Why is PvP so damn difficult?

[nOmnomnOm]

I'm actually sad right now because our lovely birdie stole the words right out of my mouth.

@nOmnomnOm Also you might as well stop throwing empty threats and double standards in your own thread after I already cleaned some flood posts. Just a friendly warning.

send me waht you are talking about in PMs instead of posting it here.
really doesn't help anyone

Edit: Can I know where i have threatened anyone?

[nOmnomnOm]

Keep in mind that if you first use a pencil for the first time in your life, you won't be a professional artist on the first try. It's all about memory muscle, interest, motivation and practice. Everyone has their own way, and not one's way is perfect for another. Don't give up and start blaming other things.


Then again, I don't particularly care about pvp as long as it isn't deadly broken, and that it isn't 1v1's, because imo, that's for conn, variety is interesting and challenging. Group fights best fights.

There is no room for more than one way to do things in disco now. All alternative ways have been destroyed by the dev changes. Common, man.

[Kauket]

Keep in mind that if you first use a pencil for the first time in your life, you won't be a professional artist on the first try. It's all about memory muscle, interest, motivation and practice. Everyone has their own way, and not one's way is perfect for another. Don't give up and start blaming other things.


Then again, I don't particularly care about pvp as long as it isn't deadly broken, and that it isn't 1v1's, because imo, that's for conn, variety is interesting and challenging. Group fights best fights.

There is no room for more than one way to do things in disco now. All alternative ways have been destroyed by the dev changes. Common, man.

Care to elaborate? I know Haste did some really awful changes like nerfing the CD for instance, but how is the essence of learning disrupted?

[Jack_Henderson]

Fact is that the game would be better if more players of all levels of skill would participate in the snub pvp aspect. The reality however is totally different.

I think missiles are a solution. I do not know how broken current missiles are, but tracking missiles that hit and do damage should be firmly in this game. Plus: even the best player should die to an organised group of 4 or 5 other snubs, and it should not even matter who he is - but I guess this is not what the group that balances snub pvp will ever opt for. The few people who managed the magic-dodge and who are really good at snub pvp will of course defend their invincibility territory (and I would likely, too, if I was there).

Just realize that this inaccessibility of the first part of pvp that a new player can afford is bad for Disco and that defending the skill gap and keeping 80+ % of players from ever seeing success in this part of the game will not make anything better in Disco.

[nOmnomnOm]

Keep in mind that if you first use a pencil for the first time in your life, you won't be a professional artist on the first try. It's all about memory muscle, interest, motivation and practice. Everyone has their own way, and not one's way is perfect for another. Don't give up and start blaming other things.


Then again, I don't particularly care about pvp as long as it isn't deadly broken, and that it isn't 1v1's, because imo, that's for conn, variety is interesting and challenging. Group fights best fights.

There is no room for more than one way to do things in disco now. All alternative ways have been destroyed by the dev changes. Common, man.

Care to elaborate? I know Haste did some really awful changes like nerfing the CD for instance, but how is the essence of learning disrupted?

Just to be clear we are talking on snub fights here. The amount of different effective ways to play has diminished and is catering those that are good at aiming, hence guns.
I keep seeing "learn to shoot" but really, there used to be more than one way to flip a coin. There are less and less and less ways now that are effective.

[Omi]

The amount of different effective ways to play has diminished and is catering those that are good at aiming, hence guns.
I keep seeing "learn to shoot" but really, there used to be more than one way to flip a coin. There are less and less and less ways now that are effective.

In what world do you envision Discovery having a PvP system not primarily based around aiming?

Unless you fly dual missile gunboats, every ship class requires you to have some ability to put shots on target. This has never not been the case, especially for snubs.

[Jack_Henderson]

Can we have the tread cleaned again of everything unrelated to the real issue?
And come on. Is it really THAT hard to keep on topic?
It actually is important.

[Yber]

For the last time the problem with the sidewinder isn't the damage or the ammo, nor is it the tracking, it's the fact that CMs rarely work on them and they hit you anyway. You can be shieldrunning from 1 guy spamming sidewinders on you while you spam CMs and the bast majority of missiles will still hit you despite moving away + spamming CMs.

If CMs are fixed or sidewinders are adjusted so that CMs work on them the problem is solved.

[Freeroamer]

For the last time the problem with the sidewinder isn't the damage or the ammo, nor is it the tracking, it's the fact that CMs rarely work on them and they hit you anyway. You can be shieldrunning from 1 guy spamming sidewinders on you while you spam CMs and the bast majority of missiles will still hit you despite moving away + spamming CMs.

If CMs are fixed or sidewinders are adjusted so that CMs work on them the problem is solved.

Interesting idea. I've never had this issue.

---

[Omi]

I skim-read the thread and Nyx said everything that needed to be said pages ago:

Keep in mind that if you first use a pencil for the first time in your life, you won't be a professional artist on the first try. It's all about memory muscle, interest, motivation and practice. Everyone has their own way, and not one's way is perfect for another. Don't give up and start blaming other things.


Then again, I don't particularly care about pvp as long as it isn't deadly broken, and that it isn't 1v1's, because imo, that's for conn, variety is interesting and challenging. Group fights best fights.

There is no reason why anyone shouldn't be able to attain a decent level of groupfight competency in Disco snub PvP, beyond totally unsolvable issues like terrible hardware, medical conditions, or crap internet. If people are surprised that they cannot win duels against good duelists - guess what, they have hundreds (if not thousands) of hours and you don't, so either suck it up and get on their level or gank them to win. Groupfights are not hard to participate in meaningfully.