Discovery Matchmaker: How it works?

[jammi]

Solaris are weapons of terror, we all agree. But not more than snac. They both do the job they were designed for.

But bombers do their role. They attack. Why, oh why can't GBs do their role? Because of turrets that can hit snubs? What is GBs role in that case?

If rebalancing turrets will make GBs do their role, all fine. Just let Matchmaker works and all happy.

I hope rebalanced GBs will not follow what happened with rebalanced LFs. I miss them.

Presumably that means the weapons that allow you to zoom out, close your eyes and get kills by holding down the right mouse button will be less effective. Gunboats still have a whole battery of tools left that they can use. Skill based weapons like razors still make them an absolute nightmare to deal with, making gunboats highly effective for those who are capable of using them correctly. Honestly, that strikes me as a far better situation than bland turret-boats.

[Mímir]

Skill based weapons like razors

A lot of things have changed. I wouldn't call TS/TZ razoring "skill-based" in any way. Zoom out, click mouse, collect blues.

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The problem stems from really poor implementation of caps and other toys. I understand why they need to be in the mod, and I do see how they attract new players, but it was a mistake to make them so accessible and also a mistake to let them have an influence on snub fights. The last 3 times I logged to play I got:

1) Chased by two capital ships and a CD'ing snub for 50K through the Badlands.
2) Attacked by a snub, fought it for a little while until the dude started full-on shieldrunning and then suiciding to protect his precious little ego.
3) Attacked by a Bounty Hunter bomber with a particularly deadly SNAC aim, and after a long and strenuous fight where I stayed on my toes at all times to not make a mistake while slowly grinding him down, he cloaks out.

Needless to say, I logged off instantly afterwards in each case. Why should I waste my time playing this game? Where is the fun? Essentially through a string of bad decisions, we have a game that caters for morons and drives away reasonably sound people (when they don't get banned, that is), and in spite of 3-4 years of people hashing over very obvious problems within both the rules framework and the mod itself again and again, nothing ever changes.

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[Pepe]

I really hope someone reads when ^this guy has something to say.

I'd like to humbly add something to that:

Disco was always hard mod. But now we are short of nice new players. It was never like now. Some new bloke comes to Disco and he gets spanked by us pretty fast. He does more missions, gets more courage and then gets his daily spanking again. Someone tells him to train in Conn. Spanked again. He can do more or less 3 things:

1. Quits. Like any average nice guy.
2. Stays, but starts using smartass methods, like logging on stronger side, using caps to molest others, abusing cloaks, jumps... Taking fun from others becomes his style.
3. Stays, but starts searching for "additional tools" that will help him dodge and aim better.
4. Trains more. And more. Like any stubborn idiot. Becomes a pro and hates anyone that's not like him.

I didn't mention minority that flies around to RP on RP server. Who cares about them anyway?

People will always use and even abuse what some game offers. It should offer more right things and less fun-spoilers, like caps able to chase snubs and dicky equipment. That's all. Who ever did rebalancing in that way? It's not all in stats and angles!

[Ash]

All you'd be doing is making battleships less fun to use (i.e. more tedious by making them even slower), and massively reducing cruisers' utility as an anti-battleship platform.

Precisely.

I'm afraid you can't fix people's desires to win the game, especially against other players. If we nerf caps again and make the massive price for them even less justifiable then we're effectively turning away players who come here to fly them.

Players will then seek out the next best thing and gank until we nerf that too. The good thing with the current system is that there is a counter for everything. I'm just happy it's not like the old days where the forum is flooded with violation reports of players who want to relog onto their bomber or whatever because a fight is uneven.

[Pepe]

I'm afraid you can't fix people's desires to win the game, especially against other players. If we nerf caps again and make the massive price for them even less justifiable then we're effectively turning away players who come here to fly them.

It's not about win, it's about ways to win. Heroic ways would provide better rating than current ones, imho. Desire to win is awesome fuel, you said it right, just supply it to the right motor doing the right job. Not to meat grinder, like Disco is.

You say NERF CAPS. Why? Who wants to nerf them? Not me, for sure. This is not a thread about nerfs, mate.

a) Look at GBs, for example:

- they fly at speed 80 now. Press thrust and you will reach 160. It gives you dodging speed of 80. I saw only few captains using reverse, like Miki sometimes and SkyNet pretty often.
- in my model they would fly 100 and reverse to -50. That would give them 150 dodging speed. Nerf? I don't think so. Better? Yes, in defence and in covering. Chasing snubs? Harder.

b) Now see BSs, for example:

- they fly at speed 90 now. They can grab more battlefield, but why should they? They can chase transports long enough to kill, but why should they? Do they ever reverse to dodge? Maybe. I saw it few times. It probably needs skill, idk...
- with my model they would be able to fly 60 and reverse to -30. That's 90 dodging speed, just like 10% less than one they have now, but they don't use it (mostly). They (almost) never reverse now, they rather chase smaller ships. Game allows it.

[Ash]

For those people who do still fly caps regularly, the difference will be felt hardest. There's no telling what implications could arise from making them slower. Navigating asteroid fields from what I understand takes long enough as it is. While your model proposal is admirable in theory, I cannot see how one can justify giving a capship a means to dodge anything. By their nature they are built so large so as to take a battering while unloading salvo after salvo of ordnance at the enemy.

Gunboats on the other hand are designed to be more maneuverable and would therefore adhere better to your proposal.

My issue is: Put yourself in the shoes of a brand new player. Not a few weeks into discovery - very complex lore to understand and adhere to so as not to step on any toes. You've saved up enough money for a capship to show off your prowess as a player and to explore a new style of flying. Little beknown to you the ship takes ages to get anywhere and when a fight does arise all you know about how to win a fight is absolutely useless. You quit.

What your proposing only accommodates one style of fighting in a capship. I've seen an outcast BSs charge head on into colonial ranks attracting enemy fire while the rest of the fleet sits by and mortars the lot of them. Jump drives are used by most militarised official factions now and play a key role in flanking attacks.

All i'm trying to say is while what you're proposing would solve a very annoying problem, I think the cost to the overall enjoyability of the ship class would be too much.

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