Alliances, how they should be treated and Ship sharing

[Jinx]

haven t read the whole thread - actually, i haven t read a single post that time. - but the answer to the original question from my side would be:

there is no answer in general. an alliance is not like another alliance. they have different reasons, different factions involved. for example, the order is allied to the corsairs - that is not cause the order felt lonely and wished to have a good friend to talk to when they felt alone in space, but they forged that alliance, cause they were in dire need of resources and combat training, while on the other hand, the corsairs needed the technical knowledge from the order.

then again, we have alliances like the Farmers Alliance and the gaians, who somewhat share a common cause. They hardly ever meet each other, and if they did, they d prolly realize that they re not at all too similar, - but they are allied, cause they feel that they are somewhat pulling on the same end of the rope.

For example - i think its perfectly OK when a Gaian wishes to use a FA weapon ( ships don t matter, cause they both use the same ships ), but it feels strange when a Gaian wished to buy a titan from the corsairs ( the other allies ).

so one cannot make a rule about what allies can do and what not, but has to look at the reasons why the factions are allied and how likely it is that they not only share assistance and knowledge, but also precious technology.

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Shipdesigns made for DiscoveryGC

[Linkus]

If you pay enough cash, you can get whatever you want. I bet if you had the billions, you could buy a Nimtz Class Carrier in real life, you just wouldn't be able to keep it going with the upkeep.

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Facilitating the rise of robotics since 0 A.D.

[Vape]

FL is more based on the times of WWI/WWII, not present day, in both combat structure, gameplay(pirating, etc...), and politics.

During those times, each nation, regardless of alliances, had their own equipment. Why? (And, I mean why as in for what, not addressing you, Why?) Simply because all of the nations were on the same level in terms of political, economic, and military power. In contrast to today, where the USA and one or two other countries more or less dominate the world's power scene. In FL, like the world of WWI/WWII, the houses(nations) are on the same plane.

Ingame, they do make it obvious that Liberty has the most powerful navy in general, followed closely by Rheinland, then Kusari, and Bretonia. But it is also clear that none of the houses can easily take another out one on one.

As a result, if we look at how the alliances worked then, ship sharing should not really take place in a similar situation(the FL universe). In WWII, the British had the Spitfire...you never saw them with Hawker Hurricanes or Mustangs. The Russians had their own thing. The Japanese didn't fly Stukas, and the Germans sure didn't field AM6 Zeros.

I can, however, understand if Hessians choose to use Sabres over the Odin, or if Lib Navy uses Avengers instead of Guardians.

ahem, first of all, the British MADE the Hawker Hurricane
secondly, the US sold them fighters and ships (lend lease treaty, remember that?) fighter wise, we sold em B-24 Liberators, P-40s (i think), P-51s, and others. We also sold em guns and tanks. The m3 grant tank, the sherman, and others.

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[Dab]

Personally, I see it like this:-

If two player factions ally and their infocards support that then it's up to them what they do and how they do it in their alliance. All I want is at least one, detailed RP post/thread stating that they are allied, what the goals of the alliance are, what the terms are etc.

At least then they can point to some proof of their ingame dealings here on the forums.

This I think is a very good approach. In terms of player factions in an alliance, they should dictate what happens between their ships, to an extent. For example, RoS or 101st allied with someone could conceivably get an ally access to the Outcast Battleship (I think the OC Dread should be restricted to ONLY Outcasts, which is why I'm getting the money to change the Caedo to a BS and get rid of the Dread.) but the BLS is smaller and has less access to the large capital ships. Mostly because they are more piratical and fast-attack strikes rather than the brute force that the RoS/101st use more often. I don't even think the BLS do have a BS, though they might. *Looks at Zapp.*

I think though, that any Battleship-class purchase needs to be fully RPd, even if they are allies. And of course, an RP post/thread for the alliance itself.

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[Jihadjoe]

I tend to think of it as this. The Royal Navy and the US Naval forces work together commonly in exercises and in combat. The Royal Navy don't use Nimitz class Aircraft carriers though, and the US navy do not use any Type 45 frigates that the Royal Navy have 'lying around'. So to me there would be no sense in some factions stating that they are allied with this, that and the other, allowing them to use any of their ships.

However, the british army did recently recieve a load of Apache gunships and the US use Harriers.

Allies swap technology all the time, it makes sense to...

What I don't like in game is people using other factions caps. Allied or not, Corsairs shouldn't use the Osiris, its an Order ship.

A faction should use only their own caps and 90% their own fighters. The fighters/bombers from other factions should either be one off ships that have been justified by RP, or from deals made with other player factions.

I won't bother to bore you all with examples but that seems like a total no brainer to me.

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[pchwang]

ahem, first of all, the British MADE the Hawker Hurricane

Argh, my bad. My knowledge on WWII politics is rusty.

But my point stands...while it's been done in the past, I don't think that it should be done now.

The US sold those fighters to the British because they needed it. If we place that into context with Liberty and Bretonia's current alliance and situation, Bretonia should be able to buy a good deal of VHFs from Liberty. But how would you react if you undocked to see two Templars and 3 Guardians - all tagged BAF - drifting in orbit of New London?

In my opinion, it should not be done because Bretonia still has the capability to produce highly competent vessels of their own.

For pirates, on the other hand, ship sharing is more acceptable since it is the case that not all pirate factions have equal opportunity to produce competent vessels.

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[7:42:05 PM][6:51:36 PM] Igor (Smokey): btw terry
[6:51:48 PM] Terrance Cooper: Ye?
[6:52:00 PM] Igor (Smokey): nothin
[6:52:03 PM] Igor (Smokey): just sayin btw
[6:52:05 PM] Terrance Cooper: <_<

Johnny_Haas: you shot anti criuse speed rockets!!!
Johnny_Haas: but why????
Johnny_Haas: ??
Johnny_Haas: why you shoot criuse speed rockets?

[Dab]

However, the british army did recently recieve a load of Apache gunships and the US use Harriers.

Allies swap technology all the time, it makes sense to...

What I don't like in game is people using other factions caps. Allied or not, Corsairs shouldn't use the Osiris, its an Order ship.

A faction should use only their own caps and 90% their own fighters. The fighters/bombers from other factions should either be one off ships that have been justified by RP, or from deals made with other player factions.

I won't bother to bore you all with examples but that seems like a total no brainer to me.

Well the Corsairs can use the Osiris because the NPCs have numerous Osiris patrols in Delta. I think it would be best to put in Corsair BS patrols using the Dreadnought and Outcast Patrols using the Battleship (OC Dread is more rare) rather than the Corsairs using the Osiris, that way it can go back to being Order only.. I do wish I saw less of them though.. The ratio of Osirises to Corsair Dreads in the Corsair fleet is around 5:1..

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