(01-31-2018, 01:49 AM)Thunderer Wrote: If it gets transport weapons instead of BS weapons, it's just an oversized Bustard. Bustards can already do that. So, why not?
I think that the players who fly Nephs prefer their BS weapons over some docking rights in some House space. Most Nephs are used to farm nomnoms. There is no nomnoms in House space.
Then perhaps give them gunboat turrets or at most cruiser turrets?
And Red Hessians shouldn't build Blood Diamond Jormungands, Ranseurs should be rare, Core should not have more than ten warships, Corsairs shouldn't have four shipyards and Liberty shouldn't have plot-armor, as people repeat all day. Look at all those people here who never play as Zoners and go all possible ways to limit the Nephs that are horrible warships but present enough to actually provide people with combat targets. They are already the worst heavy battleship, can be easily beaten by any other battleship, and the only true issue is that people use them as the iconic lolwut battleship while eeeevery single other faction has literally the same issue just with less numbers.
If you want to see Nephs vanishing: Log into the game, destroy them. Threads about the Neph are coming up for years, nothing has been done about them and there is absolutely no need to change anything about them. They are bad, giant targets, mostly played by people who just want a big battleship without ZoI. Take them away or nerf them, and people will just start using Ranseurs more because the OC ID is the most liberal unlawful one. The only difference is that the Ranseur is not a colony ship, but people will still lolwut on them like they do right now in Delta.
If you don't want people to farm in Delta and have fun, log a raid and get faction activity. The Nephilim doesn't need any alteration, neither via inRP laws nor in terms of gameplay. If people want to fly around in house space, let them RP for it. Point and case.
(01-31-2018, 02:25 AM)Lythrilux Wrote: Then perhaps give them gunboat turrets or at most cruiser turrets?
no, because its a colony ship and should be able to defent itself. the defence capabilities of a neph are crap. give him more hull, one or two CDs, even more hull, a thruster and a line like "shooting only in selfdefence"
(01-31-2018, 02:25 AM)Lythrilux Wrote: Zoners really shouldn't be farming at all.
(01-31-2018, 02:36 AM)Sombra Hookier Wrote: And Red Hessians shouldn't build Blood Diamond Jormungands, Ranseurs should be rare, Core should not have more than ten warships, Corsairs shouldn't have four shipyards and Liberty shouldn't have plot-armor, as people repeat all day. Look at all those people here who never play as Zoners and go all possible ways to limit the Nephs that are horrible warships but present enough to actually provide people with combat targets. They are already the worst heavy battleship, can be easily beaten by any other battleship, and the only true issue is that people use them as the iconic lolwut battleship while eeeevery single other faction has literally the same issue just with less numbers.
If you want to see Nephs vanishing: Log into the game, destroy them. Threads about the Neph are coming up for years, nothing has been done about them and there is absolutely no need to change anything about them. They are bad, giant targets, mostly played by people who just want a big battleship without ZoI. Take them away or nerf them, and people will just start using Ranseurs more because the OC ID is the most liberal unlawful one. The only difference is that the Ranseur is not a colony ship, but people will still lolwut on them like they do right now in Delta.
If you don't want people to farm in Delta and have fun, log a raid and get faction activity. The Nephilim doesn't need any alteration, neither via inRP laws nor in terms of gameplay. If people want to fly around in house space, let them RP for it. Point and case.
Have to agree with Sombra here. My earlier comment suggested limiting the weapons, but moreso in the amount, not the type. But given the points above, honestly it's not the ship itself that needs to be worked on. It's the roleplay around them. Lolwut Neph players are the issue, not the ship. As mentioned, the ship is a colony ship. You bet your ass that it will armed to ward off any danger to the colonists aboard. And as said above, if you have issue with them acting against what the lore is for them, shoot them! They're massive targets. Not that hard to beat.
tl;dr - don't change the ship. Change how players use them to fit the intent.
(01-31-2018, 02:36 AM)Sombra Hookier Wrote: And Red Hessians shouldn't build Blood Diamond Jormungands, Ranseurs should be rare, Core should not have more than ten warships, Corsairs shouldn't have four shipyards and Liberty shouldn't have plot-armor, as people repeat all day. Look at all those people here who never play as Zoners and go all possible ways to limit the Nephs that are horrible warships but present enough to actually provide people with combat targets. They are already the worst heavy battleship, can be easily beaten by any other battleship, and the only true issue is that people use them as the iconic lolwut battleship while eeeevery single other faction has literally the same issue just with less numbers.
If you want to see Nephs vanishing: Log into the game, destroy them. Threads about the Neph are coming up for years, nothing has been done about them and there is absolutely no need to change anything about them. They are bad, giant targets, mostly played by people who just want a big battleship without ZoI. Take them away or nerf them, and people will just start using Ranseurs more because the OC ID is the most liberal unlawful one. The only difference is that the Ranseur is not a colony ship, but people will still lolwut on them like they do right now in Delta.
If you don't want people to farm in Delta and have fun, log a raid and get faction activity. The Nephilim doesn't need any alteration, neither via inRP laws nor in terms of gameplay. If people want to fly around in house space, let them RP for it. Point and case.
I don't see how any of that is relevant.
Having to play roleplay patrol to shoot people doing things they shouldn't really be doing (logic wise) in the first place is silly. It's the same with having to deal with LNS that fly to the Omicrons with the excuse "lol I'm exploring". We shouldn't look at idiocy and solve the problem by just shooting it. These kinds of Zoner nephs aren't really a positive boon. They're an annoyance.
I would much rather see people farming in Core or Order ships. Not only does it actually make sense, but it'll contribute more positivity to roleplay and activity in both the short-term and the long term.
I feel like nothing has been done because it's a tedious change. Consistently, there has been overwhelming support for something to be done. The Dev team just hasn't made it a priority.
The only other type of change that could be applied to stop this silliness would be to limit the caps to the official factions and perhaps make the Neph SRP. I don't think this would be fair to people who already own it.
If the gun hard points change what's the impact? If you're role-playing the ship properly, this shouldn't affect that. It doesn't need to have Battleship weapons to defend itself, and perhaps the trade off for converting to (i.e) cruiser weapons could be extra CM slots.
The problem is that you're talking about ideal situations. In an ideal Discovery, we would have way enough people to deal with stuff fast enough to prevent certain groups from establishing in first place. Right now, we simply have to deal with 'annoyances'. We can all agree that lolwuts of any kind are an annoyance, and many people will agree that discussions like these which pop up every six months are an annoyance as well. Doesn't mean you should be banned again.
Neither Core or Order have heavy battleships. PvE-interested people will always go for Heavy battleships, the heaviest of the heavies. If I was one of them, I'd take the Nephilim, the Redemption or the Ranseur (within 2.5K range - mission range - dodging in battleships is almost impossible, especially against NPCs with infinite power core). The best bet is providing people with heavy battleships for the Omicron Delta factions, not taking away what does not need to be fixed from factions you don't play anyway. If you are getting so incredibly mad about the ZMCS, the one thing that is just as hard to RP as trying to represent Interspace Commerce ingame, I can only think of changing the infocard of the Nephilim from what it is not to what it is - because I can't think of any single person who was actually able to play a Nephilim the way one would think it is supposed to be, a mobile freeport or colony ship. You can't dock with it and you can't colonize planets with it. Matter of factly, I'd just replace most Freeports with the Nephilim model or add them as solar next to the station.
Changing the guns? Making the ship even more of a sacrificial lamb than it already is won't make people play it more. People will get mad about it. Do we need more stuff that makes people mad? For the sake of satisfying some people who will find the next thing to write lengthy threads and posts about a week later? Nope. We try to increase the amount of people of the server. Core could use more people as well, right? Limiting the Neph to the officials? Sounds good on paper, is bad in reality. OSI has no capital lines, IRG is at a very low point of activity, TAZ mostly roams around with Whales, Liners and sometimes an Aquilon, and most people don't even bother with SRPs or give up halfway because people in charge get inactive, are not responsive or things just take too long in general, and plans change. You could just delete it from the game and have the same issue as mentioned before: People will be mad.
it's an interesting proposal but I don't see any reason for mobile colonies to be in house space IRP. Mobile colonies should stay in dangerous space with their big guns
You can ignore reality but you can not ignore consequences of ignoring reality
Okay, stupidity aside, Zoner colony ships are restricted due to hardcoded limitations the dev team simply cannot work their way around. They are literally just cities in space, with enough defenses to discourage assailants. The operative word here being "discourage".
It's kind of like the imagery applied to Detroit vs. Daumann. You buy a Detroit firearm to defend yourself. You buy a Daumann firearm to hurt people. They are functionally the same, but how they are presented makes all the difference in the world.
(read: It's a location-appropriate ship tied to an ID that can't really hurt anyone)
(01-31-2018, 04:00 AM)The League Wrote: ... They are literally just cities in space, with enough defenses to discourage assailants. The operative word here being "discourage".
....
(read: It's a location-appropriate ship tied to an ID that can't really hurt anyone)
this.
therefore: make the neph undestroyable (exception one of those NEMP Bombs) and strip off the weapons. Problem soved: no more lolwut, farming etc. nephs. but a (colony) ship thats secure for its inhabitants
That would be cool. I could roam around anywhere and nobody can stop me. I could dock with event stations without the need to deal with NPCs. I could tank NPCs and anyone else can shjote them. You get the idea of my statement.
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