Are outcast cap ships now open to any ID?

[AdamantineFist]

Waaa...? British and Arabic? Where?

---

[n00bl3t]

My arguement has been both coherent and worthwhile. I don't use capitols for adding loudness and I find your use of a Montaigne quote to be a tad patronising. I use capitol letters to put emphasis on a point. The main thrust of my arguement if you will. In real life should you ever hear me, I will never raise my voice except when in a noisy environment.

I have found Akumabitos methods of arguement to be lacking in reason almost entirely, this has admittedly frustrated me, as I'm sure it would anyone who loves a good debate.

1. This is not about indy vs faction.

2. I have offered to help people write RP for their battleships should they need it.

3. I like seeing friendly well RP'd capships around, both form the winning a fight perspective and from the good rp point of veiw.

4. I want to promote good rp.

5. None of these things have been satifactoraly addressed by Akumabito, who has instead blindly ignored most of the actual words I have writen here, and in most cases attempted to twist them to his own purposes so he can salvage some dignity form a lost arguement.

6. The RM, KNF and liberty people have been doing this for a long time. We are the first criminal faction to attempt it, this seems to be the cause of everyones angst.

7. The outcasts have an organised naval force, we must therefore reflect this with our RP.

8. We offer people a chance to fly the ship they want to, that is a hell of a lot more than those folks in Rhienland do.

9. Infact we actively promote the existance of well RP'd capships while minimising the the impact that out of roleplay individuals have on the game as a whole.

10. Shunting people whos roleplay is non existant around will eventualy work, as they will have nowhere to go and cap-spam left in the end, and will either roleplay to earn the ship, or stop cap-spamming

11. It is really easy to get your ship registered with us if you want it to be. We have to take a blanket measure like this because of the scale of the problem. We are not 'targeting' anyone. There is no discrimination. Infact we have the very same proceedures with our own capships in the faction.

Is that clear enough for you?

Edit: If you want examples of the problem we face then I could find the screenie I have of no less than three OC dessies sitting over Manhatten all with Rhienland type names silently killing any undocking lawful and saying "lool" ever time they get a kill.

Or how about the report I filed on one particular outcast tagged and ID'd player who blew up my cardimine filled, smuggler ID'd, Pirate train right over malta without a word said, while I was chatting amiably and in roleplay with a very high ranking outcast who I was also in a skype chat with.

Or the OC ID and tag dessie that killed my lvl 5 merc character with a civvy ID before I had put any cash on it.

Does that illustrate the problem for you? All of that has happened to me ALONE! The Outcast faction members, such as myself, get almost weekly calls to reign in the people who do this stuff as we are supposed to represent the outcast hierachy. When we try to do so we get complaint from people who haven't even seen the problem and as far as I am aware don't have an outcast character (if any of you do I would like to know who they are, just for the sake of seeing how you perceive the Outcasts and would like to have them RP'd). I think that this arguement is now just flogging the dead horse and I hope that my above post puts the damn thing in its grave once and for all. The arguement became pointless a long time ago now. I am only carrying on because I still see no reason in the arguements that are countering me.

Thank goodness this is FL not RL.

6) Why don't you find out why it is that everyone's angst? Why is everyone so angst if you "get almost weekly calls to reign in the people who do this stuff"?. Calls?

8) We're talking about OC's here, not Rheinland. If Akumabito wanted to talk about Rheinland he would have posted the topic name with "rheinland" instead of "outcast".

2) Hmm. We'll see about this.

I've got one char in my sig. Apart from that, I fancy not being continually KOS to Ros or 101st for my statements.

Edit:

Waaa...? British and Arabic? Where?

Malta's history as a country in RL. I'll scan the page and photobucket it if you want?

---

Anything I say is not intended as offensive, and to try and deliberately misinterpret it as such would be an attempt at trolling via misrepresentation.

It's not a conspiracy, it's localised bias. They're not intelligent enough to form a conspiracy.

[AdamantineFist]

Well, judging from what got accepted by the registry thingy, I'd say you'd get be all right with that. Honestly, that's all it takes. Oh, and you spelled "Armament" wrong in your story.;)

---

[Dopamino]

RL Malta doesn't count here...

---

I mostly lurk around Media Center these days.

[n00bl3t]

Well, judging from what got accepted by the registry thingy, I'd say you'd get be all right with that. Honestly, that's all it takes. Oh, and you spelled "Armament" wrong in your story.;)

I still haven't posted in the registry, I'll get down to it when I can.
N and M are so close on the keyboard.

RL Malta doesn't count here...

But it certainly does influence the game...so if it doesn't count...how much fun can I have with that statement?:sleep:

---

Anything I say is not intended as offensive, and to try and deliberately misinterpret it as such would be an attempt at trolling via misrepresentation.

It's not a conspiracy, it's localised bias. They're not intelligent enough to form a conspiracy.

[Akumabito]

[quote name='JihadJoe' date='May 24 2008, 07:42 PM' post='256610']
1. This is not about indy vs faction.[/quote]

No, it's about faction vs. Indie. Your faction is targeting indies, right? By any definition that makes this faction vs. indie.

[quote name='JihadJoe' date='May 24 2008, 07:42 PM' post='256610']
2. I have offered to help people write RP for their battleships should they need it.[/quote]

And that makes no difference whatsoever, because you are still holding up a hoop and telling them "jump through this or we'll pvp whore you out of your ship."

That's right, right?

[quote name='JihadJoe' date='May 24 2008, 07:42 PM' post='256610']
3. I like seeing friendly well RP'd capships around, both form the winning a fight perspective and from the good rp point of veiw.[/quote]

So does everyone, but as I have pointed out many times your scheme doesn't achieve that goal any better than methods that would have zero impact on the majority of indies who do RP.

[quote name='JihadJoe' date='May 24 2008, 07:42 PM' post='256610']
4. I want to promote good rp.[/quote]

So does everyone, but requiring people to register doesn't equal good rp, as you well know. I could register a destroyer and still be a total oorp leet arse on the server, or be a good rp player but not like you going out of rp to threaten to pvp whore me because I don't register.

What you are doing is classic government bureaucracy, putting a layer on top of things that has no positive influence on the situation, and claiming you are doing something positive because you are the government and you have the power.

[quote name='JihadJoe' date='May 24 2008, 07:42 PM' post='256610']
5. None of these things have been satifactoraly addressed by Akumabito, who has instead blindly ignored most of the actual words I have writen here, and in most cases attempted to twist them to his own purposes so he can salvage some dignity form a lost arguement.[/quote]

Actually, I have answered these over and over while you and the other clan dictators refuse to do anything but ignore the discourse.

Answer my questions for once, show some backbone. Or is that asking too much of you?

[quote name='JihadJoe' date='May 24 2008, 07:42 PM' post='256610']
6. The RM, KNF and liberty people have been doing this for a long time. We are the first criminal faction to attempt it, this seems to be the cause of everyones angst.[/quote]

And? If one guy rapes two women and gets away with it does that make it OK for another guy to rape one?

[quote name='JihadJoe' date='May 24 2008, 07:42 PM' post='256610']
7. The outcasts have an organised naval force, we must therefore reflect this with our RP.[/quote]

Not every outcast is organized, in fact few should be. Outcasts are drug dealers and druggies. Ever see scarface?

Your taking the RP faction of sterile carty huffing dead enders and trying to play them as if they are bretonia's finest. If that's your RP, that's fine, but there s still room for the carty hazed regular loser outcast. Or at least there was until you started dictating other peoples RP in order to throw your weight around.

[quote name='JihadJoe' date='May 24 2008, 07:42 PM' post='256610']
8. We offer people a chance to fly the ship they want to, that is a hell of a lot more than those folks in Rhienland do. [/quote]

So what? This isn't about the RM, who are virtually absent from the server anyway. This is about you and your clan. If the RM jumped off a bridge would you?

[quote name='JihadJoe' date='May 24 2008, 07:42 PM' post='256610']
9. Infact we actively promote the existance of well RP'd capships while minimising the the impact that out of roleplay individuals have on the game as a whole. [/quote]

No, you don't. If that was true you wouldn't hassle every cap ship owner no matter how their RP was.

[quote name='JihadJoe' date='May 24 2008, 07:42 PM' post='256610']
10. Shunting people whos roleplay is non existant around will eventualy work, as they will have nowhere to go and cap-spam left in the end, and will either roleplay to earn the ship, or stop cap-spamming[/quote]

No they won't, there will always be a sleepy clan or no clan like the BHG. If you did manage to persecute every indie flying a OC cap out o one, which you can't do, there is always some other cap to fly.

In fact, by persicuting all the indies instead of just the poor RP'rs, you are encouraging cap ship whoring.

[quote name='JihadJoe' date='May 24 2008, 07:42 PM' post='256610']
11. It is really easy to get your ship registered with us if you want it to be. We have to take a blanket measure like this because of the scale of the problem. We are not 'targeting' anyone. There is no discrimination. Infact we have the very same proceedures with our own capships in the faction.[/quote]

The difference is people in the faction are there by choice. You are forcing people, under threat of pvp whoring them out of any fun on the server, to do something they didn't choose to do, no matter how good their RP.

That's simply wrong of you, no different than stealing some weak kids lunch money because you didn't have enough to eat.

[quote name='JihadJoe' date='May 24 2008, 07:42 PM' post='256610']
Edit: If you want examples of the problem we face then I could find the screenie I have
[/quote]

Go ahead. I find it very amusing that you use an example that your current bullying has no chance to cure, OC ships in Liberty space.

Did you even think about that? Apparently not.

So post all the screenies you have. Of course you and I both know you won't, because it would prove my point, that this so called problem with the indies is no real problem, just an excuse for pvp whoring.

[Akumabito]

No, it isn't. Blood Dragons didn't leavve because they weren't allowed battleships.

No, they left because the new government PvP whored them, just like the 101st wants to do with the indies.

As I said, anyone who is declared a traitor by any faction has a place to go, keeping their equipment. PM me and we'll get it going.

[Varyag]

/signed akumabito

Using the RM as an example of what to do has been tried and failed so many times. The RM do what they do because they are the RM and they are good at it. They also have the RP to back it up. I have never seen someone RP getting a cruiser like the RM are doing now (way to go Gonath).

From my own opinion and from others who share mine (there are many), it is not about keeping the RP good for caps that is makeing people mad, it is someone thinking that it is their right to give the nod or not give the nod to a ship or someones RP. Even if every ship out there is approved, they would still have to go to the 101st and have them say yes or no which is crap. It doesn't matter how long the 101st has been on the server or how many custom systems they have, they are not the law. End or story.

If you see someone doing something oorp with a cap or doing something stupid, explain to them what they are doing wrong. Show them what to do. If they still act like idiots, report them.

We are not going to solve any problem by PVPing someone into the ground who has a cap and abuses it. You are just going to make them go somewhere else and continue to abuse it. By PVPing someone into the ground as a faction you are actually fostering that this is ok thus making it worste.

A better way to handle this would have been instead of a forced registration, just a voluntary roll call. Then we could have helped each other with RP rather then going at each other's throats. The same people that responded to the registry would have responded to this plus a few others and would have fostered some great RP.

A good military leader knows when it is better to discuss rather then use a heavy hand. Haveing actually been a miliatry leader in the field and in combat (US Army 8 years), I know this is true.

Basilisk, Outcast

---

"I looked up and all I saw was green death"

[Thexare]

Speaking as someone completely uninvolved in this...

Akumabito, look around you. You are in a hole. Please put the shovel down.

I'm siding with the 101st here. Their request is very simple, entirely understandable, and not nearly as strict as you seem to think. And you are greeting it with far too much hostility, as though you read two lines of the original declaration and refused to listen after that.

[Akumabito]

Speaking as someone completely uninvolved in this...

Akumabito, look around you. You are in a hole. Please put the shovel down.

I'm siding with the 101st here. Their request is very simple, entirely understandable, and not nearly as strict as you seem to think. And you are greeting it with far too much hostility, as though you read two lines of the original declaration and refused to listen after that.

What does your post do at this point? I'm looking around, what do I see? A lot of outcast clan members supporting their right to PvP whore indies for not kissing their backside. Is that a hole? No, it's just a bunch of outcast clan members supporting their right to PvP whore indies for not kissing their backside.

Your support of them is based on what? Which of the points brought up do you have an opinion on, and why?

Or are you just a cheerleader for the 101st?

If you are going to post, bring something to the topic, don't just be a cheerleader.