Fine, crap... depends on the ship they're mounted on. Place them on a small ship, like the Rheinland Armored Transport, they probably do wonders. Place them on Container transport, you can't hit a battleship with it.
' Wrote:Fine, crap... depends on the ship they're mounted on. Place them on a small ship, like the Rheinland Armored Transport, they probably do wonders. Place them on Container transport, you can't hit a battleship with it.
Hornvipers? On a Container Transport? So on a Non-Rheinland ship?
CTrans, eh? At New Tokio there are some of those, uhm, ... Small Transport Turrets.
They work wonders really.
Can't say I agree. I'm probably speaking from a biased pirates' perspective, but the last thing I want to see is Liners everywhere. If you're going to buff Liners, buff all transports. I don't mind a challenge when I'm pirating... but when traders get a self inflated sense of space superiority, suddenly pirates get less RP and more collective face palming as another trigger happy transport gets blown up.
I don't ever recall catching a Liner that's been willing to pay, they always shoot first, die later.
' Wrote:6 forward firing Hornviper 4 Turrets on a Behemoth can really be a pain for a Fighter/Bomber pilot.
I had one with full Destroyer turrets. It had lots of pain potential, but it seems to work a lot better with the small transport turrets.
Some Liner Turrets kind of make sense though. The Slave Liner has its own turrets. There's even a gun called the Liner Turret already. Considering the size of Liners, making a Solaris-esque turret would make sense to me. You make up for lost accuracy (from guns being far apart) but unleashing a torrent of death.
' Wrote:What, above gunboat DPS not good enough for you?
I'm not entirely sure if I should take offense at this.
Moving onward,
@Divine:
I primarily use those Small Transport Turrets on my ships, actually.
The point that concerns me about liners is that they are so large, and yet their turrets do not compensate for their size with added speed. That alone makes the liner's defensive power a trick.
Slow turrets, forward firing is good for the first few moments of combat, but after that, one must rely on turret mode for liners and such large ships. The slower fighter or freighter turrets are dreadfully sluggish in this form of combat.
On another topic, that of "Liner Abuse:"
I briefly touched on how to fix that in another thread of mine:
' Wrote:.....[the aforementioned idea] could solve the liner problem with human cargo and nonhuman cargo. Give them 500 space and make people take up .25 space on a liner or something.)
My entire idea there may be a fix-it-all, but that's not on topic at the moment.
To begin, note that liners count as transports, they use the same sheilds, and guns, and they are effectively tradeships, and nothing more.
' Wrote:Ahhhh, if only that were true, Eppy.
I've no problem with them getting stronger, but make sure that the only thing they carry is human cargo. No more liners with cardi/gold/niob/diamonds etc etc etc etc, except in <strike>much</strike> sorry, MUCH smaller quantities.
I, for one, am sick of seeing them hauling every commodity under the sun, OTHER than the one they are supposedly designed to carry.
I am too, as a proud member of the Slaver's union, I've discovered that the faction, and the ID in general, is mostly pointless. I'm much better off with a smuggler's ID, as the tradeoff for losing the ability to dock...uhm, on 90% of lawful bases is that I could steal things from people...and I have, just once, encountered someone I could steal from. People are not moved around enough to make the slaver ID a worthwhile addition to the mod, which is quite frankly, very sad.
I'd like to see multipliers given to the Liner profits on human cargoes, in a simmilar manner as mining, so that a Liner hauling people, with only a 3500 cargohold, can make as much, or more, hauling people, than an Atrain. We'd see more of them, yes, but as a slaver, I'd very much enjoy that, as it would validate the restricions on trade and the general hatred and hostility from most people that I'm putting myself through.
' Wrote:Can't say I agree. I'm probably speaking from a biased pirates' perspective, but the last thing I want to see is Liners everywhere. If you're going to buff Liners, buff all transports. I don't mind a challenge when I'm pirating... but when traders get a self inflated sense of space superiority, suddenly pirates get less RP and more collective face palming as another trigger happy transport gets blown up.
I don't ever recall catching a Liner that's been willing to pay, they always shoot first, die later.
My experince, albiet in the liner, has been much the same. I'm in a liner, I'm quite invulnerable, I think. I come up to a pair of police, and they tell me to stop...Why should I, I think? I'm a bloody liner. I paid 200 million for this ship, another 48 for its armour. Together, they paid something like 34 million. I've more guns, total, than they do, total. But then I find that I can't hit them, can't dodge their shots, can't, in effect, survive the encounter. I'm running away, the entire tim, knowing I'm going to die. The same in any transport. Escorted, in a Btrans, I cannot escape a VHF and a LF. Every pvp encounter I get into with a transport, it quickly becomes apparent that I'm going down like a lead balloon. This isn't fun, guys. Trading isn't fun, no matter what we do to the system, it is, in effect, grinding, and reasonably dull. Being overwhelmed by lighter, faster ships, that isn't fun either. We're getting ganked, and thats the feeling, every time we're in an encounter.
Transports should be the Poor Man's Cruisers, employed and nearly overemployed by most every faction in the game, excepting the four militaries, which can afford to build enough of the actuall cruisers. Pirates should pirate in transports, and in groups, a Transport and a fighter, or a gb, to tear down the lone transport's defenses. Transports should be given CDs, so they can be pirates in and of themselves.
Right now, the only thing transports can do effectively, or with any real usefullness, is trade. Frankly, trading -isn't- that great. Its nessisary. Its only nessisary. It hauls in the biggest profits, its at the bottom of the food chain, etc, etc, etc. Nothing else compares to them in the job, but frankly? Nothing else cares to try, because its a job that -sucks-. Make transports more fun, and you'll see more of them. This is a space fighting game. Things that can't fight, are not fun. BEING A DEFENSLESSTARGET SUCKS.
' Wrote:Hm, depends on the person using them.
And No, Hornvipers are fine.
Really, anything is better than Horvipers. They might work as turrets but as fighter weapons they don't.
They have the energy efficiency of rr 8.0s', which is odd, because the trend in FL = the lower the refire rate weapon has the more energy efficient it is.
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