Ganking

[Ronnie Rayburn]

If it was RL, the generals wouldn't call off their men, just to give the enemy a fair chance. On the other hand, they wouldn't send their nations entire fleet out to kill one man. Seeing the scenes we often see in certain parts of the galaxy, is just laughable at some points. Two lonely chars in, i.e, a snub and a GB, having a hard time against 4 cruisers and a GB. Then a fighter and a BS arrives at the scene, and as if they were completely blind and stupid, ask if their allies at the scene need a hand! *facepalms*

And then when/if they get no for an answer... still decide to regard their fellow officers so incompetent that they still have to get involved in the fight. Common sense, people! Ganking to a certain degree is fine, but use your judgement. And if you wanna have a private duel... Go to Conn! Or agree on it within RP!

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[Knjaz]

Large ships wasting fuel (which also costs more than few coins) to hunt down single snub. Captain would be demoted to regular crew member, or even got a punishment after HC would see few bills for resupply.

3 cruisers for 1 bomber is indeed too much. At same time, he could face a tribunal if he was be able to, but did not prevent the death of his subordinates, or if he would act recklessly and charge at enemy with an equal or lesser force.

Fair fights is one of most ooRP things I've ever seen here, on par with Battleship chasing a fighter.

[Zynth]

Tactical advantage. All is fair in love & war. Superior numbers is an advantage, why not use it.

During real battles you don't see soldiers doing one on one pistol duels with spectators cheering the participants do you?

The only place where I believe people can "duel" with honour is Kusari, with a Kusarian going against another Kusarian. Taking into account the Kusarian standards of honour and whatnot.

Also, ZONERZONERZONERZONERZONER

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[Jihadjoe]

I tend to prefer making fights close, if possible. This is because I like the tension of it. If the fight is a foregone conclusion in either direction, I get extremely bored and tend to wander off.

If there is no risk of losing, what's the point in participating? And by the same token, if there's no hope of winning, what purpose does fighting serve?

In previous versions of the mod skill was an equalising factor to numbers. The frequency of instakills was higher. "I will kill this guy" had the emphasis on "I" and could be done in the middle of a furball, if you had sufficient skill to do so.

Removing unwelcome interlopers took a matter of seconds, rather than spending twenty minutes whitling them down, only to watch them dock on a junker base (again).

With the various instakill weapons removed or made less effective, and caps more able to shoot at snubs than they previously had been (gunboats getting auto-aim for example), the balance has been tipped in favour of large numbers of large ships.

This leads to me getting bored as hell. However there are some situation in which I think it's justified. Defending capital planets for eample. There are situations in which I think it is not justified too, for example when you're on the offensive.

I would rather not get bored. I would rather feel that every fight is one I can potentially lose, or potentially win. I'm pretty certain that most people would agree that without risk or hope, it's boring.

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[JayDee Kasane]

Tactical advantage. All is fair in love & war. Superior numbers is an advantage, why not use it.

During real battles you don't see soldiers doing one on one pistol duels with spectators cheering the participants do you?

The only place where I believe people can "duel" with honour is Kusari, with a Kusarian going against another Kusarian. Taking into account the Kusarian standards of honour and whatnot.

Also, ZONERZONERZONERZONERZONER

Yes, its true about realism. BUT! as over9000 players sayed ''screw realism. FL is not a RL'' so I must say that:

No realism? Kay. So let it be with server rules and fair play, kay? you came here to have fun, right? no to undock and being heavilly ganked by 5-10k more force, right?
And 4 hour rule is not that good as well. Really? FOUR hours?! why? why not one? or two? on my memory people trying to escape fight just to have a chance to fight again, not to go offline for four hours or go to another system/house
So again: ganking is egoistic act of lolwuts that doent care about Roleplay, Rules, Fair play and any human senses about being good (exept beeing good PvPer) that will lead to more and more gank in future.
(CCCP for example was heavy ganked in first 2-3 weeks on this server by OC, IMG, CR etc... and returned this gank later and blowed forums out with all QQ about ''CCCP GANK NOOBS!!!'' and all that piece of crap and exuses from same OC/IMG/CR... long story short: you make gank-you will be ganked in revenge, this revenge wil lead to another and more and more and more)

P.S. O_O What a big tail I made...

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[Jihadjoe]

I forgot to mention

ZONERZONERZONERZONER.

I voted "only in specific circumstances" but that's completely representative of my opinion.

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[Stoat]

I tend to prefer making fights close, if possible. This is because I like the tension of it. If the fight is a foregone conclusion in either direction, I get extremely bored and tend to wander off.

If there is no risk of losing, what's the point in participating? And by the same token, if there's no hope of winning, what purpose does fighting serve?

I would rather not get bored. I would rather feel that every fight is one I can potentially lose, or potentially win. I'm pretty certain that most people would agree that without risk or hope, it's boring.

This. It's a game, after all, and is meant to be about fun. While some folks might think it fun to counter a single GB with 3 cruisers, 2 GBs and 4 fighters/bombers, I don't.


ZONERZONERZONERZONERZONER


Edit: Joe is very useful. He usually says what I want to say, so I don't have to go through all the hassle of thinking up the right words myself. Thanks Joe

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My Stories

[robosquirrel]

I tend to prefer making fights close, if possible. This is because I like the tension of it.

Then you should make sure you make your fights really take place in an environment where there is little risk for "outsiders" to stumble on your fight and join because their RP status demands it.

If you stage your fight in a place where, lets say LPI or LN indies, will have no choice but see your, lets say [LN] vs HF, battle, and if you are telling them to stay out of it because you want to satisfy your personal need for PvP tension, you are thereby destroying their and the surrounding player's RP atmosphere. Its pretty much like talking oorp. "No your help would be a waste of resources" while in fact your side is at risk of losing (thereby losing human and materiel resources) or "// stay out this is my PvP duel"... its really the same, only one is clearly oorp driven baloney RP while the other is maybe oorp and a bit self-centered/selfish, but at least honest.

In my opinion, if you are asking others not to join so the fight stays close, you are putting your personal PvP preferences above the server RP. You can make close fights with people who want it, but don't try to force everyone around you to always fight on the terms that you wish for. That's what I see constantly everywhere on the server.

If the fight is a foregone conclusion in either direction, I get extremely bored and tend to wander off.
...
If there is no risk of losing, what's the point in participating?
...
And by the same token, if there's no hope of winning, what purpose does fighting serve?

Your perspective is again only focusing on one thing: the PvP thrill, and the search for the feeling of having shown that you are better at PvP than the adversary, by trying to score "deserverd" wins, and not "undesevered" ones.

There are, many other aspects to fights, in particular RP aspects. First, the feeling that you are playing your role in a realistic way, and that you are contributing to immersion into the RP universe, for yourself and for others. The feeling of being immersed in the RP universe. That feeling is often shot to smithereens by players who say "no dont fulfill your RP role, I am trying to get a PvP thrill here and am trying to look fair in a fight". If you character is a hotshot pilot, sure you can say "I want to kill him myself and prove to everyone that I'm the bigger man". But if you say "no lets give our mortal enemey a chance to kill at least half our fleet before we win, because thats more fair. We also save some fuel, even if we lose half our ships (and the fuel in them)", your character can't really be anything else but mentally challanged.

However there are some situation in which I think it's justified. Defending capital planets for eample. There are situations in which I think it is not justified too, for example when you're on the offensive.

The problem is that when you encourage people to complain when ever they think a fight wasnt fair, they will do it when ever they get frustrated because they didnt win. They do it when flying up to the capitol planet of their enemy where an armada is waiting for them. They do it when they fly up to a hostile station and one person starts a one vs one with them, and when an ally of that person sees his wingman in danger, he will help without much talk before. And, yeah, I have seen you complain about 1 person helping another in precicely the situation you just described as justified (after you lost a 2 vs 1). And I've seen you attack another person with greater numbers in exactly the same situations (3 vs 1 and 4 vs 1). The single player was within 10k of an enemy base in both situations. The thing is this "fainess" and "justified in this situation" always turns out to be what is more convenient at the moment, for everyone.

I would rather not get bored. I would rather feel that every fight is one I can potentially lose, or potentially win. I'm pretty certain that most people would agree that without risk or hope, it's boring.

For the people who find other aspects than proving your skill in PvP by killing enemies in number-ballanced fights of the game interesting, there are many other things that keep them from getting bored. Role play. Surviving against superior numbers. Having been able to gain the tactical advantage through strategic thinking. I find this "lets fly around on a RP server looking for ballanced PvP to show everyone what great pilots we are" a but one-sided. And if those arent interesting for you, you can always do your arranged ballanced PvP in places where you wont interfere with other people's RP.

[Dashiell]

Another one of these?

my 2 cents

- It's a game. it's meant to be fun. getting ganked to hell isn't fun. yes, it's realistic to gank. However, this is a game. Games are meant to be fun et etc etc....

- Getting ganked but then still coming out on top is the best feeling ever with regards to disco.

- Going down as a spartan is also fun at times: drag as many down with you as you can.

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[Ursus]

If there is no risk of losing, what's the point in participating?

The point would be to prevent them from attacking again with the same ships in the next four hours, without losing any of our own ships in the process.

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