Old balance issues

[Xoria]

The Lane Hackers request some adjustments to the Hellflurry line of guns. As you can see below, our class 9 guns are substantially inferior to both the Outcast equivalent weapons.

Kraken Type 2, class 9
Power-Usage: 126.00
Projectile-Speed: 700
Range : 700
Hull-Damage : 556
Shield-Damage : 278
Hull damage efficiency : 556/126 = 4.41

Hellflurry Mk IV, class 9
Power-Usage : 130.00
Projectile-Speed : 700
Range : 700
Hull-Damage : 446
Shield-Damage : 223
Hull damage efficiency : 446/130 = 3.43

Wyrm Type 2, class 9
Power-Usage : 165.00
Projectile-Speed: 700
Range : 700
Hull-Damage : 652
Shield-Damage : 326
Hull damage efficiency : 3.95

To make this situation even worse, the Hellflurry line jumps from class 6 Hellflury Mk III guns, to class 9 Mk IV guns, with no options for class 7 and class 8 weapons slots. This is especially painful because the Slipstream LF's gun mounts consist of a pair of class 7, a pair of class 8, and a pair of class 9. In order to stay completely Lane Hacker authentic, a Slipstream can mount 2 class 9 Hellflurries and then either 4 class 6 Hellflurries, or 2 class 6 Hellflurries and 2 shieldbusters.
Given the choice of receiving class 8 OR class 7 Hellflurries, I'm not really sure which would be the most helpful to us. Someone more experienced in the technical demands of combat can illuminate us on that, but I would greatly prefer to have both class 7 AND class 8 Hellflurries available.
Of perhaps even greater importance, Hellflurries of class 6 through 9 need to be significantly upgraded. For the same power requirement, the Hellflurry delivers significantly LESS damage output.
I am not so sure that I want to advocate making the Hellflurry completely similar to the Wyrm or Kraken. I would like to still see some tactical difference in the gun. Perhaps dramatically lowering the power usage and the damage, but increasing the refire rate to 5.88, and even the range to 800 would give us a unique gun.
Here are some options for adjustment : (the numbers are examples for effect, not necessarily the "best" ones to choose from)
1. Increase damage to be similar to Krakens, no other changes
2. Increase refire rate to 5.88 and range to 800, power and damage is decreased somewhat to bring it in line with 5.88 guns
3. Increase range and projectile speed to 1000, decrease refire to 3.03 ( so basically we get a gun that is harder to evade and can strike at a greater distance, but fires less often to make the power usage more balanced
4. Decrease power usage to 100 in order to be proportional to Krakens from an efficiency standpoint; change nothing else
I am not going to claim that any of these are the best options or the right options, and they certainly are not the only ones. I just wanted to give some positive suggestions rather than just negative criticisms.
My bottom line is that the Hellflurries desperately need adjustment in order to make them competitive. As they currently are, I am forcing my Lane Hackers into significant tactical disadvantages in favor of the "authenticity" of Lane Hacker roleplaying. Clearly we have some excellent pilots who are able to overcome those disadvantages, but not all of us are. I would dearly love to never need to mount a gun on a fighter that can't be purchased from a Lane Hacker base (we have our own access to Debilitators!!!), but currently, I just can't bring myself to make that clan policy for our members for their entire career. LH members are fighting an uphill battle on several counts already without having this extraordinary Hellflurry disadvantage.
Those of you with more technical expertise with comparing these weapons, please chime in and work out a solution to fix this for us.
I would like the Hellflurries to provide a competitive, and unique option, rather than being a clone of the Kraken or something else. I think that fits with who the Lane Hackers are. We also need a choice of class 7 and class 8 Hellflurries (or at least one of them at a minimum).

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[mjolnir]

You missed that Krakens are Particle (most effective against Graviton shields)... while Hellfuries (Tachyon) are most effective against Molecular shields....which is just about useless in Liberty...

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Problem is that Krakens are so much superior to everything else...

If we compare them to
Buckshots:
458 damage
122 energy
750 speed
Particle (best against gravitons)

the Hellfuries are still worse... the -50 m/s in speed means they don't sync with Debilitators that well..

I would suggest:
- move the Hellfury speed up to 750 m/s
and
- up the damage to some 500 (remember they are sill Tachyons)
or
- lower energy to 100

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It's indeed strange that Lane Hackers (that are supposed to be technical geniuses) have so much worse weapons than their direct allies.

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Igiss says: Martin, you give them a finger, they bite off your arm.

[RingoW]

Back to the Barghest.

Unfortunately it can't be smaller. It is based on the Wolfhound/Werewolf. They are really huge fighters.
The ship was primary meant to be for RP and not PvP. Thats why it has a huge cargohold for a fighter. So it may get better agility and maybe better shields, but it depends on Igiss. Maybe the second turret can get a forward arc to.
On the other hand, the BHG gunship is to small. It needs to be upscaled to become bigger than the Kusari GB.

Respectful
AoM

[Horon]

On the other hand, the BHG gunship is to small. It needs to be upscaled to become bigger than the Kusari GB.

The answer to your statement is right in front of you. Lets review the facts. Its a GUNSHIP versus a GUNBOAT. The GUNSHIP already has poor enough armor, so why not make it even bigger so it sucks? GUNSHIPS are SUPPOSED to be smaller and weaker than GUNBOATS.

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While being quite funny, your sig was the biggest one i've ever seen so far. No more than 700x250 please. ~utrack
http://pastebin.com/SYQXBufs

[LH~Emilio.Largo]

Agreed with Mjonlir. Though we can't expect it to become like Kraken, Hellfurry really needs some boost.

Even Vampires (IMG gun) are much better then Hellfurries.
They are also Tacyon, but at least they spend only 100 energy for 430 damage.
Also, I would like to add that Hellfurries have an efficiency similar to Black Widows, while giving nothing extraordinary in sense of damage.
That means, it has energy efficiency of Black Widow, while it does 140 less damage.
It really needs a boost.
But I don't think it is possible to make it a unique gun.
Also, only improving speed to 750 wouldn't help a lot.
Improving speed and decreasing energy to 100 probably would.

My suggestion is to give it around 500 damage with 130 energy usage.

Edit :
Also, we lack a Hellfurry turret. Class 4 or 5 would be nice.

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[Xoria]

Right, I forgot about the turret situation. We have the Scimitar and Sabre that mount turrets, and pathetic Hellflury options for them. A class 5 Hellflurry turret would be fabulous.

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[mwerte]

Could the sheer amount of Corsair NPCs in Eta be turned down?

Yes I know that it's contested but the infocard for Palmero states that "the defenders here have been successful at stopping almost all major Corsair incursions." or something like that. Anyway, I'm sick of being hit by 8-10 Corsair NPCs as soon as I come in from Alpha. In last weeks RoS/TBH fight I checked the NPCs and there were 15ish Corsair NPCs and 0 OC NPCs.

So could the Corsairs be restricted to the Corsair side of the minefield and a little bit around Palmero?

Thanks

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[mjolnir]

Could Missile turrets on capital ships use ammo instead of energy?

I would say that lot of people have recently been abusing them in capships...

basically they mount 4 or more turrets on a gunboat or... 6 on a Battlecruiser...and then go around to hunt fighters.... either for bounty or for fun... since they are in a capship it ensures they survive for some time... enough time to get a lucky hit on one of the fighters/bombers attacking them. It's ok for me... the problem is that they can do this indefinitely...an agile fighter fully loaded with missiles can be dangerous as well...but his ammo will run out... fast.

If capship turrets get ammo then this will be reduced.. because say 4 turrets will:
1. Eat the ammo fast (but of course you can have different types... but then their the missiles fly different... so they don't hit that often)

2. If the missiles are priced somewhere between cannonball and Nova torpedo... it will get expensive.

3. They can still be used as "support weapons" mounting 1-2 turrets on a ship as they should be.

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Igiss says: Martin, you give them a finger, they bite off your arm.

[bluntpencil2001]

An addendum to Mjolnir's post, if I may...

Could we make missiles take up cargo space, which would be more realistic than the 70 of one type restrictions? It is certainly possible, since Freeworlds has it, but would this effect balance at all?

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[Eppy]

I'd just like to point out that players that do this really have no idea what they're doing...mounting more than two missiles on a Capship is generally a very stupid thing to do, since the minute you come up against other capships you're effed. If you want to make Capship missiles more effective I'm all for it, make them suck ammo. Otherwise, those babies need some help...

Figther missiles I would also like to see more effective, for those of us who can't shoot -.-

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Quick comment - we thought that Panzer was the Leader, Swift. -Agmen

Which Dreadnought was that?

One of your nine.