RE: The sanction of the Hess/Bret Combined Forces BattleGroup

[Trogdor]

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I thought the first rule about sanction threads was... you don't talk about sanction threads.

Well, sorry. I disagree with the admins' decision here. I don't think there's anything wrong with what went down.

@Aet:
The hessians are locked in a bitter battle with the sairs, particularly in O5. Regardless of whether or not the Brets invited them (Which I have reason to believe they did given the thread proclaiming a Bret-Hessian alliance) I would think they would jump at a chance to take out a sair base. Which they did.

HOWEVER

I do think the 'sairs should get their base back (or at least some compensation) because at the time they built it, it was (I believe) under the rules that said you could dock on a base that was under attack and that shields would make a base invincible. Cannon et al changed the rules after the fact and therefore I think they should get a new base placed in a more Corsair-friendly location or some compensation for all the work they put into it.

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[FallenKnight]

Both sides are guilty of being in the same group as one another... that was the violation... and nothing else.

The base would have fallen anyway, it was lost to a fight which could have happened without the group. The group is the whole issue here, nothing more.

Yup. We all get the point and next time we would keep the groups separated. Like Del said the base was going down with or without groups.
If we all were not in same group, the base was about to vanish in the same way and maybe only RF would be sanctioned for violation their ID.

But still the entire temporrary assistence between Hessians and Bretonians against their sworn enemies Corsairs make sense in RP and many people can confirm it. That is not outcasts + corsairs against 3rd party. Hessians dont like Rheinland and yet they ally against Liberty. If corsairs assault new berlin I am sure RM would "ally" temporrarly with Hessians against corsairs and then slaughter each other. It make sense.

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Discovery Bridges[Feedback] Baron Piett[Biography]

[casero]

Nevermind

[Death.RunningVerminator]

If this whole sanction is based off of the issue of grouping, why were people that weren't in a group with Red Hessians sanctioned? This needs to be corrected from the admin team or else you're saying that the ENTIRE occurance was the issue. Which, it wasn't.

Also, I am not amused at the attitude of the Corsairs and other veterans. Preying on those who were sanctioned for a free CAU upgrade? Have you lost all sense of decency? Little more then common vultures. At least the BAF didn't sink to that level, and instead focused on docking, restock, re-equiping, and getting out of the Omicrons and back to Bretonia. They made it, thankfully.

I don't know who you're talking about but when I said that in the Flood thread it was just a joke. I wouldn't do that..

[Dude]

folks...... just a little break.
we got to stay to the facts. 1/5 of players on this server attacked the base. yea it was over 40player. please dont call this kind of behavoir RP. the whole thing was about "lets kill base". i was there. i saw a lot of people. i saw freelancer shooting. why do freelancer destroy a base? the thing is ........ it was just to blow up what others build. plz dont arguee about "why am i sactioned.....hessians are no enemys of bretonia". hessians are unlawful.....so the lawful bretonias dont like them. imagine u are a thief....do u realy think that police should catch u because you are from the same country? no lawful catch unlawful. just a little be more realistic.
i really dont get it how 20% of the server joined a "i will kill base party". sorry folks in my point of view its a shame.

[McNeo]

RP > ID imo. Seems like this is something that should have come down to a judgement call.. It does say don't do this, but I think in this case it should have been allowed. Kinda like how recently there was a guy who was not legally allowed to own a gun, but charges were dropped against him when he shot a home invader.

Interestingly, something like that happened here in the UK a few years ago. A guy, who didn't have a gun license, shot two burglars in his house. One of them died, and the other lived to see the defender of his home get sent to prison for manslaughter and possession of an unlicensed firearm. Oh, and the defender got sued by the surviving burglar as well.

Law is different in different countries, and in this case, different countries have different views about firearms.

I see no problem with having no decency when the people around you have no decency. I tried having decency when surrounded by despots a few times, but not once did I gaining something from it. Thus, an eye for an eye. I have absolutely no problems with ruining the day of somebody who would seek to ruin mine... and nor should you.

[Jeremy Hunter]

tries, and in this case, different countries have different views about firearms.

I see no problem with having no decency when the people around you have no decency. I tried having decency when surrounded by despots a few times, but not once did I gaining something from it. Thus, an eye for an eye. I have absolutely no problems with ruining the day of somebody who would seek to ruin mine... and nor should you.

Sinking to their level?

Good job.

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May you ever walk in the Light, Shizune.

[MB52]

The kind of punishment was so wrong. Hessians and BAF would've done same grouped or not. I never was told that groups are INRP tool which I happen to use OFTEN for simple effective communication between players. Reaction of Corsairs make me to loose any respect left I had to them. Yes I am looking at you Sails.

Groups have never traditionally been "in RP" if anything they are used to metagame.

Now I'm curious, what kinda RP happened, cause this could have been an epic RP moment, ruined by rules that really have no purpose. ( especially if, the base was to fall no matter what)

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I’ll carry this flag
To the grave if I must
Because it’s flag that I love
And a flag that I trust

[McNeo]

Sinking to their level?

Good job.

I prefer to call it "Playing by their rules".

I'm sure it says somewhere "treat somebody in the way that you wish to be treated". By now, people should expect to get treated this way. I sure do, since even if I'm minding my own business, I'm treated this way.

[Redon]

Before I go to sleep, I want to say a few things here. I was sanctioned too, as a Bowex trader who partially supplied the ships with bats and bots and partially helped shooting the base. I made it out of the Omicrons without being killed, I didn't lose anything. While I think giving out a sanction for what happened against so many players is really harsh, i can't deny that my behaviour in the situation was against my ID regulations and I'm not going to complain about the sanction to me.

I do, however, think I know what he is referring to:

Also, I am not amused at the attitude of the Corsairs and other veterans. Preying on those who were sanctioned for a free CAU upgrade? Have you lost all sense of decency? Little more then common vultures. At least the BAF didn't sink to that level, and instead focused on docking, restock, re-equiping, and getting out of the Omicrons and back to Bretonia. They made it, thankfully.

I was in Omicron Delta with another char later just to fly around and watch, and I must say the behaviour around there was disgraceful, and makes the reason why the bretonian/hessian players were sanctioned for in the first place look like a joke. If you base their sanction on the simple fact that they were in the same group, then it's unconscionable to send those players through a system, being attacked from a *randomly appearing* fleet of corsair caps (all of them being prepared totally legit RPwise, and of course no metagaming >_>) and losing things such as CAU's and cloak devices they must've spent hundreds of millions of credits on, if not much more. And the simple thought that I saw one of the players who participated in this revenge orgy request in a thread later that 'the corsair base should be restored now like the brimstone refinery' is absolutely ridiculous. That loss is also in no way comparable, since the corsair base would've fallen anyway, with or without the help of the hessians and accompanying rule violations.

As I said, I didn't lose anything on my side and I do think a consequence was appropriate for multiple players involved in the action, including me, but I denounce the way this was handled both by the admins enforcing the punishment as well as the corsairs and other players abusing the situation to farm some very expensive equipment and to get personal revenge based on an admin action which has nothing to do with RP events at all.