Abuse of Power Complaint to Admins Via Bretonian War Cabinet/BAF

[Soul Reaper]

The point I'm making is that using your enemy's password that was given to you because of misplaced trust to destroy their base, should be a definite -no-.

Your "enemy's" password? Well, that's the real problem, isn't it?
If you build a base in Bretonian space, the BPA shouldn't be your "enemy".
If it were, your base shouldn't exist in the first place.

The main argument I've heard about possible alternatives involve admin magic.
So does anyone really expect there'd be less QQ if oorp Admin action were taken, rather than inrp BPA action?
Please. The base was eliminated because it posed a threat to national security, as it were.
If you've got a problem with that, take it to the Bretonian government inrp, don't QQ about it oorp.

Do I need to repeat yet again how properly supplied bases are indestructible?
If there had been prior warning, chances are the BPA and BAF simply would not be able to remove the place if necessary.

Now THAT'S oorp.

Bretonia became the enemy the moment they wanted to remove the base. I'm not saying -don't- eliminate the base, if it's a threat to national security, by all means, try and kill it as you're supposed to, with a fleet.

And no, a core 4 base is not indestructible, and if bretonia lacks the manpower to destroy it, that's their problem, that doesn't give them the right to use the guy's password in that way.

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[SummerMcLovin]

Well "at the time you needed me" I was a lowly Sergeant, as I've told you in the past. It was only after I got promoted and added to the War Cabinet that anything actually happened - you got your jump permissions and the like sorted out. What DSE permissions have to do with a BHG station I am not sure though.

All my "RP power" is from well before I was a Moderator, but feel free to show me where I have abused my new powers in that way. The closest thing I can think of is that I don't need to swap accounts to update the licensing lists.

"My cronies" posting here were those also involved in the decision (or Hone being Hone) and chose to do so. Like I suggested to you on Skype, feel free to add something beneficial to the thread as a fair few have. I suppose we can make do with the Bretonian conspiracy of Facist McModerator SummerMcLovin though.

EDIT: Forgot to mention that actually two of the cronies on my side actually outrank me both in and out of RP - hardly ordering them around. I'm not "just following orders" either on the other end of that spectrum, and there's no need to satisfy Goodwin's Law either.

And Duv, this did remind me of FPXXI. There was a password (demanded by the KNF as all bases were - at least at the time if it has since changed) used to weaken the base, but I cannot remember what exactly happened at the time.

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Kingdom of Bretonia
Colonial Republic
Independent Miners Guild
Ex-Admin

[Hone]

Keep it calm guys -- don't insult one another. This is an important discussion and the results of it will probably result in long term policy changes or clarifications.

Quite right, I apologise if I was rude to anyone.

There's only two things that happened here, and has nothing to do with inRP reasons because it never really got to that point.

1. The base owner, John, went full-retard and gave out his base's administration password because he "trusted" Summer.
2. Summer went full-backstab (no offense, it's just the best way to explain the action) and removed fuel/crew or whatever, and destroyed the base.

Now while it may seem Summer acted on aforementioned roleplay of the base being ordered to be destroyed by the Bretonian War Cabinet. In no way did Summer have the right to use the means to destroy John's base via his own password. Sure, ordering it's destruction inRP is fine, I don't care, grab some battleships and destroy it if you can, but using the trust of another player to screw him over like that, that's just, no.

Now of course, it was John's stupidity that allowed for all this to happen, so Summer couldn't be blamed entirely, giving up a base password is just..well, stupid.

Now while there are no rules that govern bases, there is one specific rule that governs player interaction, which is 0.0

This has nothing to do with inRP interaction and/or inRP consequences of any sort. This is about a player using the trust of another player against him. And even though I love Summer and I myself do trust him, if I were the admin team I would charge him with 0.0 and possibly ban him for at least a month as well as deleting a few characters that would net a total of around what the base had cost. But that's me.

Either way, the point I'm trying to make is that in my opinion this whole event should have nothing to do with RP, because before the RP, something incredibly bad happened between players in an ooRP context. So for the following quote:

I admit that this would have been a better way of RPing it, although it doesn't stop it being ooRPly horrible. Although I appreciate the people backing me up, don't anyone think I'm happy with myself for doing things this way.

Then you shouldn't have done it, and you should be punished for doing it, no matter how you may or may not feel.

Summers character had the base password INRP, John didnt go full retard giving it, it was the conditions of building weapons platforms there. So seeing as his char had it in RP, Id say he had every right to use it INRP. How can you argue with that? Something isnt OORP simply because you say it is.

There is no such rule as 0.0. the fact that you didnt notice this makes me think its likely you also havnt noticed the RP justification behind what Summer did.

Summer doesnt like me very much, and probly doesnt want me to defend him or be associated with me, but while I may agree with AlteJago on how people in power work (as if thats anything everyone didnt already know since forever, and just a fact of life) that doesnt change the fact that Summer didnt do wrong here, and shouldnt be punished. I dont need him to like me to say that.

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[Soul Reaper]

You're all saying this and "defending" Summer but you miss the fact that Summer himself is attesting to what he did was wrong in a player-interaction sense.

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[Duvelske]

And Duv, this did remind me of FPXXI. There was a password (demanded by the KNF as all bases were - at least at the time if it has since changed) used to weaken the base, but I cannot remember what exactly happened at the time.

In short: Yup.. base restore no.. (DISCRIMINATION!! Lawl.. ) But in the end it didnt matter much as well solved it with the person responsible for it in private. In the end it worked out for the both in the best. Offered then to help rebuilding it on the location it is now. But well didn't need it. Had only 2 horrible weeks hauling SHP panels.. Zombie like.. on teamspeak that was funny. Had some good laughs with the other one with whom i was rebuilding it.

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[Hone]

You're all saying this and "defending" Summer but you miss the fact that Summer himself is attesting to what he did was wrong in a player-interaction sense.

As I said earlier I also disagree with Summer, I think hes being too generous to OP. People dont have to fall into "camps" or be "cronies" as you accuse us, we can have our own opinions.

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[Soul Reaper]

I'm not accusing you of anything.
>_>

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[Karst]

Bretonia became the enemy the moment they wanted to remove the base. I'm not saying -don't- eliminate the base, if it's a threat to national security, by all means, try and kill it as you're supposed to, with a fleet.

And no, a core 4 base is not indestructible, and if bretonia lacks the manpower to destroy it, that's their problem, that doesn't give them the right to use the guy's password in that way.

Yeah.....that's a game mechanics issue. It makes no sense whatsoever that a house with, inrp, a massive fleet, would not be able to dispose of a base in their house, particularly along a major shipping lane.
If you've got a base in Bretonia, and you piss off the Bretonian government / BPA, it dies. Why should there be a week-long siege?
The BPA, inrp, should be able to easily, effortlessly shut down a base along principal Bretonian trade routes.
Inrp, they control the supply along the tradelanes and gates. If your base poses a problem,they'll shut it down.
However, this is not always realistically achievable. A well-supplied base simply takes an oorp amount of effort destroy, if it's possible at all. I mean, build a couple storage modules, fill with MOX.
Congratulations, unless that house is active 24/7, your base now cannot be destroyed.

But aside from RP, a base sitting on a jumpgate in house space with massive amounts of weapon platforms is an issue.
Want to build a base that doesn't cause lots of QQ due to gameplay issues? Don't build and a base with a crapload of weapon platforms right on a vibrant trade route.
And if you do, don't "experiment" with weapon settings if there are civilian ships around.

If you really want to build a base with possibly questionable amounts of weapon platforms in house space, do so away from trade lanes.

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[Soul Reaper]

Then you take that up with the devs, that doesn't have to do with the topic at hand, the situation continues according to what we currently have, and that's what bases are right now. So bringing that up is irrelevant, it doesn't have anything to do with ooRP actions. As for building it, as far as I'm aware the base has changed hands and was sold and bought. Just because Bretonia made a mistake in judgement by allowing it to be built in the first place doesn't mean they can use ooRP means and justification to make it right.

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[Hone]

Then you take that up with the devs, that doesn't have to do with the topic at hand, the situation continues according to what we currently have, and that's what bases are right now. So bringing that up is irrelevant, it doesn't have anything to do with ooRP actions. As for building it, as far as I'm aware the base has changed hands and was sold and bought. Just because Bretonia made a mistake in judgement by allowing it to be built in the first place doesn't mean they can use ooRP means and justification to make it right.

You keep saying its oorp, but you havnt given a reason for why a character using a password they have, is OORP.

Wheras I have given a reason for why I think its In RP for Summer's police char to use a password he had been given INRP to stop a threat to his house.

Do you actually have a reason?

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