[BU] - Bundschuh

[SimonBlack]

Even though the Bundschuh are patriots, they are fighting for the freedom of the people. If Liberty was to invade, and take over a democracy would more than likley be established, and the people given greater freedoms and liberties. After all, in the veiw Rhineland's people Liberty must be some kind of paradise otherwise why would all the rich folk be flocking there?

Might be very well the case. There is the possibility. If Liberty Navy defeats Rheinland Millitary a new goverment would be established and based on Bundschuh party, perhaps? Liberty would get a new market, sales would become profitable, they'd have a lot of influence within the new goverment. [Evil real world example]Something similiar to what happened in Germany after world war two, just without russians.[/Evil real worls example]

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Character background summaries:
Red Hessians Major Matthias Schwarz
Golden Chrysanthemums Chusa Fumiko Shimazu

[Kambei]

I must say Rheinland is more democratic and liberal than Liberty now, better be defeated by Bretonia.

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[SimonBlack]

Agreed:)

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Character background summaries:
Red Hessians Major Matthias Schwarz
Golden Chrysanthemums Chusa Fumiko Shimazu

[Blindside]

Even though the Bundschuh are patriots, they are fighting for the freedom of the people. If Liberty was to invade, and take over a democracy would more than likley be established, and the people given greater freedoms and liberties. After all, in the veiw Rhineland's people Liberty must be some kind of paradise otherwise why would all the rich folk be flocking there?

A government run by invaders/foreigners is not freedom, the people of Rheinland need to govern over the people of Rheinland. The Bundschuh were formed by some of the most educated people in Rheinland, they'd not overlook this. :)

[Blindside]

Might be very well the case. There is the possibility. If Liberty Navy defeats Rheinland Millitary a new goverment would be established and based on Bundschuh party, perhaps? Liberty would get a new market, sales would become profitable, they'd have a lot of influence within the new goverment. [Evil real world example]Something similiar to what happened in Germany after world war two, just without russians.[/Evil real worls example]

That's more like it! ;)

[beander2]

Even though the Bundschuh are patriots, they are fighting for the freedom of the people.

Again, this may be beyond the scope of a FL faction, but anyway...

This touches on my earlier question about legitimacy. The original faction description states that BU seeks a Socialist system. Fair enough, but at the end of the day, what if the "people" don't want that? Will BU step aside? If it is a legal party and loses elections, what then? Gryph states "If we get far enough to be a legal party, people will be inclined to do as we ask, because in order to get that far, people will have to be inclined to do as we ask." A new dictatorship in place of the current one? I thought, even in socialist democracy (which this advocates) they would be doing what the people asked...

Of course, I think the faction idea is great and the initial description excellent. I'm just having a discussion re: background motivations because that matters to an extent for whether I - and possibly others - would want to join.

Of course, whether they would want me...;)

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Sir Alisdair Buchanan, KBE ~ Gateway)Trafalgar

[beander2]

If Liberty was to invade, and take over a democracy would more than likley be established, and the people given greater freedoms and liberties. After all, in the veiw Rhineland's people Liberty must be some kind of paradise otherwise why would all the rich folk be flocking there?

I wonder about this. Bundschuh doesn't strike me (in any incarnation) as being favorable to Liberty success at the expense of Rheinland. "Greater freedoms and liberties" would just be Liberty presumption in the view of most Rheinlanders. Moreover, if the rich (i.e., capitalists) are flocking to Liberty, that would not make Liberty exemplary in the view of a socialist faction.

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Sir Alisdair Buchanan, KBE ~ Gateway)Trafalgar

[Warbird]

One must also consider the political instability that would be caused by a Libertonian invasion. Lack of faith in the RM? This leaves an opportunity for the Bundschuh to slip in and make their move at the [RM]. Would we want Liberty values? Dunno, but I definitely think that a major war between Liberty and Rheinland would be advantageous to our faction.

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[Cawdor]

first of all: socialists cant be patriots. never. a scialistic patriot sounds like dry water to me. the only case for them beeing patriots is if they rule the country. dont get them confused with social democrats.

[historical stuff from earth / not that important]
being german, i kind of know what i am talking about. just remember the GDR (that "other" germany in times of the cold war for those who dont remember).
this "republic" was nothing more then a socialistic regime where the main party got 90-95% at every election (surprise). now thats something for the people! and to keep them on the row, they pulled up the wall, massively used propaganda and installed a gestapo-like police. only it was called stasi this time.
now that party is present in the federal republic, because the GDR was peacefully absorbed by the FRG and not conquered. and i can tell you: they act like beeing democratic and all, but as long as those bastards are'nt in power, they give a damn about their country and would betray it at the first chance they get.
example russia WWI: russian monarchy was struggling against the germans in the first war and that was the chance the bolsheviks took, to get the power (russians died at the front for nothing, russia lost a massive amount of territory, all "different-thinkers" were killed in concentration camps - but a dictator still feels better then a monarch, doesnt he? :wacko:)[/historical stuff]

and if you ask a socialist about liberty, do you realy think he wouldnt blame them for stepping down on the workers too? to people like the bundschuh, one regime is as good as another. of course they would "backstab" rhineland. and they surely wouldnt care who the aggressor was here. after taking the "reichstag" (LOL?) they would install a socialistic regime and support revolutionarys all over sirius like the SCRA or what ever to spread what they consider as freedom.

and ... er ... i must confess i didnt read all parts of the news. i mean sure, germans are bad and all, but was really sayed that there is a non-democratic regime? it just doesnt make sense to throw down a monarchy to install a fascist regime .... man i just dont know who to trust these days:rolleyes:
but i guess they will nerver loose the evil touch from the nomad war - i think i should flip a coin about joining RM or BU :>

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[SimonBlack]

But if Bundschuh were academics and generally educated people... I fail to see how such people would want a socialistic regime. They [academics] should be quite liberal.

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Character background summaries:
Red Hessians Major Matthias Schwarz
Golden Chrysanthemums Chusa Fumiko Shimazu