How to make Discovery better?

[n00bl3t]

Yes, let us all be nice to each other, not flame and not like an idiot in-game or on the forums. Sounds good right? (The answer is yes.)

Point being, that has as much chance as me feeding Pluto barbeque chips as it rests in my backyard after one long party the previous night.

So, after reading the previous thread I realised the "problem", a term which is to be used lightly since factions already have enough power to deal with "role-play challenged" players, was being approached incorrectly.

It is not about making factions better, it is about making Discovery better. Hence, there should be advantages and disadvantages to being in an official player faction, and there should be advantages and disadvantages to not being in an official player faction.

Independent non-existence. Apologies extremists, the chances of it happening are quite low. I am sure, deep down with whatever large or little count of brain cells you have, you know it will change the mod and not for the better. This is Discovery, not Freeworlds. We are also talking about making factions better, not dropping an anvil on everyone else.

Custom ship-lines. Whilst I would support it, unfortunately, adding more ships, for every faction can give rise to problems. It makes the mod bigger, much bigger, if every official faction were to get a ship or two, and all these ships would need balancing. A lot more work, however, it may be worth the effort.

Pre-emptive capital ship requests, probationary periods, official faction approval and all associated phrases to describe similar actions. So far, every capital ship registry I have seen go up, has either fallen out of use because the official factions and/or their nominated manager of the registry has failed in keeping the registry up to date, or has resulted in egotistical self-inflation and bias decisions. As for probationary periods, it should be innocent before being proven guilty. (Take the ship away if repeated, provable abuses can be shown.)

To be quite blunt, I would like to know why official faction players want more control of independent players. Are you insecure? Or is it just jealousy that they can trade for the credits and you cannot? Perhaps I am wrong, however, at the moment there are a lot of controls. The server rules, read them. This keeps out most of the role-play challenged players. Apart from that, if someone is being a problem within an NPC faction, you can re-adjust their reputation. Everyone knows what happened to the Apocalypse_ and various other groups when that happened to them. The leaders of the official factions can even give orders, within reason, that have to be followed out. (As for special role-play requests, the Administration appears to be struggling to get through them currently, and by the time they do, quite some time has passed.)

Bonuses. Weekly credit incentives, mining bonuses and so on. Well, why not? There is no reason a Samura trader would pay the same as some gaijin for the same goods. However, such things should be dependent on the ID being mounted, not the tag in the character names. As for paying them to be in an official faction, well, if a faction really wants that for their players, or the players really want that, then I have severe doubts as to why they are in a faction, but eh.

If I missed any other proposed solutions, let me know.

As it stands now, official factions do have power over independent players, and gain a lot more respect than independents. They may pay 500 million for that respect, but they get it back. They also get a Capital Armour VIII, which can be mounted, or even sold for credits. That, and they have a group. Safety in numbers, and all the benefits which comes from flying in a group and not solo.

What else do official factions really need?

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Anything I say is not intended as offensive, and to try and deliberately misinterpret it as such would be an attempt at trolling via misrepresentation.

It's not a conspiracy, it's localised bias. They're not intelligent enough to form a conspiracy.

[Adam Peacecraft]

Question: "How to make discovery better?"

Answer: "Discovery needs more cowbell."

I'm not entirely sure how on-topic this is, but I think the role-play rules coupled with the tech chart pretty much lay out what you have to do in order to keep a ship you like, as in indie, without the faction connected to that ship giving you a hard time. What confuses me is how certain factions will troll you out of your hard-earned ship if you are not one of them regardless of how well you role-play that character. I could go into details but just thinking about it disgusts me. I'm sure the admins know exactly what I'm talking about. I huffed and puffed out 7 pages on the matter like a verbose dumby and promptly never received a response. Looking back, I wouldn't waste my time reading all those words either. Too many...

Point is, don't hassle indie players if they're role-playing well enough. It doesn't make your faction look very nice. More like faction-nazis who need to be reminded that they're playing a game.

lolwuts are the problem, and they aren't going to go away by increasing restrictions on indies. Look at the price tag for battleships. lolwuts buy them anyway. Raising prices will never solve the problem. Neither will ship registration. Liberty has a good amount of capship indies who are not registered with the factions, but most of us don't care because they do a good job RPing their ships.

When someone doesn't RP well and starts running amok with the red-is-dead mentality, a quick private chat is usually enough to help set them back on the right track. If they insist on being idiots, a quick writeup in the sanction report forum is usually enough to put an end to that player's reign of terror.

So why hurt good indie players more by raising prices or coming up with excuses for faction members to troll indies out of "their" ships? It isn't going to stop the lolwut problem. lolwuts are like the poor, you will never be rid of them, so deal with it.

Indie power 4 ever.

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*puts on fedora and trenchcoat* Now I know what sort of community you really are. *walks off into the rain*

[obnoxious1]

Yes, let us all be nice to each other, not flame and not like an idiot in-game or on the forums. Sounds good right? (The answer is yes.)

Point being, that has as much chance as me feeding Pluto barbeque chips as it rests in my backyard after one long party the previous night.

So, after reading the previous thread I realised the "problem", a term which is to be used lightly since factions already have enough power to deal with "role-play challenged" players, was being approached incorrectly.

It is not about making factions better, it is about making Discovery better. Hence, there should be advantages and disadvantages to being in an official player faction, and there should be advantages and disadvantages to not being in an official player faction.

I think you missed the point as well. I believe what Cannon was trying to propose, was a reward system for official factions for maintaining a higher level of game play by groups that show good examples of role play & promoting it.
I could of course be wrong..

Independent non-existence. Apologies extremists, the chances of it happening are quite low. I am sure, deep down with whatever large or little count of brain cells you have, you know it will change the mod and not for the better. This is Discovery, not Freeworlds. We are also talking about making factions better, not dropping an anvil on everyone else.

Custom ship-lines. Whilst I would support it, unfortunately, adding more ships, for every faction can give rise to problems. It makes the mod bigger, much bigger, if every official faction were to get a ship or two, and all these ships would need balancing. A lot more work, however, it may be worth the effort.

I agree adding more ships may cause more problems, there would be alternatives that could be considered. That was merely a suggestion

Pre-emptive capital ship requests, probationary periods, official faction approval and all associated phrases to describe similar actions. So far, every capital ship registry I have seen go up, has either fallen out of use because the official factions and/or their nominated manager of the registry has failed in keeping the registry up to date, or has resulted in egotistical self-inflation and bias decisions. As for probationary periods, it should be innocent before being proven guilty. (Take the ship away if repeated, provable abuses can be shown.)

To be quite blunt, I would like to know why official faction players want more control of independent players. Are you insecure? Or is it just jealousy that they can trade for the credits and you cannot? Perhaps I am wrong, however, at the moment there are a lot of controls. The server rules, read them. This keeps out most of the role-play challenged players. Apart from that, if someone is being a problem within an NPC faction, you can re-adjust their reputation. Everyone knows what happened to the Apocalypse_ and various other groups when that happened to them. The leaders of the official factions can even give orders, within reason, that have to be followed out. (As for special role-play requests, the Administration appears to be struggling to get through them currently, and by the time they do, quite some time has passed.)

Insecure? no, Fed up YES. It has gotten to the point when you log on to your faction character, you get pm'd by 3 or 4 people complaining that Indy so & so did this, Indy so & so did that, Faction so & so did this. etc.
Most of the factions will try to work with independents & wish to come to an agreement on role play or explain why somethings happen due to current role play. I can count on 1 hand independents that try to police other independents. But unfortunately, most care less & will go on doing what they want regardless how it impacts others in game. With out some form of order you have chaos & lately, there has been far more chaos than order in Sirius.
Prime example would be something someone in other post had mentioned.
A faction contacts an enemy faction for a little role play & battle. Each invite a few Indies to join in on both sides provided they adhere to commands of the people leading the event. 5 minutes into the role play & ensuing battle, more independents show up , won't listen to event leaders or anyone else for that matter & just start a pew pew fest. No respect, no concern for story lines or reason for event, just there to show off their cap ship e-penis.
Thus I ask you now, Why are you afraid of a group filled will ALL official faction leaders & admin to be able to sort out the bad eggs before allowing them a full cap ship usage? Insecure in your role play abilities?

Bonuses. Weekly credit incentives, mining bonuses and so on. Well, why not? There is no reason a Samura trader would pay the same as some gaijin for the same goods. However, such things should be dependent on the ID being mounted, not the tag in the character names. As for paying them to be in an official faction, well, if a faction really wants that for their players, or the players really want that, then I have severe doubts as to why they are in a faction, but eh.

If I missed any other proposed solutions, let me know.

As it stands now, official factions do have power over independent players, and gain a lot more respect than independents. They may pay 500 million for that respect, but they get it back. They also get a Capital Armour VIII, which can be mounted, or even sold for credits. That, and they have a group. Safety in numbers, and all the benefits which comes from flying in a group and not solo.

What else do official factions really need?

I don't see where factions have any power over Indies at all really. We can refuse you entrance to our owned & paid for guard systems to a point & that's about it. yes we have to pay 500 mil to become official, yes we get it back & after time possibly get a cap 8 armor. But we do not get the advantage of freedom that Indies get to roam about & role play as they wish on any whim they want to do.
Don't get me wrong, I am not anti-Indy. I just believe that until a more convincing way to control the chaos is found, More dedicated entities should be able to help police role play & server rules to allow the game to be enjoyable for all.

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Outcast Laws Outcast Reference Outcast Registry SOB / BLS Recruiting

[n00bl3t]

I think you missed the point as well. I believe what Cannon was trying to propose, was a reward system for official factions for maintaining a higher level of game play by groups that show good examples of role play & promoting it.
I could of course be wrong..

Insecure? no, Fed up YES. It has gotten to the point when you log on to your faction character, you get pm'd by 3 or 4 people complaining that Indy so & so did this, Indy so & so did that, Faction so & so did this. etc.
Most of the factions will try to work with independents & wish to come to an agreement on role play or explain why somethings happen due to current role play. I can count on 1 hand independents that try to police other independents. But unfortunately, most care less & will go on doing what they want regardless how it impacts others in game. With out some form of order you have chaos & lately, there has been far more chaos than order in Sirius.
Prime example would be something someone in other post had mentioned.
A faction contacts an enemy faction for a little role play & battle. Each invite a few Indies to join in on both sides provided they adhere to commands of the people leading the event. 5 minutes into the role play & ensuing battle, more independents show up , won't listen to event leaders or anyone else for that matter & just start a pew pew fest. No respect, no concern for story lines or reason for event, just there to show off their cap ship e-penis.

Thus I ask you now, Why are you afraid of a group filled will ALL official faction leaders & admin to be able to sort out the bad eggs before allowing them a full cap ship usage? Insecure in your role play abilities?
I don't see where factions have any power over Indies at all really. We can refuse you entrance to our owned & paid for guard systems to a point & that's about it. yes we have to pay 500 mil to become official, yes we get it back & after time possibly get a cap 8 armor. But we do not get the advantage of freedom that Indies get to roam about & role play as they wish on any whim they want to do.
Don't get me wrong, I am not anti-Indy. I just believe that until a more convincing way to control the chaos is found, More dedicated entities should be able to help police role play & server rules to allow the game to be enjoyable for all.

No, I got that. The point I was making is, factions do not really need any more power.

Well, ask them to report the player in question. Or ask them to send you SS and make a reputation change request or a capital ship removal request.

The example is moot since factions can dictate who can and cannot participate in events.

No, there is no need for the power being asked for, and considering potential gain verse potential faults, it is better for the power not to be given. Yes, I am extremely insecure in my role-play abilities and hate all factions, which explains my high ranking positions in some organisations, as well as the fact that I am in more factions than you are. Makes perfect sense.

Yes, you do not get that freedom, because you chose to be an official faction and gain the respect and position of an official faction. If you want the freedom, make an independent character. If being in an official faction is so bad, why are there continuous applications to become official and why do people bother to continue to be in factions? (Obviously because it is terribly agonising and oppressive.)

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Anything I say is not intended as offensive, and to try and deliberately misinterpret it as such would be an attempt at trolling via misrepresentation.

It's not a conspiracy, it's localised bias. They're not intelligent enough to form a conspiracy.

[Exsiled_one]

I know OPG grew tired of all the complains of numerous indies and our very starting members that weren't adjusting their roleplay fast enough.

Sorry but we tried our asses off and risked things like constant flaming and whining that made us look bad for doing a noble deed. It kinda sucks, because if we had some more faction power, we would make sure people knew that Corsair place isn't a place to gather up and "pvp".

If people would come to Crete without that mindset, we would have alot of easier job to do.
Also Nooblet, you know that roleplaying indies are great, and they contribute to roleplay, and they should be rewarded too. But not all indies do that, I'ld say about 30% of them does. Why should others have same benefits that you have?

I am not for factions having ultimate power, actually if all people would have to join the factions to get most benefits and indies became extinct, i would probably have the badass indie junker and proved that things can be done without faction help. I'm like that, I like challenges.
But there are indies that don't want to join factions because they feel like they will lose - and while they might lose few mil for an hour of trade, they would gain roleplay.

and it hurts me that they ignore that. they think 20mil a week is more worth than roleplaying and contributing to roleplay.

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<span style="color:#33CC00">I AM GIVING AWAY MONEY TO CREATIVE MINDS*</span>

[reavengitair]

I be keepin' it short.

Official factions don't need more power, but they do need things that will attract other members.

[Bear]

I was about to post a couple of paragraphs of pent up rage at this forum community. Instead I will post a brief outline of something I believe will help.

1. Official factions, instead of coming here and saying how bad indies are, get your players out there and start interacting with indies. Don't order them around and tell them off, gently point them in the right direction and show how much fun it can be to be in a faction.

2. Further reinforce this fun showing by removing part of the ranking system. Let all new people start off in a VHF instead of the lowest ship available. It always turns indies off when they get blasted by tougher opponents because they are in weak ships.

3. You don't need fancy gimmicks or ships to promote your factions. Once you have done the above two you shouldn't need them.

4. encourage existing factions members to RP with indies and get them to encourage (nicely) the indie to join up. Also let the faction members bring the indie to events to show them just how fun a faction can be.

5. Unite your faction, get them to show the up most niceness to indie's, it's the only way that they are going to feel comfortable in your faction.

Please note: It's not the fact that the indies want more freedom, it's just the sheer amount of stuff involved with joining a faction that is daunting. They are genuinely scared of factions because they are unsure as to the nature of the faction (nice or nasty).

STOP CRYING BECAUSE INDIES DON'T KNOW HOW TO RP. THE ONLY WAY THEY ARE GOING TO LEARN IS BY YOU SHOWING THEM!

There, that is my opinion, in my eyes the system is far to complex for new players and therefore because they are intimidated they become Indy for fear of sanction or abuse. I want you all to take this to mind.

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[Dashiell]

my 2 cents: elitism must DAI.

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[... kur nubėgo?]

I was about to post a couple of paragraphs of pent up rage at this forum community. Instead I will post a brief outline of something I believe will help.

1. Official factions, instead of coming here and saying how bad indies are, get your players out there and start interacting with indies. Don't order them around and tell them off, gently point them in the right direction and show how much fun it can be to be in a faction.

2. Further reinforce this fun showing by removing part of the ranking system. Let all new people start off in a VHF instead of the lowest ship available. It always turns indies off when they get blasted by tougher opponents because they are in weak ships.

3. You don't need fancy gimmicks or ships to promote your factions. Once you have done the above two you shouldn't need them.

4. encourage existing factions members to RP with indies and get them to encourage (nicely) the indie to join up. Also let the faction members bring the indie to events to show them just how fun a faction can be.

5. Unite your faction, get them to show the up most niceness to indie's, it's the only way that they are going to feel comfortable in your faction.

Please note: It's not the fact that the indies want more freedom, it's just the sheer amount of stuff involved with joining a faction that is daunting. They are genuinely scared of factions because they are unsure as to the nature of the faction (nice or nasty).

STOP CRYING BECAUSE INDIES DON'T KNOW HOW TO RP. THE ONLY WAY THEY ARE GOING TO LEARN IS BY YOU SHOWING THEM!

There, that is my opinion, in my eyes the system is far to complex for new players and therefore because they are intimidated they become Indy for fear of sanction or abuse. I want you all to take this to mind.

Most of your statments fails agianst lolwutters. They don't care.

Oh and we tried. We realy tried as all opg tried. Look how it ended. Everyone got pissed so hard taht opne of the most active faction which was rping for corsairs not in gamma died. Happy?

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Omega Pirates Guild

History of OPG | Antonio "Vilkas" Devivar

[Exsiled_one]

Elitism? It's simply amazing how people read but don't understand.

First of all, elitism is imposed by individual players saying "why should I join and lose when I can stay alone and win"
Those statements make those that do join the factions - elite. They have it harder.

But I agree, factions need to promote roleplay. I remember when I invited few indie traders to join the Kishiro convoy. Then we started, and when he realized the route makes 2mil less per hour, he abandoned us to do some runs to Bretonia trough Kusari. Cause that's easier right?

Most of the indies here on the forum are good sort of people.
I'll tell you who cripples the roleplay:

*People that would change their ID to avoid a problem. (Sudden Samura ID ships transporting ore, cause Hogosha doesn't attack them)

*People that change ID according to where's more money to make not where's their rp taken them. (Sudden Hogosha appearances with no respect for Kusari Codex)

*People that take the ID that will have the least piracy problems, and not based on their roleplay (These were Zoners before, most of them)

And I'm sure you can say you've met more than one person for each example of this. I know I have. I can even name them few without looking at any screenshots or something like that. Heck, one guy was selling the ship with flavor text "Samura ID and AFF, you wont get pirated by hogosha carrying ore"

Now what cripples rp? Elitism, or people thinking they're "smarter" than rest of "stupid sheep" that try to roleplay and do it by the rules

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<span style="color:#33CC00">I AM GIVING AWAY MONEY TO CREATIVE MINDS*</span>