Would you, in real life, ever want to try smuggling drugs through a military base? How about Groom Lake?
Juni, a former Commander of the LSF, more or less states the only thing she knows about Zone 21 is that there is a jump gate in the heart of Zone 21 (presumably a hasty or informal reference, given the infocard differentiates the minefield from Alaska/Zone 21 itself).
So, I doubt that even most of the Navy/LSF would have the codes, unless they were given them by High Command or what is probably a hand picked group of elite guard sworn to secrecy, if security around it is anything like the campaign or it's counterpart in A51 indicates.
Quote: My original point still stands - it is the RP of the Liberty Lawfuls to police and enforce the Zone 21 rule, not the unlawfuls who can RP a reason to get in and out of there.
// I believe that is the main issue. How many Lawfuls
// really want to stand guard? Eating Blueberry pie/Donuts.
// Boring. Most players want to move around...make money...
// kill things or have an excuse to kill. Irrespective of
// whether you are lawful or not.
// How many of the lawfuls are attention wanting younger kids?
// By the bad oorp in NY, it seems quite a lot. How many of these
// "lawfuls" actually want to do guard duty?
// I think most of the more mature people would be quite happy to
// do this duty as it is good RP, but that number seems to be
// overcrowded by the younger - so there is a policing effect of
// the mature(er) to the young(er).. making it more difficult for
// the more mature to DO this kind of duty as they are busy keeping
// or trying to keep the youngers in line.
// I say anything that is not authorized spotted coming through
// the gate either way...is kill on sight by any security force no
// discussion and no chance to explain. THAT is good RP for the
// protection of Liberty's most secretive non-secret.
// Alternatively within 3kms of the Jump hole.
// If the <strike>victims</strike> idiots complain - then point out that Alaska
// is off limits to non-LSF or LNS. Point them to the forum
// that explicity states that.
Quote:Zone 21
The entirety of Zone 21 and the surrounding minefield is a restricted area to all traffic except senior staff of the Liberty Navy and Liberty Security Force or entities directly authorized by them. Permanent passage may only be given by cosignature of the LSF Director and one of Libertys 2 Fleet Admirals. Lethal force is authorized towards any non-military vessels which attempt to trespass, and military trespass may be punishable by suspension or warning. Only ONE warning will be given towards any vessel attempting to breach Zone 21, which if not heeded will result in the destruction and kill on sight status of the offending ship. In the system itself, all unauthorized ships will be destroyed without warning.
Sovereign Wrote:Seek fun and you shall find it. Seek stuff to Q_Q about and you'll find that, too. I choose to have fun.
' Wrote:// I believe that is the main issue. How many Lawfuls
// really want to stand guard? Eating Blueberry pie/Donuts.
// Boring. Most players want to move around...make money...
// kill things or have an excuse to kill. Irrespective of
// whether you are lawful or not.
// How many of the lawfuls are attention wanting younger kids?
// By the bad oorp in NY, it seems quite a lot. How many of these
// "lawfuls" actually want to do guard duty?
// I think most of the more mature people would be quite happy to
// do this duty as it is good RP, but that number seems to be
// overcrowded by the younger - so there is a policing effect of
// the mature(er) to the young(er).. making it more difficult for
// the more mature to DO this kind of duty as they are busy keeping
// or trying to keep the youngers in line.
// I say anything that is not authorized spotted coming through
// the gate either way...is kill on sight by any security force no
// discussion and no chance to explain. THAT is good RP for the
// protection of Liberty's most secretive non-secret.
// Alternatively within 3kms of the Jump hole.
// If the <strike>victims</strike> idiots complain - then point out that Alaska
// is off limits to non-LSF or LNS. Point them to the forum
// that explicity states that.
Yep you are right - but, how is the fact that its boring and that the liberty players are younger etc etc etc an unlawfuls problem? it's not - its unfortunate for the security of liberty that that area is left unguarded so often and that unscrupulous types are able to get through it - but they do and they are so Step up liberty...... use your muscle and start protecting it.
I have no problem with being warned away, shot at.. etc etc if im in that Zone 21 area... because i know for a fact that its entirely in a liberty lawful's RP to do that, they have discretion in that area should they choose to use it. Again, i reiterate its up to them to police it, its not up to unlawfuls to self police.
If Player A sits outside that minefield entrance and warns off/destroys unlawfuls coming through he is entirely in his rights to do so - if player A is not there... then the lucky unlawful has caught the liberty lawfuls asleep, they beat the law, well done.
Smugging into and out of Military controlled areas happens, it happens in real life - its vastly conceivable that it will happen in as large an area as a spacial system.... with one choke point where the presence of sentries is so hit and miss and avoidable - and another leading to a myriad of systems controlled by various groups of dubious legal status who have no reason to respect liberty laws.
Again - even if you say that only the most senior Liberty personnel have the access codes to the Zone 21 gate it is irrelevant. It has already been conceded in this thread that the Order has them, in which case - and now im repeating myself, it is equally likely then that the Corsairs do, as do any 3rd parties the corsairs choose to sell those codes do... with the flow on effect that those codes are probably then a hot commodity on the black market.
So i say again, Its up to the Liberty players to enforce the rules there, as i said, if it starts to get known that if you come out of that minefield you are more than likely going to get killed, people will stop doing it or at the very least, seriously consider whether its worth it or not.
Perhaps you could stick an object at the entrance to the minefield and again at the entrance to the jumpgate, that looks enough out of place that people will check the infocard to see what it is. Then have on the infocard something that says:
"Restricted Area. Anyone not authorised by the Liberty Navy or Liberty Security Force will be destroyed, no questions asked.
OOC Note: Entering this zone means you can be destroyed on sight by any Liberty Navy or Liberty Security Force personnel (Must have [SA] or =LSF= in their name), regardless of your ID, tag or level."
-Alaska houses two prison stations which hold the most dangerous criminals in all of Sirius - everything from terrorist leaders to spies and assassins.
-The shipyard in Alaska is liberty's prototype production and testing facility for new military ship types. Who knows what they could be building there? It's classified. They could have cloaking devices, Weapons capable of destroying battleships in a single volley, or even tamed or cloned nomads as prototype tools of the liberty military.
True, but both the prisons and the shipyard could be easily moved. What they lose is security they gain in logistics supplies and support by having them closer.
Not to mention having them somewhere outside of nomad influence. It seems silly to let the nomads spy on top secret weapon research in order to keep other humans from seeing it, doesn't it?
Personally I think all the decent equipment (if there is anything sold there) should be moved to another Liberty base (including the LSF ID), that would cut out some of the traffic.
On one character that I have given up on, I wanted to become an LSF operative and requested enterance to Alaska no less than 6 times, (I pressumed the ID was there after going to every liberty planet/base, //later confirmed this on the forums) 4 times I was denied access, and twice was denied and told the ID wasnt in there.
' Wrote:OOC Note: Entering this zone means you can be destroyed on sight by any Liberty Navy or Liberty Security Force personnel (Must have [SA] or =LSF= in their name), regardless of your ID, tag or level."
If anything a lone LSF operative is more likely to have clearence to the jumpgate than 2 whole squadrons (or more), so it shouldnt be restricted to 2 player factions. Edit: doh miss-interpreted what you said, but still, a lone (indie) LSF pilot has as much right to defend the "secret" base as anyone, but I dont agree with shoot on sight.
Note: People (PCs) who have permission to enter Z21/Alaska:
-No one EXCEPT those given permission by the Liberty High Command
-People setting up characters (personal opinion)
And one problem with non-military in Zlaska is that when a Zoner or Order tries to come through, they do it in a freaking battleship. Liberty doesn't have capital ships (that have access to Alaska) on call to stop these threats, and even if we did, it'd be a pain to go there just to stop them. Most of the time, we don't even catch them because we don't know which direction they're headed towards: Omicron Minor or NY?
Kintlar; An Indie-LSF will have no clearance what-so-ever... And if so then anyone can just Indie a LSF and then go through it just because.
Moreso you need Clearance from a Fleet Admiral and the LSF Director/DepDirector and they can turn your request down at any time.
Even some LSF are turned down. OFFICIAL-LSF
The only time an Indie even comes close to Alaska is the Jumpgate, and that is usually when we have to muster a whole big fleet to ward off Nomads or something.
And also; I grow very tired of finding things in Zone-21 and then auto-shooting them down if I can. And then being complained that I had to warn them first. And they then proceed despite me saying that Its Zone-21 and all to just go and bash the Liberty Government wherever they go...
Its just wrong...
I'd like to do my job and know that I am helping my Government, not hurting it.
Tiberius Walker, putting flames out and being awesome since Apr 13 2008 ™
[8/17/2008 5:56:46 PM] Aaron (Boss/Jurgen) says: Can't bring myself to say it... Looks like you get the LABC, I've seen what you can do in one
Walker (Albert Wint): I can has win? --- Epyon the Bored: You can haz win. --- [1:18:00 PM] Chris (Niezck) says: I love you <3
[5:55:53 PM] Raisu says: Walker pwned both Battleships(LNS-Texas LNS-Arizona) - [5:55:57 PM] Raisu says: in a cruiser Tiberius Walker, spreading mayhem, destruction, and Spamming Flood since Oct 22 2008 ™
[9:08:25 AM] Gurjiv (Frozen) says: I hope someone gives you AIDs.
[7:15:17 PM] Dylan (Ximen) says: Walker... you have no idea how much fail you bring into this world...
[8:05:08 AM] Ross (SevereTrinity) says: Screw you for making me install FL again
[10:51IE AM] Epyon the Bored says: My god if I ever meet you I am going to strangle you. Tiberius Walker, being better then you since April 30, 2009 â¢
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