider could be ID's as well, for instance i have a smuggler with no affiliation, could he use an Adv. Train and still work with rp?
Just saying.
I think the list is a GREAT idea for new comers who really want to rp correctly, and maybe for people who have been here a while but dont want to make a mistake.
Good work!
Allowed/Recommended ID/Ship list (New Version) - Ichtan - 06-24-2008
I think the ship list is a great idea, as it's a good way to see what you'll be able to fly should you make a character with a faction association you aren't totally familiar with.
As for the exceptions, they SHOULD be allowed on the basis of very good roleplay and admin approval. I'm sure you'll disagree Akumabito, as you've stated more than enough times in this thread, but exceptions will always happen.
Thanks for the work you've put into this Molnir, I can tell you've worked hard mate.
Allowed/Recommended ID/Ship list (New Version) - mjolnir - 06-24-2008
Nice...
now if someone actually can go trough the chart (at least for the factions he likes to play) and post mistakes/ things he doesn't like.
Thank you
Allowed/Recommended ID/Ship list (New Version) - Snapp - 06-24-2008
from an "Indy"...
I ask that this be made a tad bit more legible and straight forward. As In: Only factions and indys with good writing skills or connections with the right people, should have capships. Cuz im sorry, thats what it boils down to, no matter what anyone else attempts to justify it as.
"Defectors" or "Theft": Capships. Movies to show example: Under Siege, U-571, Hunt for Red October.
If defecting, the ship should still have the same IFF/ID no matter where it goes. Expect the faction your leaving to try and "retake" or destroy the ship. Also expect the faction getting the ship to "reverse engineer" the ship in order to steal its technology, just before they destroy it, and any evidence that they had it. (that is unless they want it to be known they have aquired the technology and allowed the defector to join them.)
Keep it simple for the simple folk and those that are considered "outsiders" like me.
Green ID's for best RP, should be the only ones used by official factions and independents, without additional explanation or forum involvement.
Yellow ID's need some RP reasons or a simple request on the forum or in-game.
Red ID's require RP Story on the forums and or permission from the "owning faction" or an Admin.
[I wanna see the RP Storys for Every Faction Capship linked on the faction status page or ill have to agree with this whole capship deal being a load of crap. Moving gunboats, cruisers and battleships to guard bases and putting bombers in npc patrols should solve 90% of the problems. Most of this is ego and bullying, highschool crap i refuse to be a part of. No offence meant, but this is getting old and ruining the game for me when im constantly worrying if im gonna "do something wrong".]
Sorry if things are off but heres the list of capships as i get it organized.
Battleships
[color=#FFFFFF]Battlestar II
Information:
This is the largest of all Battlestar-type battleships.
Owning Faction: Admin Only
Suggested Id/IFF/RP:
Admin Only
Battlestar Advanced
Information:
Prototype of Battlestar Advanced was found abandoned in deep space by Zoner expedition.
Suggested Id/IFF/RP:
Zoner ID
Battlestar
Information:
Found by Zoner expedition in Omicron Delta, near the place where Freeport 11 was later constructed.
Suggested Id/IFF/RP:
Zoner ID
Bounty Hunter Battleship
Information:
Used in remote Edge Worlds systems, mainly to defend convoys and space station construction sites.
Suggested Id/IFF/RP:
Bounty Hunter ID
Bretonia Battleship
Information:
Serve as both a symbolic and real display of their military might.
Suggested Id/IFF/RP:
Bretonita Navy ID
Corsair Dreadnought "Osiris"
Information:
Osiris-class battleships constructed with the help of The Order engineers.
Suggested Id/IFF/RP:
Corsair ID
The Order ID
Corsair Dreadnought "Legate"
Information:
Designed to gradually replace the Osiris-class battleships.
Suggested Id/IFF/RP:
Corsair ID
Dragon Battleship "Togo"
Information:
The Blood Dragon Battleship, was first drafted over 20 years ago.
Suggested Id/IFF/RP:
Blood Dragon ID
NovaPG ID
Lane Hacker Battleship "Spyglass"
Information:
Was initially a prototype of the Liberty Navy space reconnaissance battleship.
Suggested Id/IFF/RP:
Lane Hacker ID
Liberty Navy ID
Kusari Battleship
Information:
Engineered by the Kusari Armed Forces and their military industrial complex.
Suggested Id/IFF/RP:
Kusari Naval Forces ID
Liberty Dreadnought
Information:
The Dreadnought class is the most sophisticated and devastating ship of its type.
Suggested Id/IFF/RP:
Liberty Navy ID
Liberty Assault Carrier
Information:
Can hold dozens of fighters deep inside its heavy hull.
Suggested Id/IFF/RP:
Liberty Navy ID
Nomad Battleship
Information:
No further information available. Power signature is alien.
Suggested Id/IFF/RP:
Keeper ID
Osiris
Information:
Connection to a joint LSF and Liberty Navy research project.
Suggested Id/IFF/RP:
The Order ID
Corsair ID
Liberty Security Force ID
Liberty Navy ID
Quote:Why is a suggested IFF/tag for the Osiris LSF and Navy?
It should be Order and Corsair since it's available in gamma and some corsairs have them.
Liberty is a big nono.
Reason:
"LSF and Liberty Navy research project." - 1 Ship was stolen by the order in SP and later reverse engineered by Corsairs to make the Dreadnought "Osiris", right? Liberty still has the designs and could build the original if they choose to. Atleast according to the infocard. I may be mistaken though.
Outcast Dreadnought
Information:
Its armor and firepower are equal to best House battleships.
Suggested Id/IFF/RP:
Outcast ID
Outcast Battleship
Information:
Outcasts' newest development, the Battleship is an awesome machine of terror and destruction.
Suggested Id/IFF/RP:
Outcast ID
Rheinland Battleship
Information:
The tactical "checkmate move" in the operations of the Rheinland military.
Suggested Id/IFF/RP:
Rheinland Military ID
Zoner Battleship "Juggernaut"
Information:
Zoners would never tell how many Juggernauts they have or where they are now.
Suggested Id/IFF/RP:
Zoner ID
Battlecruisers
[color=#FFFFFF]"Albatross" Battlecruiser
Information:
Few people have ever seen the Albatross in space - they rarely appear in populated systems.
Suggested Id/IFF/RP:
Independant Mining Guild ID
Bounty Hunter Battlecruiser
Information:
Battlecruiser is a rare and expensive ship used for missions that involve countering enemy capital ships.
Suggested Id/IFF/RP:
Bounty Hunter ID
Liberty Assault Battlecruiser
Information:
Liberty Navy has a secret weapon that may unexpectedly turn the tide of any battle.
Suggested Id/IFF/RP:
Liberty Navy ID
Just my 2 cents. See, this suggests that with proper ID/IFF/Loadout, any indy can fly his battleship without restriction by Factions, and this simply isnt true right now.