I concurr with almost everything Juan has said. Really, when you start 2 bars (give or take, I don't want to look) from an LPI tag... Well, you can't really do much. If a noob got recommended to this server (and mod) along with FL by some means, he wouldn't know all this nonsense. He would take the jobs that are right there. I remember back in the olden days of my arrival, I thought I was lucky to have 500K. To take that away on some idiotic mockery of 'justice' is rediculous. Basically, what I'm saying is, ALL new people are going to get the LPI tag. Or Navy... That's just how it is. It's an undisputable certainty that they'll wind up with that tag if they just started playing FL (and Discovery).
And about, "Attempting to breach Zone-21 will result in you getting shot at" or whatever; generally yes. Mines have a tendency to explode when you get near them. And incidentally, most new players wont be able to find the hole in the field. I know I couldn't until a friend showed me.
Quote: I can make around 9 mil in about 10 minutes on a trade run. Imposing penalties that can be recouped in such a short time is, frankly, nothing less than silly. 15 mil actually takes time to reearn, and so actually deters people from commiting an act.
Yes... Congratulations. The problem is, most new players can't. If they (as stated above) get an LPI tag on accident, if they're truly new they'll probably say, "New affiliation? Wtf?" Anyways... Right. Assuming they're wanting to trade, they get a nice CSV (I think is what its called?) and are... Floating around with their LPI tag. This fine then takes into action. You good sir, may know all the sneaky routes, but the NEW players wont. They'll give up that 150K they've been stacking up for the past 4 hours and then they'll quit the server... Most likely.
No military in the world sells submarines to civilians, and logically, the Liberty Navy doesn't sell Gunboats or goodness-knows-what-else to anyone with a credit card who isn't blatantly hostile.
Yes... And on the entire planet of Manhattan, there isn't one shady dealer? What about the AK-47? Like I said, out-dated equipment. With the 74 pimping Russia's arsenal, they don't have much use for the old 47's. Which gives shady people chances to do thus and so with them. I found a fun little factoid. Factiod being that the FL universe wasn't made in a day. It wasn't *POP* Thousands of people. *POP POP* POLITICS! War! Aliens! OMG! *POP cubed* New ships straight off of the divine assembly lines located somewhere in Nevada.
Blue prints might have been stolen, this and that may have happened. The point is, however strangely the point was made, that this will also screw with peoples' stories. You fly around in X ship. And Y Faction using X ship says,
"You can't use that!"
"Well, I'm a retired thus and so."
"I don't belive you..."
"PM : Check the forums, my 15 page story is there."
"Omg lololol... Stpdi OORP Nubzor, I cudd rport u 4 thatz."
And... Those are the people I usually have to deal with when I USE CREATIVITY. (For emphasis, not shouting) Instead of just...
"Hmm... I think I'll make a pirate. But it will be a legal pirate... Oh! I'll make a new LPI/Navy character under these new rediculous laws that make all 'lawfuls' in Liberty pirates, able to fine anybody for the smallest infraction." And the proceeding character creation leads to a very monotonous camping of Manhattan, the shooting out of tail lights with Justices' then fining them for broken lights, and terrible RP dialogue from stupid people who just want to make a quick buck and then wind up transfering the money to buy a new Dreadnought.
*huff, puff* Right... I'm not sure where I was going with that. I think I made a point. Well, bye bye. You'll probably all skip my wall of aimless smack-downs. Well, again... Bye bye!
We are, as I have repeatedly stated, going easy on new players and under construction chars. We don't fine them, we explain what they did wrong, how they can fix it and help them fix it.
I agree, newbies ARE gonna get an LPI tag. Most likely, they will have no clue what an ID is and wonder why in the heavens the entire Liberty fleet is after them. I, for one would not like to be flying around in a shiny new Starflea (Oh wow! I get such a cool ship!!!!!) and get blown out of space by some trigger happy gunboat that (to them) seems to have uber-guns. If they are new, they will understandably start yelling about capwhoring and how the GB pilot sucks. GB pilot responds with: "Your ID and tag don't match, you're illegal, I can shoot you." Now I'm not saying anyone has, it's just to make a point. They won't have a clue what you mean when you say they're affiliated with faction "X" and that they have a civvy ID.
Magoo, yes I agree that ships can be stolen/captured/whathaveyou. On the description of some ships (not sure which ones ATM) it actually says it's often stolen or captured, and so faction "Y" will sometimes be seen flying it. I've had some indie LSF, LPI, and LN pilots tell me that my character was illegitimate LPI because he's flying a transport. I kindly referenced them to the ID description "Allowed ships: Fighters, bombers, transports, gunboats, etc..." and then kept going. They didn't try to fine me, probably because most Liberty Lawfuls have never read the Liberty rules! I hadn't even heard of them before today. If people want to make these rules law in Liberty, they're gonna have to make it more visible.
/rant pt 2
EDIT: just read Praetyre's post. I let them slide too, just inform them what's wrong.
Zealot Wrote:Just go play the game and have fun dammit.
Treewyrm Wrote:all in all the conclusion is that disco doesn't need antagonist factions, it doesn't need phantoms, it doesn't need nomads, it doesn't need coalition and it doesn't need many other things, no AIs, the game is hijacked by morons to confuse the game with their dickwaving generic competition games mixed up with troll-of-the-day.
Hmm, well, I thought the Penal code was mostly fair...slightly high in my opinion but all in all they make sense. If you fly as a freelancer or anything not LPI, LN or LSF you should not fly any of Liberty's Military ships. It is really simple as that. If you are flying a non-Liberty ship you should really try to RP for the faction group that owns the rights to the ship. This includes traders who IMO, should strictly fly with Corporate tags and IDs. The Trader ID annoys me just as much as the Military ID and should be used as an interim until you get the proper rep for a Sirius Trade Company, its not hard and, in fact, is very easy.
I don't really understand why people are getting so upset with this. RP Server, that is what this is. Perhaps if people simply tried to go along with it instead of screaming their heads off because they want to be ooRP it would work. I RP an LSF character who has the proper set up and have had no problems what so ever. Tags are easy people...don't be lazy.
Though, fining of lower level player should be lessened, or perhaps, a rehab session where they can listen to you and learn about good RP.
Just some corrections.
Yes people do complain about the RM and their heavy handedness, in fact I believe many HATE them for it.
Yes governments DO sell subs to people. You could buy one right now if you had the cash. Google it.
If this does go into effect, I believe there could easily be a new faction of Liberty freedom fighters trying to restore Liberty to some form of republic again.
The views of 4 or 5 people do not represent a whole house system and should be deposed if they start this kind of legal piracy.
We have a history of Revolution and change of leadership in Liberty (USA) for heavy handedness. It may start as a legal battle at first but will turn into a gorilla war eventually if things are not straightened out.
We are not Rein we are not Kusari, We are Liberty. Comparing cultures like that does nothing to prove a point. Apples and oranges.
I have not been affected by this in game yet, so I hope this is not a done deal and is still in consideration.
SGTMatt
EDIT: I just reread this and is sounds like a flame.. it isn't. I just feel very strongly about this.
A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship.
The name of this thread is ridiculous!! Reply to the laws? You don't reply to the laws, you obey them!
I am already disgusted to see Liberty policy being discussed without the slightest valid background every single day. And I can't ask all these needless threads to be closed by the admins despite being annoyed to see them. Its better to ignore them all, since I don't have time to spend on these nonsense.
In spite of congratulating the people who spend time to work on these political terms and encourage people to roleplay, you are despising their efforts instead. How nice really..
Match your goddamn IFF and IDs, use reasonable equipment and ships, hard to do? Suck it, this is a ROLEPLAY server!
Want to use a ship made for the Liberty Navy? Then go and prepare a roleplay post for permission. Is it so hard to spend some time? Roleplay people, roleplay! Spend some time on roleplaying before flaming people needlessly. Its already needless to tell all these here, you should have already thought about these details before spamming on the forums. This is a spam thread, and makes me more than sick. Needless to say, I won't argue on our own policy which will be strictly enforced. Like it or not, you ARE to obey Liberty Laws when you are in Liberty.
End of Word.
On the uncharted lagoons of anguish, I sail with a canoe made of my sins.
' Wrote:We are, as I have repeatedly stated, going easy on new players and under construction chars. We don't fine them, we explain what they did wrong, how they can fix it and help them fix it.
Your event is a fantastic idea, and I fully support it. The idea of public protests is brilliant and works well, and it is a good idea of a new type of non-combat event.
I support your idea, hope to see more like it in future and look forward to more RP of this sort. Good show.
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