The Contari Lance - CL}

[Yber]

So far CL acts within RP and doesn't let the OoRP perform a takeover, so yeah, get rid of the unactive factions.

Don't forget XTF once you're up there 8)

Pancakes for president.

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inb4 Sirius gets renamed to XTF.

[Treewyrm]

@Treewyrm - Well, firstly, I'd like to address your point in regards to our time existing and whatnot. Though we've only existed for a month and a half, we believe that, as we've been doing quite well whilst we've existed so far, we'll continue to do so. The official faction review period often takes three months or longer, and by the time it's over, we believe we'll have made it clear to everyone that we're here to stay, with a solidified position on the server and a faction that's either ready to be official or not. That should be clear to the admins once the long review period's over.

I'm not saying you didn't do well during that time, in fact quite the opposite, however the longivety of the faction is a different matter. Spend some more time, then it'll become clearer if your faction is there to stay. A month and a half is really nothing. My opinion essentially is that while I liked CL performance so far you're really jumping the gun with this request. Intents might be good, but timing is bad. Way too early.

Secondly, I would prefer not to go into a detailed listing as to why we think we're 'better' than the 101st. Giving out a list of reasons here will spark needless argument and conflict between the two factions and the rest of the server. That doesn't need to happen, and we don't want it to. We'll let our ingame interactions speak for themselves, and let the admins and community decide, rather than try to convince them. Make sense? As for the rest of your points, about the conflict, well, that could prove to be a problem with this process, we'll have to see how things work out.

Well, you've already opened a can of worms, and there is no way to back out of it now. So yes, you might as well state what exactly makes you better than them and what is it you deem worthy in yourselves to replace an existing official faction.

Regardless of whether or not we become official though, when we started, the 101st was around 3 days of activity. We've at least helped boost that up, and substantially so, though a lot of that is also their own effort. Activity does generate activity.

People generate activity. Every faction once in a while goes through their lowest curves of activity, that's a normal thing, and eventually you'll find Lance in the bottom of the curve as well. People come and go, they lose interest over time, novelty factors wear off as well, that and much more. So what separates sheep from goats is whether the faction is capable of crawling back from the bottom to good activity levels - that's what I call longivety. Personally I'd like CL to prove then can handle activity crisis.

About the events with the 101st in Alpha, can we refrain from assuming the worst? The outcome of that whole event actually turned out to be quite positive, both IRP and OORP, with talks with some of the 101st in the process.

Of course I know how it went, I was on Emissary character in there. What I'm worried about is this getting out of hand, because it almost did there. But what about next time? Fun as it may be at first, it could quickly escalate to troubling development, I hope it will not though.

[Pancakes]

So the admins drop a bone about unofficial factions challenging for officialdom, but provide no clear path nor the merits by which it should be done when one is to replace another. Supposedly they also had to address how it would work in situation with multiple official factions, but that did not follow either. So what now? This fast growing mess, soon to be blown of proportion. An illustrating example of a lack of foresight from the admins who pushed for that option, while supposedly in good intent at first, this is about creating purely artificial strife between the factions of the same origin, even greater fragmentation and without a doubt we are going to witness a new round of disco-drama in the next few days to come. Worse yet: OORP reasons now guide the RP and so Lance members act hostile towards 101st, a few steps short from starting a civil war not merely in roleplay but I'm afraid between the players of this community as well. This is going to get very ugly very quick.

Right, with that being said I don't think CL is ready to challenge 101st (and I'm not a member of either group, have no characters in either camp, just having an indie outcast). Month and a half isn't really much to challenge another faction. Sorry, Lancers, but had it been a much longer period of time and really clear points to show why and how it is substantially better, but that's neither here nor there.

What I can see however is Lance being a second official faction, after a longer period of time, but not by replacing 101st like this. Jump-start activity is not really a substantial indicator for longevity, nor a merit to replace another.

...but let us face it, the current one is long dead.

What, have I missed the funeral?! When was that? Player faction activity has nice numbers for them.

First thing Chenzo told us was that we are enemies of the state because we are shooting GRN ID'ed ships. That's right, the whole argument was because we were shooting GRN ships and 101st wanted us not to.

If 101st were around enough to know GRN (official too) are actually coming on their on to shoot OCs, they would zip it up, but they ain't. 101st is a dead faction for long time, barely seeing any of them around even when OC had lots of activity. (E.g when CCCP| guys raided Alpha, seeing even one 101st ship at the site was quite rare. Or when I myself lead raids against Outcasts as Council, the fights on OC side were lead by XTF since there were no 101st about).

101st were trying to use their faction right to dictate us what to use or what not to. In example they tried to force us out of using Corvo cruiser (which we have a permission for anyway), I am sorry but that's actually against what they should be doing, since we weren't going against canon-lore.
Not shooting Gallics? Chenzo said we will all get outlawed for that, please Treewyrm, give me a break, the whole scene was Chenzo having a problem with a faction that actually forms a competition to his own, and even other factions view it as such.
E.g when GRN actually asked for a NAP with OCs, they came directly to the CL rather than addressing either the CoD or 101st, since addressing forums lurkers won't have any impact on the game's game-play. Forums are a nice addon but they are not the game and never will replace it.

101st have barely any presence in-game, and the little they do have now is because of CL generating activity in all of the area in huge amounts, all factions there have their activity spiked.

The very reason I joined CL was because I was tired of 101st, and I am saying it as someone who didn't play OC for about 1.5 years before joining CL, but was shooting them and doing raids against them probably more than 95% of the community. OCs had a horrible lack of official faction presence on the field, and you can ask this anyone who was active in the zone during that time.

@Yber, I am sure something could be worked out and XTF could even be merged into CL. Talk with Irwin he's our leader

but I am the president ^_^


EDIT: Also Treewyrm, it's not having "ups and downs" 101st have barely any activity for more than a year, that's not something to be ignored.

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BLOOD FOR THE BLOOD GOD

[Narcotic]

I've never had any interaction with your group yet because I haven't been ingame since your creation, however I heard only good about you and I'm convinced that a new paint finish would do wonders for the Outcasts.

Wish you good luck.



(And regarding that new "challenging for officialdom"-politics - I'll try to get an admin making it clearer.)

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[Savannah]

101st activity is largery independent of Lance's efforts. Not so long ago we had 13 hours, then we had 3, now we have high activity again. World doesn't revolve around the Lance. True, we had better and worse times, but it's not in numbers alone. At the same, one of the major participants in Taus from the lawful side is very inactive right now, and it is independent from CL)'s activity as well.

From my subjective impression, CL) tends to linger in Tau-23, and this is where its major activity is. In this regard, I fought alongside them not once and I have a good impression from this time. Again though, from my subjective impression, those few times CL were in alpha they tended to stick to themselves in their RP.

Having said that, it's good to have more Outcast people around, and it's definitely a good thing. I am in Alpha for 4 years, I spent countless time as Outcast, I saw better and worst times for Alpha, better and worse times for 101st, saw other factions rising and falling. There were different people both among independents and 101st. One thing I always want to see is people respectful to each other, independently of factions they belong. I gave CL) respect from the beginning for granted and treated CL) as my amigos. And what general Outcast players need is a nice time in cosy home instead of hate.

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[Treewyrm]

@Pancakes: Chenzo this, Chenzo that, give me a break. Have I said anything about Chenzo? Or Gallia? No. All that GRN-related stuff - take that to him, bloody hell - the heck you drag me into GRN/101st issue. Chenzo needed a slap on the wrist long time anyway and I'd be neither first nor last to say about that, but that's a whole different issue. See, I've made my point about timing (which I think is too early, say 3-4 months and then a request) and I've commended CL on activity in this month and a half (new faction - high activity) and other stuff, suggested they should be a second official outcast faction (so far so good), but I've explained my worries on that it may turn rather ugly (and partially you confirm it kinda is), and about ups and down (yes, it is about them too). And that's it. Leave me out of that Chenzo drama, mkay?

[Pancakes]

@Pancakes: Chenzo this, Chenzo that, give me a break. Have I said anything about Chenzo? Or Gallia? No. All that GRN-related stuff - take that to him, bloody hell - the heck you drag me into GRN/101st issue. Chenzo needed a slap on the wrist long time anyway and I'd be neither first nor last to say about that, but that's a whole different issue. See, I've made my point about timing (which I think is too early, say 3-4 months and then a request) and I've commended CL on activity in this month and a half (new faction - high activity) and other stuff, suggested they should be a second official outcast faction (so far so good), but I've explained my worries on that it may turn rather ugly (and partially you confirm it kinda is), and about ups and down (yes, it is about them too). And that's it. Leave me out of that Chenzo drama, mkay?

Dun kill me

Also, per the current server rules we can't have 2 official factions, and we are in honest belief we are better fitting to the current 1 slot. That's all.

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BLOOD FOR THE BLOOD GOD

[Treewyrm]

Also, per the current server rules we can't have 2 official factions, and we are in honest belief we are better fitting to the current 1 slot. That's all.

Well frak that noise, petition and have an exception to server rules in this case, hell I'd be the first one to sign it and have CL on the list. Just as Corsairs have bunch of official factions to them, just as there are all kind of Zoner flavors. Outcasts need two/three official factions to them.

[Ryummel]

Well frak that noise, petition and have an exception to server rules in this case, hell I'd be the first one to sign it and have CL on the list. Just as Corsairs have bunch of official factions to them, just as there are all kind of Zoner flavors. Outcasts need two/three official factions to them.

Think you aren't the only one who wants that outcome happening instead of the mere replacement. Suppose we'll have to wait three months first or...?

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[Mercarryn]

Well, not going to comment about CL}`s behaviour so far, because I have not enough experience with you to make any statement about it.

But: I agree with Treewyrm that you should have first waited at leas a few more months until you challeng 101st for officialdom. It would give you more time to establish yourselves on the server, getting up reputation with other factions.

Then admins can check out if this is a serious attempt for official status or just a short lived venture by setting up an additional trial phase.