This Is Crazy!

[Fellow Hoodlum]

Drake, if the trader is tagged BAF([SF] for our purposes), then they are in an 'official' war situation with the
KNF. No pirating there between both military forces, they don't pirate ... They would kill on sight.
If the Mollies([UoG]for these purposes) have a tagged trader, then the [SF] wouldn't be pirating the buggers
either, the military would attack the [UoG] on sight ... And I presume the other way round.

Zelot, I thought we did this one, if you are enemies, kill the bleeders ... You don't have to be polite.
Corsairs and Outcast don't have a 'do you mind if we engage conversation' before they pull the trigger.

Hoodlum

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Some say he is a proud member of: "The most paranoid group of people in the Community."

[Drake]

Drake, if the trader is tagged BAF([SF] for our purposes), then they are in an 'official' war situation with the
KNF. No pirating there between both military forces, they don't pirate ... They would kill on sight.
If the Mollies([UoG]for these purposes) have a tagged trader, then the [SF] wouldn't be pirating the buggers
either, the military would attack the [UoG] on sight ... And I presume the other way round.

But what about a 'generic' tagged character, not a member of a player faction? The way the rules are written, it sounds like (for example) a Molly character can attack and destroy any character, trader or otherwise, who has a Bretonian military or police tag, or the tag of any Bretonian corporation. Same goes for Liberty Rogues vs. Liberty military/police/corporations.

And last I heard, the UOG and SF had a temporary ceasefire.

[Fellow Hoodlum]

I said it was for an example only, not specifics concerning the Bretonian situation. Getting a little fed
up with being taken literally every time.
As for the rest, please give it a try so we can sort out the rule once and for all. Go and pirate every
generically tagged trader you can find with characters opposed to their house roots, and see how
many times you get reported ... But don't tell em I told you to, because if you do do it, you are on
your own there mate:dry:
The thing is, if you are a pirate what is the point of killing ? You make no money !!!! ... So if in doubt,
and that would appear to be most of the time, go for the 'ask for money' option ... Safer bet.
Love to have all the answers, but you guys are going to have to argue the odd judgement call on your
own now and again ... But don't try it as a loophole though, you may get your ass chewed off.

Hoodlum

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Some say he is a proud member of: "The most paranoid group of people in the Community."

[Zelot]

The thing is, if you are a pirate what is the point of killing ? You make no money !!!! ... So if in doubt,
and that would appear to be most of the time, go for the 'ask for money' option ... Safer bet.

I guess thats the safer bet, but i think it over simplifies the answer. Pirates in this game are much more complicated then simply "it's about the money". Corsairs fight Outcasts, not over pirating rights as might be argued, but much like protosants from catholics, they split, they fight for factional issues not issues of money. Blood Dragons wish to bring down the house of Kusari, again it's not so much about money but this time about political beleif. and so on, most of the Pirate factions have an in-depth background story that gives them many motives beyond money. Thier motives are complicated therefor their actions most be somewhat complicated as well.

Love to have all the answers, but you guys are going to have to argue the odd judgement call on your
own now and again ... But don't try it as a loophole though, you may get your ass chewed off.

It's not about loopholes, it becomes about limiting legitemate role-play, because some people cant understand the complexitys of role-play and the charecters that are developed by the game and by the charecters themselves.

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[Tortured_Soul]

I reckon you're perfectly within the rules to atack your enemies without warning. Let's face it, they should be expecting it.

I do have my own question regarding the Terrorist ID, more specifically the aquisition of said ID. You can't get it anywhere (except that fortress of Beauracracy, the Lost Battlestar) so how would I go about aquiring one?

Special admin approval? Application? Or just downright ignoring the rules until I'm sanctioned or given the ID?

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Initial Biography ; Running Story

[Fellow Hoodlum]

It's not about loopholes, it becomes about limiting legitemate role-play, because some people cant understand the complexitys of role-play and the charecters that are developed by the game and by the charecters themselves.

Zelot, nail on proverbial head there mate. Me, I wish we didn't seem to need a rule for every single blasted
roleplay scenario on the server, but there seems to be those who need the security of the rulebook.
On the other hand we have the seekers of the loopholes, whether for personal gain or just to reinforce the
rules we don't actually have. Its getting difficult to judge now ...
Guys, you have to make the odd call on your own, we ain't got all the answers and never will have. Treat
it like life, make a decision. Right or wrong, it will happen sometime ...

Hoodlum

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Some say he is a proud member of: "The most paranoid group of people in the Community."

[Jinx]

well, here is what i would do:

given i m an unlawful - which i m not but just in case:

trader/transport/cooperation vessel - i d prolly stop them without warning with a well places train disrupter and while they wait to fire up their engines - warm up another CS - and ask them nicely for a donation. while they stuggle to possibly get away - give them a few shots that just scratch their shields. but everything is allowed now, since "i have allready asked nicely" . - since i m not after the death of the trader but rather after its cargo/cash, i d prolly "chew" him up untill he either pays - or realizes that its gonne be costly to try to run some more.

fighter or any kind - i d scan and without any warning if clearly hostile to me, attack. frankly, even a taunt to start it puts me in a disadvantage. so i d rather strike first. after all, a fighter is not a civilian vessel. if it was a fighter without ANY weapons - allright, might not attack on sight.

capship - just like a fighter. they are easier to identify from afar but of course i d have to scan for its ID first. no warning needed here, i think. an outcast destroyer meeting up with a liberty cruiser won t exchange much but weaponfire.

about factions being at war. i don t think that pirates are considered "at war" with traders. they are hostile. but not at war. i think the term "at war" is reserved for the major factions bretonia - kusari, outcast and allies - corsair and allies. i wouldn t even consider the order and lsf "at war". but when a bretonian fighter meets a kusari fighter, i would rather expect them to just attack each other without scanning for the ID first, cause its quite clear that its the enemy - when it turns out that it was someone in a kusari fighter with lets say a trader or neutral ID. - well, damn bad luck ... for the kurasi pilot. even a neutral should have enough common sense not to fly a kusari fighter through bretonian space no matter what ID.

thats just my take on it. thankfully, i m neutral to all and i never have to care about it =P

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Shipdesigns made for DiscoveryGC

[Zelot]

about factions being at war. i don t think that pirates are considered "at war" with traders. they are hostile. but not at war. i think the term "at war" is reserved for the major factions bretonia - kusari, outcast and allies - corsair and allies

Thats not quite true I think the subtleties of factional relations shiuld be taken into account. Clearly in some pirates faction story it says what corperations they came from and why they hate them. If I'm now wrong, Unioners have a thing with Daumann, Mollys are against BMM. The origins of these pirate groups are intergral to their story and what corps they have beef with changes how they deal with these groups and others. Pirate groups may be at war with a particular corp. In this situation I think attacking to destroy and not pirate might be in order.(Although this would go better with a factional RP storyline on the fourms)

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[Raekur]

Not to throw the discussion off topic but just because I also encountered the "You have to warn someone first" ( the person did apologize the next day after discovering he was incorrect). This no warning required works both ways. A lawful is also not required to notify a unlawful of his intentions either. I only bring this up because of the incident where I was informed that I was going to be reported for attacking a pirate.

And a side note..you blast a trader down to 1%...you might as well kill him...if a trader loses equipment during your "pursuasion" you can pretty much bet that losing the cargo..would be better then losing the weapons and equipment. So if you plan on getting any money from a trader, dont blast him past the point where repairs are more then his cargo.

[bluntpencil2001]

And a side note..you blast a trader down to 1%...you might as well kill him...if a trader loses equipment during your "pursuasion" you can pretty much bet that losing the cargo..would be better then losing the weapons and equipment. So if you plan on getting any money from a trader, dont blast him past the point where repairs are more then his cargo.

Not true. No transport gun is worth the millions in cargo that will float away into space.

Best to scare them. Hell, hurt them enough and they'll offer money before you even ask.

Our Privateer faction has a trader that organises payment in advance. He's a friendly chap, and rather understanding about the whole situation.

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