This Thread Getting Utterly and Ridiculously Stupid

[Monk]

This game is called FREElancer ya'll. If i earn the money to buy a BS and equip it, then guess what? Im gonna fly it. No rule should disallow that. No rule should limit who can spend the money that they earned.

Yes but this is Discovery. This is an RP server, so yes, the way you spend and get your money should be limited by RP. If you just want a BS so you can beat the crap out of others go to the PvP server...which is still pretty quiet whenever i am there, unfortunately. BS are supposed to be the big scary thing that forces enemies to really group up and coordinate.

[DarkOddity]

I disagree. Why should we expect a faction to fly mostly fighters when most independents are flying battleships?

I understand your concern there, but we aren't discussing restricting factions from using capital ships at all, so we shouldn't do the same for independents.

From my understanding the issue has been player factions who do nothing but attack other factions with large groups of battleships. THIS is the problem.

Independents in battleships is not really an issue strictly for this one fact, they are not waging war on other factions.. If they go around PVP-Whoring.. It's because they are doing something out of RP and they *do* get sanctioned for it! We have a great admin staff and that kind of behavior is not taken lightly.

If you restrict independents from flying battleships what happens is this:

"Sorry, you cant fly that, you have to JOIN a clan (or form) and raise through the ranks to get a BS!"

In turn, people will join factions for the sole purpose of getting rank to fly a battleship. From there, guess what happens.. Oh noes, you guessed it.. Inter-clan conflict because one person (usually the leader and their favorite person in clan) get to fly the clans battleships.. Who'da thunk. Restricting independents will turn it into a "He's my favorite, your not. No BS for you!" - We don't need that.

And yeah, it is Freelancer.. This game was built on the fact of people working for themselves.. Being independent. Discovery was meant to expand on that. Now if you want to remove the ability for a independent player (which is how this game was made to be played!) to do what they want (also how the game was meant to be played) then remove all battleships from the mod. I for one would be PO'd. I'm not actively going after a BS, don't even want one really... But I would be damn PO'd if my rights as an independent pilot were TAKEN AWAY because of the misbehavior of FACTIONS.

That's my dollar... Take it or leave it - Nothing against you I just tend to get worked up on things I feel strongly about. And I stand by my opinion, factions are the problem, not lone players.

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[Doom]

Capwhoring? Oh yes. But it wasn't my fleet... I just happened to have my Outcast and his gunboat in Alpha and felt compelled to defend it against the invaders. And my post is trying to point out the problems with vastly unbalanced fleets, in either direction... Though I'd say it's probably better to have a group of nothing but fighters than have a bunch of fighters and one capship... That one ship is going to be an awfully tempting target, and it'll drop just as fast as that Albatross did.

I personally like light fighters more than any other ship... It's just too bad they're so useless in most situations (most situations being a fight against capships or groups of VHFs). They can take out any other fighter solo (with a hellava lot of work), and they're good at surviving for a long time vs. larger groups, but otherwise are rather useless.

heh...i was one of the VHFs on the other side...i was surprised when i saw so many big ships going after me...at start of that fight i was one fighter against two battleships, gunboat, two cruisers and one fighter...then i called for backup...

but you see...i train my guys to use VHFs against big ships...we learn how to dodge, when to fire, how to team up and all work together...in some practice fights we killed really large feel of SA caps using only vipers and one bomber...

however people here are right...unexperienced player will always like to fly in big ships...it gives them "better protection"...well...it usually does...against NPCs..

I have battleship...and i know how to fly it really well...but i cant remember when was the last time i used it...i am expecting every time after inactive player wipe that it will be gone...someone said that BSG has 6 battleships..hmm....not even i knew that we have so many..my Peggy might seriously became a museum...

most of the time i am using two ships..fighter (usually viper) and my trusted rouge GB...almost never i don't have need to use anything bigger then GB...

but main question is how to limit battleship use...practically...that is almost impossible...and definitely impossible without player wipe...at least battleship wipe...

i agree that battleships should be limited...considering faction size and alignment...even Battlecruisers and cruisers should be limited...i wouldn't make limit on GBs...

but u will always have problem with private "freelancer" battleships that fly under Merc ID...they still can be "hired" for certain faction...

i would reduce battleship number like this:

1. player wipe - self explains
2. raising battleship prices to skies as well as equipment for them - make total price for buying and equipping battleship over 1,9 bill..no matter what player cant buy it alone
3. reduce profit from trading and make longer trade runs - related to above, whole faction/nation needs to trade for one single battleship...faction acts like team
4. sell them on only one place in Sirius and possibly on guard base - impossible to buy ship without proper tag and alignment
5. limiting number of battleships per faction - self explains
6. limiting number of capital ships per account - self explains

so it will became very hard to buy battleship if u are freelancer...and eventually when freelancer buys it...then he deserved it...

[sushi]

Motion for getting rid of armor upgrades seconded, thirded, and fourthed.

They're my least favorite feature of Discovery, and IMO detract far, far more than they add.

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[Joe012]

Yes but this is Discovery. This is an RP server, so yes, the way you spend and get your money should be limited by RP. If you just want a BS so you can beat the crap out of others go to the PvP server...which is still pretty quiet whenever i am there, unfortunately. BS are supposed to be the big scary thing that forces enemies to really group up and coordinate.

YES, this IS discovery. Im glad you noticed that:yahoo:. Please explain to me then, if how it is not RP to earn money, and use that money that you have earned to fly the ship of your choice? WITHIN the limits of RP? I have a merc ID. I am saving money for a BS to MERC to factions in times of greater conflict. How is that not RP?

NOW...players should be made to use ships accordingly. If you are an independent battleship, you should use this ship for what is was intended. Battle. Not skirmishes or 1v1, but battle.

I EARNED my money...no one should tell ANYone how they should spend it. RP is essential to the enjoyablility of the game. I agree with you completely.

Im telling you, TAU 31 is the major part of the problem. 55 seconds per 1.3 mil? I am as guilty as the rest of us, I have made money off of that run. make 300 million or more a difficult number to obtain, and it will eliminate all the problems. You wont see the effects of this right away, but again, take away the EASY money and watch the big ships fall away. Watch.

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[DarkOddity]

I agree with that method Doom. I have always been a fan of battleships being EXTREMELY expensive.

And It is possible to buy a battleship and it's equipment all in one sitting - just carry a ton of credit cards on you when you head to the purchase. Can you say RISK?:)

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[Dopamino]

battleships should be doubled in price and their equipment tripled. No one should be paying les than 1 bil for a BS.

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[Doom]

RISK is the word of the day

[Dopamino]

that too. armor upgrades for cap ships should be ditched.

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[Sonja]

Expensive battleships wont solve the problem. I bet there are more flying now than a few versions ago. The problem is too big to ignore with a "lets put up the prices (again)!" statement. It doesn't work. Period. Battleship prices have risen around one thousand percent over the last three or four version and the problem hasn't got any better.

It doesn't work people. Fact.

Misbehaviour of the factions is as much an issue as misbehaviour of individuals not in factions. They are just that; individuals - because they don't want to be tied down by faction commitments or rules. There is no way an individual could finance the maintenance and purchase of a battleship. A rich bounty hunter or mercenary could possibly have a cruiser, but that is in special cases. general ID's should be restricted to gunboats and below, as a single person cannot hope to finance four hundred (in the case of a battleship) or half that, in the case of a cruiser. A half dozen for a gunboat he would be able to hire though.

If a faction is allowed only one battleship, but there are five mercenaries to be hired, each with a battleship of their own, you can see where that goes. Now, tell me how you solve that.

Addendum: Armour upgrades are fine the way they are. They cost a ton of money, the best costs nearly twice as much as a battleship. They are fine. There is no need to get rid of them. Plus, most unarmoured gunboats die with one dual nova hit. Now tell me thats balanced.