Announcement Regarding Rule 1.2

[Mímir]

There is the main problem, highlighted in green, you are exclusively killing, in your words, certain Traders every time they log. Isn't this a bit excessive?

Alright, that was my mistake. I should have worded it more delicately. I don't kill them each time they log, what I meant to say is that each time I am online, and I notice that my main character's adversaries are also online, I log to interact with them. That often results in shooting, as my character is as hostile as gets towards them, and they towards me.

How are these people, and I assume they are grouped together, detrimental to Gameplay?

Much like PVP'ers and roleplayers check the online list for players to interact with, a huge number of traders and suppliers do the exact same thing to avoid interaction. That is detrimental to gameplay, yes, even if it is 5 people in a group avoiding everyone else.

I take it you dislike Base Builders and the people who RP around their Bases. And somehow you have decided to go on a one man crusade to put all the perceived wrongs right.

Mind you, it wouldn't be a one-man crusade if 'Burg was more busy playing his Gaian than smoking weed and posting on the forum To use a specific example, that one base only exists on the grace of lack of Corsair/Gaian players - in lore it seems implausible to build on top of Holmfirth overnight npnp (truth is, I am happy they did, so that there is action).

When my Corsair character, that has existed since before this PoB, undocks a fine morning to find a BMM base and some security/BAF base 14K away, it is of vital importance for him to remove that base. Now this is the character I play, and it is well within pre-defined roleplay, so it is of some importance to me, as the player, that I can actually act out my character's role. Afterall, this is a roleplaying game, that is the reason the majority of us logs.

---------------------------------ON-TOPIC PART---------------------------------

Before, I could cover my behind by excessive screen shots and logs, but what now? Will I have to ask the people I pirate how they feel about it? Should I submit a questionnaire? How do I find certainty that I can play my character without the risk of impending admin doom?

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I think that is a serious cost, and cause of doubt, and a question that deserves an answer, because what is the benefit? Unless there is some admin purge on the horizon, I don't see what the statement actually does, besides from adding unnecessary doubts.

This Game is for multiple people to enjoy and not just one person or a small group's gratification at the expense of others.

I wholeheartedly agree, but at the core it is a multiplayer social roleplay game, it is not a single-player game we play alongside one another. Your actions can have consequences for me and vice versa, and that is what makes this game worthwhile to some extent.

Not everyone is interested in shooting others and if that is all you are interested in then there are others that enjoy that side only. So why don't you go and play with them?

It is hard to find good fights outside of Conneticut and events unless you spill a little blood or step on a few people's toes. Blues and system wide panic messages from innocent traders is the perfect bait for white knighting players. If I could just "go play with them" outside of Conn, I most certainly would, but that is not how the server works, especially with the lower player count.

Your second paragraph just seems your way of justifying it to a) yourself and b) others. I just feel the need to let you know, and I am sure others feel the same, that you don't have to do this for me as I could enjoy the Game just as well, or even more so, if you didn't go on this one man Crusade.

How does my crusade affect you, why do you have an opinion on it? Again, as I tried to say earlier, we are all different people. Some like no challenge, some like to be challenged. I know there are traders seeking out the most dangerous routes for the thrill of it. I bet you too that you would be bored in the long run if there were no pirates and no real sense of danger. There'd be no "game", no point in playing. It's not like NPC's or making ridiculous amounts of credits is difficult in any way, it is the other players that provide the challenge.

Mimir, you should try to lighten up...seriously. You have this specific paranoid narrative already built up in your brain that is based up on nothing but assumptions.

Of course my post is based on assumptions, derived from experience no less. How is yours or St. Denis' post any different in that respect? If anything, you are making some pretty deep assumptions about me here.

If you feel guilt about it & only do it to help the server from "power-hungry, money-grubbing, base-supplying power-traders" that you deem are detrimental to gameplay, then you're doing & thinking it wrong.

No on a player level I just try to be the antithesis to that for some balance. In the specific case I like the action that Manchester base brings, I think it is "unfair" or unbalanced towards Gaians now and in the future that they weren't rich in numbers when somebody decided to build a base. The whole PoB thing is very unbalanced that way, there needs to be someone present to oppose it, or that part of space is forever lost, no matter what previous lore might have stated. That's a shame.

If everyone was powertrading, where would the interaction be? If everyone were pirates, were would the action be? If everyone are playing LNS ships, where would the in-rp war be? It is slowly happening, and the very fact that you can build bases 14K from existing Gaian installations goes to show that more people ought to play the badguy to regain the balance. I try to do the opposite of most people do to ensure my own online time is maximized, and I don't think that is wrong. As a side effect I do think that is beneficial to the server overall, that players do their best try to spread out activities in even numbers. That I happen to play a Corsair character with a burning red hatred towards BMM is just a fortunate coincidende, personally I don't hate anything on this server except for botfeeding and sometimes mines.

It's not your place to put the weight of the server on your shoulders, & it seems you have some trouble separating character knowledge from player knowledge. You really should rethink the logic of why you do what you do & the reason it's making you paranoid

I think you are reading too much into things.

Disclaimer: This is just a forum discussion. I am applying the precautionary principle and focus on the negatives, the costs, rather than the benefits. That is not because I am paranoid or cynical on a personal level, I assure you that neither this forum nor the game matters very little in my emotional life, but because it is the soundest method of inquiry. When a new rule is imposed it is wise to look at the costs, and it is fair to debate them, and that is what I am currently trying to do.

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[Siren Stone]

I'll make this simpe to understand for anyone that hasn't figured out what this all means yet...

Follow the rules, have fun, and this will not matter nor apply to you.

Safe Flying.

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[Mímir]

Wow.

How about everybody just adheres to one rule: "Do not be a total asshole that moves around hurting people consciously".

Done.

It is not hard. Really. It is not.

But that just brings us back to the lack of definition in the statement, Jack. We can all agree on what you said, however our views of "being an asshole" all differ because we are different people. I might see certain base-building projects as "asshole-moves", you might see piracy-projects as "asshole-moves".

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[Marburg]

Well Mimir, I'll grant ya I made some assumptions myself since I can only go by what you post, but since you mentioned yourself that you're being paranoid, me calling you paranoid is not one of those assumptions.

Wow.

How about everybody just adheres to one rule: "Do not be a total asshole that moves around hurting people consciously".

Done.

It is not hard. Really. It is not.

This. & it's been said a thousand different ways for years
...point by point text walls are not really needed when this concept is truly understood

I'll tell ya, I 'effin HATE pob's...it's one of those things that seems like a cool addition on the surface, but as with most everything else in the world, the cliche' "Be careful what you wish for" applies.

Now that we have them & I'm back flying on the server, I can choose to be reactionary & kill what I hate with fire & justify my RP to fit my personal feelings (& I'm convinced I can do it in a way that will glare right back at the evil eye the admins may cast on me if I did)

What I'm choosing to do so far is to not be reactionary, because I'm wise enough to know that doesn't really work...Since I can't control what other people do or how they react, I simply choose to ignore the existence of pob's altogether & so far, it's working out just fine.

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[Mímir]

Well ok, I don't like how all this turned into how I am an asshole, when all I wanted was to point out how the "don't be an arse" is highly subjective and pointless to include in a framework of rules, unless of course you pin some definitions on it. Don't know why that is so hard to grasp. I don't destroy bases, I lack the patience and dedication for it. I'm not reactionary, you are still going off with your assumptions Marburg, chill for a minute. That is assuming that the reactionary bit was directed at me

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[Marburg]

I never said you destroy bases...I said that I myself hate pob's

what I was honing in on was back when you said, "Well to be frank, I have been running a one-man siege killing off a truckload of traders each time they log"
I was simply using my hatred of pob's to offer a parallel to your logic. I guess I could have been more direct

IMHO, "being an arse" is not really all that subjective when using a game mechanic to go after people...that's why I mentioned concern of player knowledge vs character knowledge.

Don't get me wrong, if you honestly think that what you're doing is all above board, then there's absolutely nothing to be worried about & no reason why this announcement should be of any concern to you in the least

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[Remnant]

Alright folks, lets keep things a little nicer, and back on subject. Tangents are fine. Just don't let them go too far down, or turn into an argument.

[Mímir]

Hey the post you are replying to got made invisible by some guy who thought I was targetting you, I think? Got a PM too, don't know what's up with that.

Either way, we are digressing. I "go after people" to the same extent navy characters go after pirates, that LNS logs to defend Texas from RNC etc. etc. etc. etc.

The point is, where is the line between playing the game and abusing the game, now that admins say they are more vigilant? What is the point of telling us they are more vigilant, when they do not clearly draw the line? The "if you've got nothing to hide/you've done nothing wrong, you've got nothing to fear" is incredibly faulty, and I do think you can agree with me on that point if you think of certain other areas that aren't topics for discussion on this forum, where the argument is used.

W/E, the statement is here and that can't be changed, I just hope perhaps a bit more thought is put into similar statements and their effects in the future.

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[Thyrzul]

if you honestly think that what you're doing is all above board, then there's absolutely nothing to be worried about & no reason why this announcement should be of any concern to you in the least

Thing is, it doesn't matter what he thinks, and/or if he thinks it's right or wrong, what matters here is what Admins think about what is right and what is wrong. And without a clear definition of terms like "detrimental", without Admins specifying the mindset they will judge by, even those who's intentions are far from breaking rules, and only want to try out new aspects of the chosen role of their character within the scope of rules, even those players will worry, no matter how much you tell them not to. If the boundaries are not clear, no one can ever be hundred percent sure about whether they break a rule or not.

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[Sath]

And today I was confused as to whether pirate a miner that I just blew up 30 minutes ago, but is mining in the field again freely, with me watching in doubts. I had to clarify in several chats, if I can pirate him again.

This rule is already having a toll on my FL, halp.