500 million fee

[Korrd]

I think an explanation is needed there.

We introduced that rule so those who wanted to create a new faction took it seriously instead.
Before that, most requests were made by new people who wanted to create a faction in order to be able to PvP around. Let alone that most had little or no RP effort behind them, and also 75% of those faction died on the middle of a flame war. There were more factions than players to join them.

So the rule was introduced to stop those who weren't really serious about making a new faction.
By forcing a candidate to pay 500 million credits in order to submit a request ensured that (s)he worked hard on designing the faction instead of submitting some "we are aliens from the earth who want to go around exterminating all players we came across with. We want to use all guns 'cuz we can loot them from destroyed ships, and all ships coz we can steal them with a magic spoon" crap for approval.

Short version: the rule was introduced in order to improve the quality of the factions.

Also, if I remember correctly the old factions were reviewed. Take AW as an example. AW was disbanded because it did not met the new RP quality standards, let alone it was below the minimum amount of members required in order to keep official status and control over the Zoner ZoI.

Also, for those who are wondering what do we do with the money, it does not go to the Admin arks. It goes to the poof-land. Vanishes. One of us goes to the account that contains the money for the request and deletes a few zeros from it.

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[Linkus]

If the faction does end up getting accepted, can they get the cash refunded to them?

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[Dusty Lens]

Thread is now being sanitized, please hold onto your hats and get children off of the floor. -DL

[Dusty Lens]

If the faction does end up getting accepted, can they get the cash refunded to them?

It goes towards an eventual guard system purchase.

Or if it does not meet snuff it goes towards investing time and thought.

[Hawkwings]

Anyone here ever heard of Ex Post Facto? That roughly means, a law that acts retroactively?

So let's say you go and jaywalk, but it's not against the law. The next day, they pass a law saying jaywalking is illegal, merits a 2-month jail sentence, and is retroactive. Then they go pick you up and throw you in jail. Can I assume everyone sees what's wrong with this?

If we go and change the faction application process so that you need a 1 billion deposit, do all those official factions that only gave 500mil suddenly lose their official faction status? No.

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[DAnvilFan]

Ex post facto laws are illogical and are prohibited in most countries. While it may seem "unfair" to the unofficial factions it is equally unfair to the official factions as well. Also, all of this moaning and groaning over "word choice" is a waste of time. So an admin said "no 500 mil, no faction," so what? It was clear from his post that he was being aggressive toward numerous players flooding the forum with faction proposals. And the "500 million" requirement makes sense. If you want to make a faction proposal, you have to be sure that you really, really want it to happen.

Here's a suggestion though: Make 500 million credit deposit refundable for accepted factions that don't want to purchase a system. So faction X pays 500 million, gets accepted and receives a refund because it doesn't want to buy a system. Faction Y pays 500 million, gets accepted, then pays another 500 to own omicron-whatever.

[farmerman]

What is the situation with the 500m for factions based on Samura, Kishiro, DSE, Daumann, etc - ie, the factions without a guard counterpart?

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Faction info links: Samura Heavy Industries : LWB : Watchers

[Daniel_Feenix]

What is the situation with the 500m for factions based on Samura, Kishiro, DSE, Daumann, etc - ie, the factions without a guard counterpart?

A deposit on a Barge for the faction? Taking the below quote from Del into account.

Also the option to buy a Barge instead of a system. That'll be made official very shortly. It's very unlikely to be turned down by the Admin team especuially as 5 have concurred already.

[Linkus]

What if the faction doesn't want a System, or can't get one, and also doesn't want a big ass useless ship that would be pretty pointless for most trading factions to use?

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[pbrione]

Then they have merely paid for the right to apply for the other benefits of being an official faction.

However, as has already been pointed out, the fact that ALL the pre-rule change factions have since paid 500 million to purchase a system, or are about to, renders your point void. In this sense, they HAVE already paid the extra 500 mill that new factions don't have to, because the application fee is now counted as a deposit towards system purchase, whereas it didn't used to be.

So, all factions have paid the same ammount in the end. Hence no need for arguments over such semantics in the rules. If the admins consider the old factions official, then they are so.

Whether factions should have to undergo a periodic review is another matter. Personally I feel perhaps they should.

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