Guild Wars 2

[BaconSoda]

Interesting arguments about the first game, but not really. Guild Wars was not a failure, as you are making it sound like. It was a VERY good game, which had a very complex PvP system. A simple example is the fact that in Guild Wars 2 there are no cross-profession combos. You seem like a smart chap - imagine how hard it is to balance that and then compare it to balancing core professions without any mixtures. Compare the sheer depths of the two games. This trait system is OK, but it's not really impressive. During the beta events I played all the professions, ran through the dungeons and whatnot, it was all in good fun. I admire what they have done with the PvE, and this is probably the aspect of the game that I will focus on. But the PvP... let's be honest - there are just about 3 maps and they are all the same. You call this accessibility, I call this a dumb-down. Accessibility is just another word that you would use to mask the facts - that guild wars 2 is a game that will attract stupider players. That minority you are talking about - those were clever guys and they knew exactly why they love the game so much (gw1). Alongside my guild we managed to reach our peak and it was #4 in the world for a while, top 20 for a longer while. The level of skill you needed to posses for such high level of play was what attracted many. I've played with organized teams and with more noobish, but still capable teams. The difference and gap in skill is IMMENSE.

Now, GW2 is very accessible, yes, but that is also one of its downsides. Now, more than ever, it has to appeal to as much people as possible. And it does. It even appeals to me, it just doesn't touch me in that special place. And you can trust me on this one - the first game was more or less a grand part of my life and I love ArenaNet. I've waited for the second game for years, since it was first announced.

Furthermore, you mentioned a couple of skills in defense of your arguments about the complexity of Guild Wars 2. While you are more or less right in terms of the classification of skills, GW2 does not offer such freedom for creating your own, even unique build. You have a locked set of skills which change as you swap weapons. Initially I loved this, but now it's just boring. I played the ranger with all the possible combinations and the complexity here comes off skill combos, which are not nearly as satisfying as making a random cross-profession combo and then coming up with a build that actually works well and that is going to be unexpected by others for a while.

The treat system right now appears to be interesting, but in reality battles are very fast. With my thief, during this last weekend, I just picked a gimmicky build and I could down other players in 2-3 seconds. So what I am trying to say here, is that GW2 is much more of a shooter-like game than a COORPG, like the first one was. The beauty of Prophecies came with the requirement of incredible team work, synchronization and cooperation. Now it's much more zerg than tactics.

I spent a good time defending GW2's mechanics in our community, as the older players didn't really like it that much (part of their reasoning has been mentioned here). I still have hopes that they will introduce interesting PvP, but as it is now - there is no real GvG. And this is Guild Wars. It's about wars between guilds. A 5 player vs 5 player capture and hold map has nothing to do with war. It's nothing more than the Dominion mode of LoL.

Though I have to admit the PvE is great. I had so much fun in the Ascalonian Catacombs, I felt that the teamwork of the first game was somehow converted into the PvE aspect of GW2.

edit: Also, I don't want to appear as some enraged Gw2 hater, I still like the game very much. But they must figure out a way to introduce real PvP. Their decision to break out of the holy trinity pattern was brave, but it also means that without a dedicated healing class the battles will just end very quickly and often it will be down to just a few seconds. Currently the skills are MUCH more alike in between different professions. Everyone has dodge, everyone has some kind of pushback/teleport skill. It's a lot more uniform than before.

Just because an idea is overly convoluted and complex does not mean it's cool. But I know, I'm just not smart enough, or clever, I guess. Forget the parts where the game was literally impossible to balance and making a unique profession and a viable profession were two mutually exclusive things.

You said this wasn't the game they wanted to make. That couldn't be farther from the truth. If you read old Guild Wars interviews, all you have to do is add a 2 to the end of the game's name and they're the same interviews. This is the game they always wanted to make. It caters to no one. If it's a good game, it'll be successful on its own merits.

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[8:32:45 PM] Dusty Lens: Oh no, let me get that. Hello? Oh it's my grandma. She says to be roleplay.
[12:49:19 AM] Elgatodiablo: You know its nice that you have all that proof and all, Bacon... but I just don't believe you.