Discussion about BSG's roleplay.

[Exile]

Chopper,

You say that your going to halt smuglers near your bases? (Falkland, Java) Well, ill put it simple.
If the ID your using doesnt allow it, just dont do it. Simple as. Like Fellow Hoodlum said a while ago, "No RP can give you the right to breach the server rules". The rules in this case, using your ID for things it says you cant do. (Pardon me for not using exact words, but you get the picture).
If the ID says no, then it is no. Simple as.

Your responce?
Exile.

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[StarButt]

Chopper,

You say that your going to halt smuglers near your bases? (Falkland, Java) Well, ill put it simple.
If the ID your using doesnt allow it, just dont do it. Simple as. Like Fellow Hoodlum said a while ago, "No RP can give you the right to breach the server rules". The rules in this case, using your ID for things it says you cant do. (Pardon me for not using exact words, but you get the picture).
If the ID says no, then it is no. Simple as.

Your responce?
Exile.

Outcast ID is not allowed to fly BAF battleship, outcast ID says no to that, but than again, it seemed OKed 'cos of the "RP reasons". We also have "RP reasons" to halt smugglers. We have IMG ID, but we're not mining niobium. How come ONLY our "RP reason" is breaching the server rules?

Can you pronounce \ˈdə-bəl ˈstan-dərd\?

Like Chopper said, we're not official, so we can even pretty much change to ANY ID, even generic or merc, that would allow us much more PVP whoring and less RPing. We're not striving for that, but seems you're intent on pushing us.

We can also always issue bounties on smugglers caught with cardamine in their holds. Cardamine is "BAD". It is only RP not to allow smugglers to roam around un interrupted. This is supposed to be a RP and PVP server, so RP it! Don't just scan the ID and assume we should act like NPCs. AI may not have the ability to figure out to whom cardamine belongs to, but players have. So if you think all should act only within strict limits of their ID and their NPCs, why the RP in the 1st place? Why the stories? Why players for that matter? Boot em all, and play with NPCs only.

We will not ever act against admins decision, but we're just trying to explain, why we think that decision could be changed.

Irioth

AW and Phantoms didn't exist in vanilla FL, but the roleplay developed to bring them into existence was based on FL factions and events. Yours is not. Yours is based on the Colonies of Kobol and whatnot. The events that led to a good part of your roleplay had nothing to do with FL in any way. It's only the end that you added on so you could tie the two universes together. See the difference?

Our roleplay also developed to bring us into existence as FL faction. Only difference is, they're somewhat purely imaginary, and somewhat loosely based on "Star Gate", while ours is loosely based on BSG. AW leader roleplaying as the unknown half-alien, from an unknown origin, also has nothing to do with FL what so ever. Not to mention they were integrated into FL as the "zoner" faction, that acts nothing like that faction should, and in the end, they got their own ID, that also has nothing what so ever to do with original FL factions.

Now plain and simple, let me summarize to what your critics come down to: You don't like BSG universe, series, idea. Well guess what? I don't like Freelancers'. I like the game, I like this server and its community, but I DON'T LIKE the story, and I really DISLIKE ship design. I do LOVE vipers, and the fact they are in Disco, is why I'm here. Should all that love the game but dislike the story behind is just leave the server?

Solution? Learn to LIVE WITH IT.

EDIT: Also, everything Doom said, because he's bloody well right.

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Your Image exceeds Forum Regs, Please replace.......BULLDOGNK

[utori]

I deliberately didn't take part in that flaming contest that took up several pages of this otherwise meaningful and important tread. I seriously doubt that anyone will have the patience and will to go through all those meaningless accusations and counteraccusations cos all that obviously goes way back and has nothing to do with current situation or the purpose of this tread.
I'll try once more to put this on the right track. I've written two what I thought were well thought out and
fact backed posts here and got no answer or reaction regarding any of my comments. Since I'll give that much credit to the OC guys that they've read them I must come to the conclusion that they agree with everything said there. That impression is strengthen furthermore by the fact there're almost no complaints concerning current BSG RP aside from us attacking Alpha which I'll address a bit later.

As to our current RP I'll try to repeat once more the basics of it and this one's for the people with the cheap seats. I do hope no one will have any doubts what BSG stands for after this.
BSG is the security force of the IMG. We have strong connections with the CR but it's doesn't have that much to do with background story anymore but more with common interests. As that security force we deal with everything perceived as threat to the two bases we protect. And yes that includes the massing of OC forces one system away from Falkland. Everything we do in game has solid RP behind it. No one can ask for more than that.
As to our colonial background we hardly ever mention that to anyone outside our community. Even our name has nothing to do with it anymore. It doesn't mean that our colonial roots are not important to us but they are not our primary guideline in interactions with other factions. CR are the primary heirs of colonial tradition having maintained much of it's system but I would really like to see someone find flaws in their RP. As far as I've seen it few people do it better than them.
As to the policy of scanning and stopping traders ours is clear. We don't. On the other hand we do feel we should be allowed to and I've already written the reasons for it in my previous post. However I didn't actually expect any of the OC to admit that I'm right. It was more intended for the neutral people or possibly admins and I would look forward for any feedback on that from either.
I do also hope that no one will mention the ID issue since it has been answered over and over again.
As to the appearence of the ships we use we obviously had nothing to do with that so anyone disliking them is barking up the wrong tree. Mail all your complaints to the guys that designed them, we just fly them.

In the end I would like to quickly compare the RPs of the two sides confronted in this heated debate.
One is a security force that has defined strict boundaries and solid RP frame and acts according to it.
The other is a pirate faction. The neobium route passes right under their noses and I would really like to hear which trader was ever stopped by the OC. So they're not pirating. What else. They're drug traffickers that object to being stopped and scanned. That's even more logical. Finally they're outlaws that complain about being attacked. That tops everything.
So I would like to see someone neutral evaluate these two aproaches and say which one in his mind closer to the spirit of the game.
Aforementioned yesterdays CR/BSG intrusion into Alpha can be a nice illustration of all this. We RPed our way into it RPed all the way through and RPed our way out of it. Their only comment was "Let the fools leave". Now there's RP for you.

I've always seen all gamers as one of the two types. Ones that try to beat the game on the "Very Hard" level and ones that exploit bugs and loopholes and download a trainer as soon as they hit the first obstacle. I'll leave it to the neutral reader to decide which is which in this case.

[Lohingren]

erm lad one little thing you forgot to mention.... next time dont miss details out. "it is common for us to stage attacks on massing oc forces one system away from falkland's" .......... yesterday you came in with 9 fighters bud you started to form up and ready to roll when there was 3 people in the system.

i was lucky i noticed or we would have been hounded 3 to 1, i massed the troops up right away. now dont gimme bull about "were attacking cause oc was massing troops" utter crap you had the intent to invade when there was only few.

yet again miners looking to fight a army ........... get a grip boy

EDIT: im not saying dont attack, you need to recognize outcasts are arrogant b******* they speak down to everyone. you run into alpha your a fool plain and simple in a realistic manner of speaking..... and rping into a battle is not one lousy line at the start middle and end.

also i dont care if you attack but dont gimme crap covering up your invasion with a sad excuse "were attacking them cause theyre massing, 1. you where gonna before we had people in alpha 2. miners would attack when the place is EMPTY not frikkin full

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Reapers of Sirius Database

[Stoat]

There is definately an attitude, on this server, of bashing BSG and CR for being originally drawn from a non FL setting. OK, now that would be fair enough if the bashing was being done by people that have NO link in their RP to a non-FL setting. Sorry Dab, I'm referring to AW in this case. Ok, you've developed your RP beyond that original setting, and fair play to you for it, but now that you've done it you seem to be sitting on your castle walls chucking stones at folks for wanting the opportunity to DO THE SAME THING AS YOU. Nice one. Very considerate. If that's not what you're doing, you're not making your case very well in my opinion.

In my time here I don't recall seen anything so chilling as the vitriol, sniping and bias thrown at the "colonials", and this thread has just become another excuse for it.

Chopper was asking a perfectly reasonable question about his group's RP. I wish I had more to say on that subject, but i've almost never run across BSG in my time here, and certainly not since the split. But from what I've seen from what he has to say about the direction that they're trying to take, I say more power to him. StarButt also has made valid points, but he's very obviously angry, or it seems that way to me.

I'm in QCP (although I've not been active for way too long), and we're going through a difficult time trying to rationlise how we can do what we do (ie taking money off certain traders to feed our war effort against Kusari) within the ID restrictions. Blunt has posted a request for thoughts, and as far as I can remember from the thread, everyone has been extremely helpful with their suggestions. Then I compare that response to what's going on here................................ I'm not surprised there are some angry people.

BSG deserve the chance to develop beyond that from which they have come. Dab, Eppy, Gezza, StarButt, Doom, Chopper, you're more than welcome to tell me to take my opinions and stick them where the sun don't shine. I'm just hoping everyone can take their foot off the gas, cool down a little bit, and try to come up with something constructive to say.

My feeling on BSG is that they would have originally joined IMG as mercs, but have since become IMG guards. I don't know if there is an IMG Guard ID, or if the Merc ID allows you to operate within your chosen RP. You mention that you don't like the generic Military ID because it is too general and allows you to police the whole of Sirius, but you don't have to choose to do that. You can personally sanction ANY of your group that abuses your chosen RP. So, although it's not perfect by any means, it would allow you to police your ZOI and stop smugglers hauling drugs right past your front door.

It's my opinion that BSG should be allowed, and encouraged, to follow the route they are taking. All I can see is an increase in the opportunities to RP in the Tau systems.

Anyway, back to the battleground........................

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My Stories

[Exile]

Now that Stoat mentioned it, the Merc ID would be a perfect fit for BSG.
Nothing bigger than a GB, being able go allmost everywhere ( the famous In search for a home sentance. )
True, it opens up a gap to pvp whoring. But i doubt the BSG will lower themselfs to that.

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[Lohingren]

yes merc id in my opinon can be very much usable on your part. it would mean you can do most of the following, and im sure you can keep people in check the way everyone else keeps everyone in check, lay rules down straight. as stoat said sanction members who abuse it

and as you said your now a fighter/bomber wing (good for you;)) meaning the max GB does not effect you in the slightest

EDIT:you can keep your ships your rp your everything. and you are held down less by the IMG ID. and im sure you can enforce the no pvp whoring thing, and it lets you do as much RP as you wan't the way you want. it il be less inclined to use "MINERS ATTACKING US" line. and it well stop everyone from judging you because well...... your mercs you can do whatever the hell you want in essence have your OWN RP like your trying to do now, enhance and add to your rp.

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Reapers of Sirius Database

[chopper]

Praise the Stoat and utori for reasonable posts.

I know that we can limit ourselves even if we do use Merc or Military ID.
But the problem is, we will be subjected to even more "PVP whoring" accusations only because using that ID.
And that is a fact.
I will see with other BSG members how they feel about Military ID, but Merc ID is out of the question.

@Lohingren - You are forgetting that you are the ones who intruded Tau-23, and then got back to Alpha.
We only followed you to Tau-37, and then you jumped to Alpha, we stayed behind.
We then chose to punish you for that intrusion, with a simple "hit and run" action.
And we did it. Again, if you wanted a fight, you could have followed us to Tau-37 while we ran.
But you didn't, we docked and didn't attack again in 4 hours, just like the rules state.

And while we'r at RP, IMG can RP just as you RP.
So, we say we are very arrogant, very strong, very dangerous.
In RP sense, you can't invade Tau-23, because you would be beaten.
Now, does that sounds logical to you at all?
Of course not, that's how i see your post about "Miners not being able to attack Outcasts".
You are our enemies, we are yours.
If it is forbidden to attack your enemies now, then i think this server has a problem.

Looking forward to more constructive posts, please, by all means:)

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It is every Corsair's responsibility to die a beautiful death in defense of Crete, regardless of how OORP or how capwhoring the opposition is. Launch your fighter, joust the battlecruisers and die a beautiful death. Then, drink it down in the bar.

Can't let you bash folks in your sig Chopper-Del

[Doom]

mercs..faceless ID...lose of any identity even remotely connected with FL...

i was lucky i noticed or we would have been hounded 3 to 1, i massed the troops up right away. now dont gimme bull about "were attacking cause oc was massing troops" utter crap you had the intent to invade when there was only few.

hmm...that wasn't how it went....

this is how we saw it...

3 RoS in Tau 29 one of them known to be cruiser. Soon they enter Tau 23. At that time most of us were at Minato in Tau 44. RoS passes Tau 23 and enters Tau 37. I was first Viper who left Tau 44 and i got only glimpse of one RoS fighter on scanners. He was the last to jump into Tau 37. I follow...about 10 k in front of others...In Tau 37 i flew to the sun (half the system) and then stopped. Rest of my squad catches up with me. Then we drifted there talking about this thread and killing passing NPCs. Soon one of our traders noticed that there are RoS fleet is growing. At that time i thought it was good to test hit and run attack that i was planning some time now. We hit, destroy target, use Cylon in your system as excuse to leave (hacked weapon comp)...

And that was all....do you really thought we went with all vipers against Battleship, cruiser, GBs and bomber/fighter fleet...?...it was simple role played hit and run mission..(that is so much harder with set of rules we have now)..and we did pull it off...with out any rules breaking and with quite decent role play...

i am pleased with that...

[Lohingren]

as i said i dont think you got the point i was making doom mate, by all means DO ATTACK.... i honestly dont care i know how much the pvp value in this game is. the point im getting at is lets please limit the raid's PLEASE. RoS does not attack 23 often. infact that little excursion into 23 was well played i found it fun, and had no quarrels with it at all. but it was also the 1st in 3-4 days before that it was helping a tin can kill off you lad's.

dont take me wrong doom im not saying DONT attack im just saying, you are miners lets please limit them to once every 2 days or something atleast.

i aint got time in RL to dive on every 30 mins because of people raiding alpha its like a full time job and im to commited to just sit back and let people stroll through when friends need help.

and im also not saying its you doing it all. there are many people doing it and it is killing the mood, we sitting in alpha CONSTANTLY because we aint got time to move before a next wave of players come in.

EDIT: might i add jolly good show on a hit and run tactic bud, because imo i think thats the way you SHOULD be attacking, running in taking out a target running out. (though i am sure there was no gb's there was edge pheonix and the rest fighter's and one bomber im sure) i think thats the way everyone should be fighting getting in taking what you can and then running out when it comes to attacks on home system's. occasionally fighting to the end is fine, but in all fareness alpha has a defense grid of nuke's, corsairs have hordes of pirates if you dont go in and out quick your gonna be outnumbered in no time. im sure there are other excuses for the houses etc. hit and run is a very good tactic VERY good tactic in my opinion and especially with a miner id..... alot more realistic than staging full scale attacks, im sure they wouldn't have the man power to stage full scale battles on the enemies door step without dire cost to resources. the outcasts would be in the same boat if it was not for cardi. without that they would be as broke as the corsairs.

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Reapers of Sirius Database