A question about 4.86 ships

[Jinx]

@Govedo13:

haven t seen that ship on the dev board - are you sure its been submitted?

from the look of it, i wouldn t be sure if its wise to put something like that in anyway. - especially the pirate line already got quite a number of ships already. - among them are small freighters ( bactrian ), gunboat-like transports ( pirate transport ), super heavy bombers ( barghest ), very very heavy fighters ( werewolf ), and the usual stuff.

judging from the replies in the thread - it wasn t really clear what role that ship should take anyway. pirate transport? or small capital ship ... anyway, i cannot remember seeing it in any thread regarding placing it in 4.86 - so my guess is... its not in.

@Ashes:

PMed you

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Shipdesigns made for DiscoveryGC

[Cawdor]

why did we add house trains again?

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[tansytansey]

why did we add house trains again?

Double standards don't really surprise me. Very good point though.

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Image turned into a URL because it made your sig too tall. -Zuke
|Ashes and Draya's Epic Adventure|Ashes "Nighthawk" Yotaka|Nightfall|Eva Jones|
[5:50:49 PM] JakeSG (William Darkmoor) says: I like you, Ashes. You're more cynical than God.

[mjolnir]

This

Mod needs more new generic ships. Not house variants.

corresponds with this:

why did we add house trains again?

House trains are modeled from the bottom and bare little resemblance to adv. train, the Kusari one is closest, but still everything on that ship is modeled from 0 and doesn't resemble the adv. train directly.

If they were done in same way as these - replace engine mount with house one and re-skin. They'd be refused in the same way.

You can scream about bias, unfairness and other things, simple fact is that these are ugly kitbashes. If you want to submit house civilian fighters, go on, but they should have comparable quality to all new disco ships.

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Igiss says: Martin, you give them a finger, they bite off your arm.

[Harcourt.Fenton.Mudd]

@Govedo13:

haven t seen that ship on the dev board - are you sure its been submitted?

from the look of it, i wouldn t be sure if its wise to put something like that in anyway. - especially the pirate line already got quite a number of ships already. - among them are small freighters ( bactrian ), gunboat-like transports ( pirate transport ), super heavy bombers ( barghest ), very very heavy fighters ( werewolf ), and the usual stuff.

judging from the replies in the thread - it wasn t really clear what role that ship should take anyway. pirate transport? or small capital ship ... anyway, i cannot remember seeing it in any thread regarding placing it in 4.86 - so my guess is... its not in.

@Ashes:

PMed you

I really dont see how a varriety of ships is a BAD thing (as long as none are unbalanced........... like anything that mountts a SNAC...... ).

give pirates lots and lots of options.

Then do the same for everyone else, adding ships as theyre made.

Hell, if nothing else it'll be a way to replace the homeworld models.


As for ugly kitbashes..... So are the ships that allready exist being fixed ?

Because I can note QUITE a few graphics errors with multiple ships that could be called quite ugly.

Afterall, this IS a mod, as long as theyre at least half decent, why NOT add them in.

I betcha folks WILL fly them, because having extra choices keeps things intersting.

[Linkus]

There's a key point about Discovery that is pretty relevant here.

Quality.
While you may have 500 ships, half of them may be god awful. That's not quality.
All submissions to Disco need to reach a certain standard of quality, it's that simple.

These did not.
That's all there is to it really.

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Facilitating the rise of robotics since 0 A.D.

[Harcourt.Fenton.Mudd]

'horible' user made models replacing the horrible homeworld models would still be an improvement.

I mean hell if we cant get rid of the homeworld models (One source of copyrighted material) can we at least have the damned Arwing back.

How can the same ship with different paint jobs boast different stats? It's an Eagle, it will always be an Eagle. Your paint job doesn't change that.

It's a model of ship, sold Sirius wide for some time, so local dealers are selling a local variant of it


Or we could all just fly Sabres, I mean hell from IND to Lane Hackers to ...... hell almost anyone not fully lawful can fly them.

The purpose of the House Civilian ships was to give a little variety to the game, rather than have every generic IDed person flying the same old Eagle or Sabre. Mostly a way for mercs/freelancers etc. to show which house they originated from and to give 'poor' pirate groups like Gaians and Xenos an alternative ship to use without having to create them an entire ship line.

They're purely aethstetical changes, no balance difference with the Eagle. They're also a want, not a need, so I won't be disappointed if they're not added to the mod.

Not every ship submitted will make it in.

I'd still like to hear why exactly they won't be added. Clearly much of the community appreciates these ships, and would like to fly them in-game. So what is the reason you don't want 'em added?

If it's a technical issue, then you should have informed me so I could correct it.

Or maybe it's cause I'm not well liked by some members of the Dev team.

*shrugs*

I'm guessing the problem is you CONFUSED the Dev team.

I mean, hell, they 'balanced' ships that cant even shoot a gun their own length. Having a ship with several local flavor versions would proably be WAY too confusing.

They may accadently make outcash guns even MORE energy efficent for massive output than is allready the case.

If they don't want a little variety, it's fine by me. It's not like adding the ships would harm the mod in any way.

But then everyone and his brother couldnt fly the sabre!

Forget it. I don't want to start this on how ooRP the CTE is... Those should be only for lawfuls. Leave the old Eagle for unlawful groups like the ones you mentioned.

Why, XENOS use the CTE line even.

CTE line is CIVILAN. That means that ANYONE can get access to it.

It's like the Sabre, execpt people dont use it.

These ships were probably the only thing I was looking forward to in 4.86.

They may only be to look pretty, but it makes a huge difference. I'm sick of the boring old Eagle, and it's not like we Civvy-aligned people have much choice.
Boring Sabre, Boring Eagle, Crappy looking Wasupu, Crappy Virage... It's pathetic really.

And these ships aren't even the phallic bullcrap we're used to from jinx, they are nice ships.
Shame the haters are the dev team eh? Cause something so insignificant to you makes a whole lot of difference to people who'd like a little variety.
Eff Gallia right up it's metaphorical arse, I'm here to have fun and fly nice, pretty ships for killing things. These ships are a grand addition, widely used by alot of factions.

Opens up nice RP, makes sense, why not?

"BlahBlahBlah, Excuses"

Eff Gallia

Actualy, thats proably why they said no to ships whose only change is a new skin.

they DONT WANT VARIETTY in sirius, they need people to play in gallia, so they refuse to fix things, and entice people with unbalanced ships to get bluemsgs with.

=> Kitbash without working hitbox

As if the ships we have now have sensacal hitboxes.

And as Ashes asked..... why not TELL her it doesnt work

As for the hitboxes I can make some when I have time. The reason I left them as eagle/falcon hitboxes was because I wanted them all to be equal in terms of balance so that one was not chosen over the other for PvP purposes.

That said... she seems to explain it pretty good.

So you're saying, mister Dab, that we're not including these ships because you don't like them?

Wow, the dev team sure is free of bias these days.:dry:

I wonder if theyve learned yet how balance w/o killing off RP. I doubt it however.

[tansytansey]

This
corresponds with this:
House trains are modeled from the bottom and bare little resemblance to adv. train, the Kusari one is closest, but still everything on that ship is modeled from 0 and doesn't resemble the adv. train directly.

If they were done in same way as these - replace engine mount with house one and re-skin. They'd be refused in the same way.

You can scream about bias, unfairness and other things, simple fact is that these are ugly kitbashes. If you want to submit house civilian fighters, go on, but they should have comparable quality to all new disco ships.

So your only reason is you don't like the way they were built. Would it please you more if I built them from scratch yet made them look exactly the way they do now? Cause the reason I kitbashed was to save time. Whether they're ugly or not is your opinion, and not the general consensus of the community, who in most part seem to enjoy the way these models look.

The whole concept of the ships were that they were supposed to be modified Eagles. It's not like I'm so sapped for inspiration or terrible at modelling that I have to kitbash; I simply did it to save time. Same with the Cutlass, I built it off the Stiletto. Why bother rebuilding what's already been rebuilt?

Essentially you're not wanting these ships in the mod because of your personal opinion. Sorry, Igiss Jr., I didn't realise everything had to pass your personal approval first.

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Image turned into a URL because it made your sig too tall. -Zuke
|Ashes and Draya's Epic Adventure|Ashes "Nighthawk" Yotaka|Nightfall|Eva Jones|
[5:50:49 PM] JakeSG (William Darkmoor) says: I like you, Ashes. You're more cynical than God.

[GHOSTbielars]

I thought the modded Eagles were cool honestly. It says on the Eagles info card that its widely successful bc its so simple and whatnot. Well they could easily build a base eagle frame and sell that to house ship dealerships. CTE would personally would finish their own Eagles their way and sell it themselves, but across Sirius diff factions could finish the production of these Eagles and sell them their way. I wish every house had another NPC faction that was a ship building company. That would solve so many problems we have of "what ship can I use?". Well they would be like car dealerships today, as long as you dont kill someone on the way in you can buy one. They sell basic ships to make money, not sell them to only "allies".

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OHSH it's Igiss everyone look busy.