saronsen summary of 5.0

[Megaera]

Right now for sure bombers are extremely potent against fighters. If anything they are /better/ fighters. Fighter bombers seem like they were brewed together with the powerpuff girls formula. You have some that are obnoxiously slow and useless, but then you have some that turn faster than most HFs in the mod and can stack loadouts capable of instakilling any fighter in the mod.

All nice and all, but bombers arent supposed to be a counter for fighters, they are meant to be a counter for things that aren't fighters.
They are absolute trash when you want to bring one to a cap fight.

The fact that they can fight fighters is completely irrelevant. That isn't their job.
The fact that a bomber can't even deshield a bustard with incapacitors when given free reign is just bad balance.

You're not necessarily wrong. I'm just pointing out that bombers have gone from being effective against caps to effective against snubs. This was probably unintentional.

Was just flying a bomber. SNAC, Asuras, and scorchers.
Seeing the hull decreasing was like watching paint dry. And I wasnt even alone. Target was a freighter.
Legit buff this.

Waran is also fat, its turn rate is abyssmal, so even your version of being effective against snubs is a no go.

Keep in mind that I lead a faction that has no caps, so we heavily rely on bombers to do anything vs caps at all. And currently, its not even a nerf, but a complete neutering of bombers.

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Matriarch Of the Gen'an Chrysanthemums - Ishikawa Aya
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Megaera - Ishikawa Masako
Feedback - Data Storage - Birth of a goddess

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[Haste]

Was just flying a bomber. SNAC, Asuras, and scorchers.
Seeing the hull decreasing was like watching paint dry. And I wasnt even alone. Target was a freighter.
Legit buff this.

Waran is also fat, its turn rate is abyssmal, so even your version of being effective against snubs is a no go.

Keep in mind that I lead a faction that has no caps, so we heavily rely on bombers to do anything vs caps at all. And currently, its not even a nerf, but a complete neutering of bombers.

While bombers may well require further tweaking (we've been buffing various things about them in virtually every hotfix and damage numbers compared to cap hulls are now basically back to where they were pre-patch), the math doesn't really check out here:

A Waran firing Scorchers on a full core will do 153155 damage dumping all of its core in a little over 4 seconds. That isn't accounting for the recharge during that time, which would account for an additional ~10,000 core, or ~36,000 damage.
The highest armor freighter in the game is the Draugr, at 95480 armor. With perfect accuracy, it'd basically go through all of its armor and nanobots (of course batteries are going to get in the way and the freighter's likely not going to let you sit still to apply all that damage perfectly either) in those 4-5 seconds. And that's the tankiest freighter in the game.

Damage is not the problem here. Bombers' ability to apply damage would be. And that's also where user error/skill kind of comes into play rather heavily.

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[Megaera]

Mistake. It was a 3ker, not a freighter.

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Matriarch Of the Gen'an Chrysanthemums - Ishikawa Aya
Gen'an Cell Information - Recruitment - Communications Network

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Megaera - Ishikawa Masako
Feedback - Data Storage - Birth of a goddess

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[Lord Caedus]

Right now for sure bombers are extremely potent against fighters. If anything they are /better/ fighters. Fighter bombers seem like they were brewed together with the powerpuff girls formula. You have some that are obnoxiously slow and useless, but then you have some that turn faster than most HFs in the mod and can stack loadouts capable of instakilling any fighter in the mod.

All nice and all, but bombers arent supposed to be a counter for fighters, they are meant to be a counter for things that aren't fighters.
They are absolute trash when you want to bring one to a cap fight.

The fact that they can fight fighters is completely irrelevant. That isn't their job.
The fact that a bomber can't even deshield a bustard with incapacitors when given free reign is just bad balance.

You're not necessarily wrong. I'm just pointing out that bombers have gone from being effective against caps to effective against snubs. This was probably unintentional.

Was just flying a bomber. SNAC, Asuras, and scorchers.
Seeing the hull decreasing was like watching paint dry. And I wasnt even alone. Target was a freighter.
Legit buff this.

Waran is also fat, its turn rate is abyssmal, so even your version of being effective against snubs is a no go.

Keep in mind that I lead a faction that has no caps, so we heavily rely on bombers to do anything vs caps at all. And currently, its not even a nerf, but a complete neutering of bombers.

If you're talking about that fight in Tau-23 a little bit ago, I hate to inform you that you were shooting a Taureau, which is a frigate, not a freighter.

EDIT: Saw you posted that about the same time I did. Apologies.

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[Ashyur]

while the damage reached same levels before patch, it's targets still has ~4x hauls and from a 4k range to a 600m makes it impossible to apply it unless the target is afk ?

[Pinko]

Mistake. It was a 3ker, not a freighter.

As I was the Frigate being shot, the Gallic frigate also has the highest hull HP of all non-capital ship vessels in the game, with 580,000 HP. In exchange, it's absolutely dreadful to navigate and has no powercore whatsoever.

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I want to get off Mr. Igiss' wild ride.

[Haste]

You're not necessarily wrong. I'm just pointing out that bombers have gone from being effective against caps to effective against snubs. This was probably unintentional.

It is and isn't intentional, to give you an awesome and useful answer. As you probably know, I personally like pushing rebalanced/reworked ships' power level about as high as we can get away with initially and then tone them down as required. Fighter-Bombers in particular we pushed quite a bit as they were decidedly "meh" before 5.0. We very likely overshot a bit, in particular with the Shirogane. Nothing we can't fix with some number tweaks though.

After Hotfix 3 I'd like to see how bombers perform as scorchers/neuts got sizeable buffs, primarily in efficiency (the most effective stat for anti-cap bomber weapons, honestly), and we added a good hullbuster option on the heavy slots in the form of buffed Hellfire Rocket Pods to make Neutralizer loadouts more viable. As the little bit of math a few posts ago shows, a heavy bomber can dump nearly 200K damage before really running out of core. When you're hitting something like a Corsair Battlecruiser's 900K HP engine that's going to add up quick.

Cap shields of course remain stronger than before, but I think the buffs are going to make up for it sooner or later.

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[Megaera]

That implies you can sit there and dump your core at something. Actual bomber play means you get one shot and you need to get the hell out of there or get a mouthful of prims. doing a scorcher run is risky as you can only do this if you know the cap is distracted. Furthermore, you never know when a cap has its guns trained on you because they have turret view and you do not.

This has become even more a thing when people turned bombers into a melee class by reducing the weapons range dramatically.
Right now, you need to hug something to be able to hit it, while at the same time, caps have 5 times your range.

So it sounds good in theory, but in practise, it does not work.

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Matriarch Of the Gen'an Chrysanthemums - Ishikawa Aya
Gen'an Cell Information - Recruitment - Communications Network

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Megaera - Ishikawa Masako
Feedback - Data Storage - Birth of a goddess

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[Kalhmera]

Are there any battleship mains who enjoy the changes, prefer flying post patch battleships than pre patch? PvP balance aside

While I appreciate the hard work the Devs put into this update with all of the many incredibly cool features, Battleship flying is horrible. I know they will rework them next so we just have to sit around and wait. Nothing more we can do for now.

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Just as the constant increase of entropy is the basic law of the universe, so it is the basic law of life to struggle against entropy. - V. Havel

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[Lemon]

Is that true about the world of warships btw? Did Devs go to a 2d game in water and copy movements into a space game for battleships or is that just some meme?