New York PVP?

[Spear]

I'm not against people flying the small ships Xoria, A few days ago in my Patriot I stopped a high level trader carrying Counterfeit software. I could not even graze his sheilds and he nearly had me a couple of times. I continued to CD him and called for help on system comm and thankfully an independant LSF arrived in a VHF and we struck him down :D

I think it was Jinx that engaged one of my Xeno Eagles the other day in her lvl 30 Patriot, I offered the brave LPI a chance to retreat that she refused to take and I was forced to blow her to smithereens!

Lower class ships can be RP'd beutifully and are only cannon fodder if you choose them to be, the same is true of any ship. It's exactly the same thing as being over level 30 and being engaged by a vastly superior ship. It's true people could swap to a civillian ID and blast lawful NPC's under the proposed new rule. But then I dont see how your suggestion stops these under level Xeno's from doing the same as before. I can ignore an under level 30 Civillan ID player as they are immune to RP and PVP attack. It annoys me that a Xeno ID player does this though in full view of us all.

Has anyone else noticed that we now have a neutral ID again? We're just calling it the Civilian ID now, and it expires at rank 40. Guess what nearly every storage ship and armory will soon be ID'd as; and back in NY with impunity.

With the greatest respect you realise this is wrong don't you? Civillian ID's above level 30 are not immune to RP or attack and any storage above level 40 Cannot use a civillian ID.

Something needs to be done about under level civillians being accosted. The whole point of this thread is exactly the opposite of what you wrote in that quote. The under level 30 civillian ID has not been neutral. Under level 30 civillians are being murdered with a passion in all systems and it has to stop now! You said it yourself, you were killed in a level 5 starbug by not one but two players, that's disgraceful.

Maybe it's getting late but I just do not see your suggestion as being simpler or better than what Igiss already posted.

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[mwerte]

On another note...I don't see any reason why keeping a character under level to scare other under levels is such a problem...The other guys can always run away.

The new players have to learn RP at some point. And to me...this is a good introduction to Discovery. RP, PvP, adrenalin and chaos. Its just a game...And by getting rid of 'us' your making that silver run to easy...Which also makes it booring, and that leads to "this is not getting me anywhere" and that leads to begging....and loans, and all kinds of stuff...Then rule violations happen, because the newbies have more credits then they know what to do with.

13, Getting killed as soon as I luanch from Manhatten is what brought me to Disco, I had this happen to me on other servers and it just pissed me off and made me leave. Don't force the newbies to leave.

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[RParade]

No! Under level 30 players who hold an ID have chosen to be part of RP and should not be immune to attack from over level 30 ID holders. What we have at the moment is a spate of under level Xenos etc flying around in full view of lawfuls shooting lawful NPC's and generally acting like complete muppets!

Totally agreed.

For every 1 decently roleplayed pirate/Hacker you see, there are at least 10 others who'll be total wankers and jerks on a universal scale.

I think regardless of level, if you engage another ship you should be attackable. Especially if you're a Xeno who mindlessly fights on Manhattan's porch on a daily basis, which most of them seem to do (and I've seen a few LH characters do this too, so).

I like the new rule. Newbies need the opportunity to learn about the mod first before having to fend for their lives everywhere they go (including New York, which, roleplay wise, essentially is a "safezone" - every installation there is Military-affiliated and you find more Navy patrols there than you will anywhere else).

If you fly a dagger and you pop some poor chap's CSV, then I can't really see anything being wrong with some random BS coming along and popping your dagger. It's okay if a newbie gets raped after being logged on for one hour, but suddenly it's not if it happens to a pirate character? Hrm. Funny logic, that.

PS: FYI, camping Manhattan and New York engaging newbies is not how you teach them roleplay.

[RickJames]

I think anyone under level 30 "Civillian" ID player should be immune from attack in ALL systems. I think the soulution should be if you have chosed a faction and bought the ID you have chosen to be part of RP and may be attacked by anyone of your enemies regardless of your level.

Well...we need to close the loop whole more than this. The issue now is not really protecting underlevel players. It is more about making sure dumbasses dont manipulate the rules in there favor.

I think PVP should not be allowed by any under level players. They can not be attacked by any player anywere. And more important they are not allowed to attack anyone anywere for any reason.

[Xoria]

I guess Spear and I are each most concerned with the opposite extremes of this issue.

Spear is more concerned about under rank 30 characters abusing PvP with impunity.

I am more concerned about over rank 30 characters attacking/hunting/killing under rank 30 characters due to the huge discrepancy in firepower and armor.

At this point, all I can do is start repeating my earlier points, so I'll end my posts in this thread with :



Good debate.

I personally, and The Lane Hacker Clan generally, will figure out how to most enjoyably play the game according to whatever rules we end up with.







And I concede some exaggeration on my part regarding armories and storage ships.

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[RonG777]

*Quote Igiss...
5.4 Attacking characters of level 29 and below is prohibited. Characters under level 30 cannot be attacked by players of any level, except if they have non-Civilian ID onboard, and except cases of self-defense.*

I been reading all these arguments..
And I think you all are making it more difficult than it should

Anyone who starts out on Discovery, (especially since the global server is dead), most likely has to come to the forums 1st..

This rule is clear, simple, and to the point..

I suggest we use this standard of rule making:

K.I.S.S. = Keep It Simple, Silly!...:laugh:

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[tfmachad]

Xoria, don't get me wrong with this one, but I disagree with you, man. If a player is so engaged into the server's RP why will he be exempt from the universe and placed in a completely different tier? Maybe I'm reading it wrong...

Say a lawful under leveled player (bellow the lvl 30 threshold) flees a too under leveled unlawful player and runs to a gathering of lawful HFs and VHFs asking for help. They'd have to say, "Sorry chaps, this universe you belong we can't cross. Best of lucks!

I say again, maybe I read it wrong, but what you propose strikes me as separating Disco's universe in two overlapping tiers, and I fail to grasp how that can be anything but disruptive.

What bothers me is that if you decide to roleplay a smaller ship, you should really roleplay it. I mean, if you're in a small ship, you don't go to right into the belly of the beast, the NPCs do it all the time and fail, and they do because it's a dumb thing to do. What's the sense of entering the heart of Manhattan in a puny little vessel when there's giant ships flying up and down?

I can understand the LPI flying Light Fighters, they are inside a safer zone for them. They have the backing of the military forces and they can run and hide inside their big friendly stations.

I don't know man, I respect you greatly, but what you propose makes no sense to me whatsoever from an RP standpoint. Maybe you're right and there should be more diversity in the server when it comes to ship classes and I really liked what you guys done with the LH. But I also think that perhaps you should re-think your general strategy if what concerns you is not being able to face larger, more prepared forces.

Also, I fail to see the problem. I've fought your light fighters the other day and got literally owned by them in my VHF. Someone (perhaps it was even you that said it) mentioned that LFs stand little chance when facing bigger ships while undocking from a jumpgate for example. But we do have rules written down to prevent dock killing.

Anyway, I can't really put weight to my arguments since I don't actually fly a LF nor had an extensive experience with them after I got my bearings in the server. Maybe I'm missing something here.

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[Reise]

Liking the discussion so far. I want to make sure people understand this isn't just one person pulling this sort of "loophole" though, Xeno players are flying right by other LPI players without consequence because of their level.

I can imagine it wouldn't be as much of a problem if the people RPing Liberty forces stepped up their under-level presence though. It just looks wrong and plays wrong to have Xenos flying about NY blasting NPC's and disabling trade lanes without any worry. It just feels like they're intentionally using their level to bully lower level players and NPCs while being "immune" from attacks from people 30+. RP-wise it's even worse, since Xenos would likely be killed on sight by any Liberty forces, and here they are flying around outside Manhattan.

As for other under-level players, I really haven't seen any issue outside the ones the Xeno players are causing. People generally don't want to bother each other before level 30 I guess.

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[Equinox]

Wow this is pretty lame.

If unlawfuls are using the under level rule to get away with being attacked in new York (or any system) by the lawful's and are also using those underlevel chars to attack new members of discovery that have just arrived then theres something really wrong there.

Im all for RP but there has to be fair play involved and if thats going on its far from fair.

Ive said it before and ill say it again i don't care if you want to fly a light fighter, thats your choice, but put a couple of mill on it so your over level.

You could even make it a rule that your not allowed to have a faction ID if your under level 30, that would stop this.

Or make the ID more expensive so when they buy and mount it it takes them over level 30.

Honestly going after new players trying to make there first bit of credits mining/bringing back silver is downright lame.

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[Xoria]

I'm not going to rehash my points anymore.
Anyone who doesn't understand them, conduct an experiment and come fly a Dagger through the LH Trainee criteria and I think you'll see what I mean.
Or if you prefer, do it in a Bloodhound as a Liberty Rogue.

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