Battle Razors..

[Dab]

If that fails get a destroyer of your own, all you need is a set of primaries, 1 pulse cannon and 1 bretonian missile. Spamm the missile on every joust. You will be amazed how easy a target that tiny destroyer is.

Did we not already cover this? 'If you can't beat it, buy one of your own' is not a mentally we need or want on this server. Especially since many factions can't buy a destroyer/cruiser. Many factions are limited to gunboats and below. All of which, at present, will get killed by a destroyer/cruiser.

And back to Battle Razor, If it's any slower it's useless for it's main task, that is fighting gunboats... and then again if it's used for bombers that's perfectly acceptable since you need 2 of them to hit, when the shieilds are down... I wonder why nobody complains about battleship battle razors that can 1-2 bombers and have a whooping 1600 speed?

Actually, at 400m/s, the BR is still perfectly fine hitting GBs, especially since a GB has to be within 800m to do any damage. On top of that, the cruiser can thrust towards the GB as well, making it a speed of 520m/s (920m/s at current). The GB goes to get close, destroyer thrusts towards GB at the same time, but the time the GB can turn around to get distance again, the destroyer is already right next to it, probably less than 200m distance.. Thats half a second fly time for the BR.. If you can't hit from that distance with a 400m/s speed weapon that is 75m in diameter, something is very very wrong with your aim.

Those are all while being primarily anti-gb weapons perfectly acceptable anti-bomber weapons, since some gb's are bomber sized and some bombers are gb sized... Learn to counter the destroyer with a proper ship, say a destroyer of your own... The smaller the target more vulnerable to missiles it is. So word of the day would be "NOVA".

As said before, 'If you can't beat it, buy one of your own' isn't something we want on Disco. Never have, and has been pointed out by countless people over the years. Furthermore, as I said, over half the factions in this game are not allowed to use cruisers and battleships. So what you suggest can't be done. Nor SHOULD it be done. Bombers and fighters shouldn't be pushed under the rug simply because we have cruisers now. This game was built around using fighters, why should the fighters and bombers be the most useless ships? Every class should be balanced to the next. That isn't happening right now.

I was shooting at him with 15 order cruiser turrets, which have 1000m/s speed - the fastest weapons available to us, solaris turrets aside.

At 500-800m range, I landed maybe one shot out of every five on him while he was actively dodging...

You're failing to take many factors into account.. First, the size of your carrier.. It may say 500-800m range, but if he's in front of you, thats really ~1600m for the turrets you have at the back of your ship. And even with that, the fact that you couldn't hit him with guns with a 1000m/s speed from a distance under 1000m.. Well, thats not the gun's fault.. I could hit a GB from that range with a Battlerazor, especially these 800m/s ones, with ease.. There should be nothing stopping you from doing it with 1000m/s speed guns. Maybe you had a mix of guns with different projectile speeds that threw off your aim, or you simply haven't had much experience fighting gunboats at the moment.. But I've easily managed to kill a GB with cruiser weapons.

Bombers have 2 uber weapons,
Caps now have 1 uber weapon VS bombers
The bombers dont like it.
all's fair if you ask me.

The bomber's 'uber weapons' don't instantly kill the capship once its shield is down. They are also both VERY slow, and the bomber takes a lot of damage when it gets close enough to hit with it. The caps have an extremely fast instant-kill weapon with a 75m diameter, making it very hard to miss any bomber close enough to SN or Nova the cap. The cruiser/dest has no counter right now.

On top of that, the cruiser's 'uber weapon' kills in one hit, but takes 1/5 of the power core.. Meaning it can be fired 5 times (6-7 counting the regen between) at the target.. Supernova can be fired once before you're out of energy. Then its a 20-25 second wait.

I'M wondering how the heck can you ONE shot kill something in this game. At least it SHOULD take TWO shots. One for the shield and one for the hull.

One shot means one hit on hull and it kills you. Supernovas are one-hit weapons, but that doesn't mean it takes shield and hull at the same time. If it can take you from full hull to no hull in a single hit, its a one-hit weapon. Shields are very very easy to drop.

Maybe the bomber pilots just weren't that good? unsure.gif

We've been fighting capships for a very very long time. We have plenty of experience doing it, and we've managed to do it very well. This had nothing to do with our skill. Tell me, can you hit a bomber with a fighter weapon? If the answer is yes, you can hit with a cruiser battlerazor, because its projectile speed is even faster. You might miss once or twice at first, but you have plenty of energy to fire again.

Like Jinx said, the Razor turrets are quite inefficient; only being good against gunboats mainly. If you can snipe a damn bomber with it, you're just a damn good shot. If the bombers are silly enough to be within sniping distance, thats their fault.

Did you read anyone's post in this thread? If you can snipe a bomber, its because of the 800m/s speed, not the aim.. And if the bombers are silly enough to get within sniping distance? Sniping distance in this case is 800m. Supernova can't hit the destroyer if fired outside of 500m unless the cruiser pilot has no idea what he is doing. So you're saying we should die if we ever try to actually hit our targets?

how to hit a bomber in a cruiser with a 800ms gun? - only when the bomber is coming really close .... the projectile size of the razor is as small as any other projectile ( except the flak, which is as large as a large transport ) - so at around 500-1000 range - a bomber is fairly SAFE from them.... provided he dodges a bit of course.

Only when the bomber is really close.. Well since we have to be within 500m to hit the destroyer/cruiser with a Supernova, we don't really have much a choice.. And efficiency has nothing to do with this thread in the least bit.. Against other caps, yes, efficiency matters.. But when you can kill your opponent in a single hit, do you really think the efficiency matters? Especially since BRs take very little energy, a cruiser can fire a single BR 7 or so times before finally running out of energy. Bomber fires once and the energy is gone.

bombers have an easy life - and thats a fact. - their main defense is their agility and size. capital ships need a whole lot more skill than bomberpilots to harm each other. - so of course a 280ms supernova has an easier time hitting a destroyer than a 800ms razor has hitting a bomber - that is - unless both ships were the same size and speed.

furthermore - a bomber can thrust to 200 and accelerate the SN to 480ms - the destroyer can practicly do the same with the razor 940ms - but due to its lower speed, thats of no great use for that matter.

Need I say again about turret view and the fact that destroyers can thrust and turn as fast as a bomber can circle? A cruiser has to turn around.. Okay.. A bomber has to turn and fly 1000m to get behind the cruiser. Pretty big difference in the distance covered. The bomber is faster, yes, but not that fast that it can dodge so easily. Bomber can accelerate SN to 480m/s... Only if jousting the capship and thruster at it, making them the easiest hit for a BR that there can be. So what you are saying is that, if you want to hit the cruiser, you have to be a perfect target for this insta-killing weapon, deal with it.

And if you think it takes more skill for a cruiser to hit a cruiser than for a bomber to hit another bomber, you obviously don't get in to too many bomber v bomber fights.. Try SNACing a bomber with a bomber.. Its much harder to hit than a cruiser BRing or Mortaring another cruiser.

Also, bomber moves at 200m/s.. Destroyer at 120m/s. SNAC at 280m/s, BR at 800m/s.

Thats makes the bomber 60% faster than the destroyer. The Battle razor is 286% faster than the SNAC. So no, its not that much easier to hit a cruiser with a SNAC than for a cruiser to hit with the BR. Not to mention turret-view allowing it to be done very easily.



Note to everyone else, because its become very obvious, and some have even admitted it; Do not post if you aren't willing to read the thread. When in a balance discussion, reading the first post and nothing else is not going to work. If you feel your opinion is warranted or necessary, than reading the rest of the thread is necessary as well.

---