Lore Forum Feedback thread.

[Hokan]

There is the chance that, if its canonised as a short story. It can be referenced in game.

And the Lore Forum is to store additional lore.

This is for people who like to write, and would like to get their stories canonised without the RCR and the process with it. It comes with its own rules and guidelines as its intended for the forum, not infocards.

So how would they be reference in game?

Its intended for the forums.
There is a chance it can be referenced in game.

These are not mutually exclusive.

[Kalhmera]

There is the chance that, if its canonised as a short story. It can be referenced in game.

And the Lore Forum is to store additional lore.

This is for people who like to write, and would like to get their stories canonised without the RCR and the process with it. It comes with its own rules and guidelines as its intended for the forum, not infocards.

So how would they be reference in game?

Its intended for the forums.
There is a chance it can be referenced in game.

These are not mutually exclusive.

Well that's unfortunate. Well thanks for satisfying my curiosity and hopefully other people got some answers out of our conversation.

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[Spectre]

Can this short story system potentially include rumors for bases, or wrecks for in-game? I figure that would be up to the story and systems team, but having that possibility would be really neat.

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[Gardarik]

Here's one of the reactions to the Short Story post. I hope it gives you some clarity Kalh.

Code:

WerdackelYesterday at 23:09
Ahaha
oh boy
made up companies belonging to the Keiretsu
doing some stuff
SO MANY POSSIBILITIES
An Order patrol at an outer region of O-Minor
A lost wanderer stumbling upon an unstable JH
all such stuff
thanks for pushing this lol
Disco from now on: War pews, Gov RP, short stories
gg

Is that so?

Gov RP is not impactful in any way and does not actually let you make progress in any gov-related issued due to world being static.

Corp RP is very limited gameplay-wise. If you RP stocks returns, financial dynamics, new products, corporate responsibility - it is just descriptive RP same with gov RP.

It all goes down to descriptive RP. Good for those who appreciate it, I suppose. Although, IMHO, it is just not worth the time invested in it.

[Hemlocke]

Shorts should not be used to canonise a player character or player faction,
Shorts should not be used to canonise roleplay by players, (1)
The Story team may, at their own discretion, waive the above rule. (2)

Once submitted and accepted, the short comes under Story control, (3)
Story may edit the short thereafter.

So what you're saying is. The story team can canonize (not with an "s" btw) their own players and their own factions and pick their favorites among the crowd. How bout you just remove that entirely and force people to use the RCR if they want their own self imported messes canonized. Right, there you go.

Story may edit these slightly, there for take credit for them. Very nice.

Interesting idea, I like it. The fact that first part is an utter mess is the main issue.

[Typrop]

From what I gather, this is a case where people can write their own short stories (something already occupied by Stories and Biographies, frankly) and give them a fast track to get canonized into the mod.

With no association with their particular characters, on a roleplay server, where their content is no longer their own once it is "canonized."

So effectively you're just getting other people to do infocard/rumor development, without actually giving them the role of developer, complete with no say in the development of things, more or less taking ownership of it when it is "good."

Excuse me if that's a little bit offensive to me on principle, because this is reading to me like a "You players, present us with your offerings, and if it is good? It is ours."

Also, the talk about "canonization" like it's serious business gives me some severe HL2RP vibes, certainly can't wait for more of the rampant circular arguments of "but this is canon and this isn't" because person X has a different interpretation of the lore vs person Y and Z, but person X is in charge of something. A bit like, I don't know, the discussion about whether or not Confederate Gallia ditched all of their Valors, or something.

Like Hemlocke, I appreciate the intent, giving people an in to contribute to a gap in fluff. This isn't the way I see it should be done, though.

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[Binski]

(1) The purpose of this is to discourage people from trying to canonise their own roleplay by way of a story short, and circumventing the RCR process.

Is this to shift players away from short stories about their characters? This used to be the point. By canonization in this case, do you mean only story added as content in game?

That sort of makes it seem like its considered bad now to write stories that involve your created character, as if its 100% of the time to steal undeserved attention. If you aren't already trying to add content to the game via the process, how can writing a story on the forum mentioning your characters be considered circumventing an RCR?

It reads like any story you make of your own character is bad because its cheap canonization to avoid an RCR.

[Jayenbee]

So effectively you're just getting other people to do infocard/rumor development, without actually giving them the role of developer, complete with no say in the development of things, more or less taking ownership of it when it is "good."

Excuse me if that's a little bit offensive to me on principle, because this is reading to me like a "You players, present us with your offerings, and if it is good? It is ours."

Apply to be a Story Dev then, try to put aside the spare time to work on this Mod at the rate the community demands, be my guest. Alternatively, you could just not worry about all that stress and instead throw a story out for funsies and y'never know, it could be immortalised in game. Otherwise, it's immortalised in-canon and can serve as a resource for anything the Story Team may decide to implement in the future. I can see it, me in Story Chat going; "Hey guys, remember that short story X-Person put up that time?" - "Yeah?" -"That'd be awesome to use for this!"

You have to understand that the Story Team is supposed to have a certain degree of duty of care to the Discovery Narrative, it's our job to keep out of the rubbish and let's not kid ourselves... there has been some absolute rubbish in Disco's time. The whole point of the Story Team taking control of something, is to attempt to ensure quality control.

Like Hemlocke, I appreciate the intent, giving people an in to contribute to a gap in fluff. This isn't the way I see it should be done, though.

Like all new things, there's bound to be bumps in the road, nothing tends to be perfect the first time.

Is this to shift players away from short stories about their characters? This used to be the point. By canonization in this case, do you mean only story added as content in game?

That sort of makes it seem like its considered bad now to write stories that involve your created character, as if its 100% of the time to steal undeserved attention. If you aren't already trying to add content to the game via the process, how can writing a story on the forum mentioning your characters be considered circumventing an RCR?

It reads like any story you make of your own character is bad because its cheap canonization to avoid an RCR.

Not quite. This is Story's attempt at simply giving players the ability to try to write a bit of canon for Discovery. I don't know about you guys, but I can often get writer's block and much of the effort of creating a story simply isn't the ideas... it's writing it. Going through something that has already been written is far quicker to fix than rewrite the vast majority of the time.

By allowing players the ability to write short stories and attempt to get them submitted, we could have cool things such as Stories about the conflict upon worlds themselves, the stuff the soldiers are going through. You could tell a story of an entire ship crew, perhaps the story of a Liberty Siege Cruiser going through the events of Insurgency.

Yeah, it's supposed to be separate from everyone's in-game characters, but you can totally make some up that don't exist in game purely for your story.

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[Typrop]

Apply to be a Story Dev then, try to put aside the spare time to work on this Mod at the rate the community demands, be my guest.

Sorry chief, not doing that. Balance dev, maybe. Balance devs haven't called me Exodite yet.

Balance devs also do more.

Alternatively, you could just not worry about all that stress and instead throw a story out for funsies and y'never know, it could be immortalised in game. Otherwise, it's immortalised in-canon and can serve as a resource for anything the Story Team may decide to implement in the future. I can see it, me in Story Chat going; "Hey guys, remember that short story X-Person put up that time?" - "Yeah?" -"That'd be awesome to use for this!"

It's also a roleplay server. This is saying "Yeah, you know that thing you join the server/forums to do? Roleplay? Yeah, take out the personal investment and write us content so we can use it was we see fit." Do you not see the disconnect?

You have to understand that the Story Team is supposed to have a certain degree of duty of care to the Discovery Narrative, it's our job to keep out of the rubbish and let's not kid ourselves... there has been some absolute rubbish in Disco's time. The whole point of the Story Team taking control of something, is to attempt to ensure quality control.

Because there's a fantastic history of them doing that, and you lot are carrying the torch just so much higher.

You're also highlighting a chief example as to why exactly people do not trust staff in Disco, that separation between "staff" and "community member." Because there's an implied "Well, the community writes garbage, and we need to filter it out!" Working with them, interacting, and actually being cool dudes? Outta the window, present us your stuff for inspection.

Woah. Nice story. Perfect length. Medium girth. Could use some trim, but we'll take it.

By allowing players the ability to write short stories and attempt to get them submitted, we could have cool things such as Stories about the conflict upon worlds themselves, the stuff the soldiers are going through. You could tell a story of an entire ship crew, perhaps the story of a Liberty Siege Cruiser going through the events of Insurgency.

Yeah, it's supposed to be separate from everyone's in-game characters, but you can totally make some up that don't exist in game purely for your story.

Or you could write RP that actually means something to you, you have agency over, and you can do more things with because you're not working at the behest of a team of people who spend more of their time arguing over petty topics than working with people without excessive bureaucracy or systems designed to invalidate the thing people come here to do, first and foremost, to create something good that follows a logical path that can be read back on and understood, and not, say...

A war with minimal context or reason to happen because of an arbitrary OORP desire for someone to shoot at because everyone's afraid of a double digit number going down.

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[Petitioner]

Yknow, I only just now noticed this exists. Huh, neat. Looking forward to writing something for this when I have the brainspace for it. Personally, I love the idea, and while I understand the complaints mentioned earlier in this thread at some level, I also think that those complaints come from a point of view I fundamentally don't share.

Roleplay isn't just "writing"—it's collaborative storytelling. The thing that separates roleplay from solo writing like a novelist or fanfic author does is that others are involved in the creative process; not only inside of it (playing their characters) but also in a meta sense, outside of it. When you work with someone else on a freeform project like collaborative storytelling, or pen-and-paper gaming, or a pickup ballgame, there has to be a mutual agreement of the terms of the activity, and trying to expand the terms of engagement in a large community where everyone is engaged in a collaborative activity like storytelling, as we do here, does nothing but expand the options for those interested in new approaches.

That is to say, if you don't like it, there's nothing demanding you submit short stories for canonization, and you don't have to participate. That's a good thing! You can maintain total creative control over your own stories (within the bounds of the rules, the framework we all implicitly agree to operate with by joining this community at all). For those who are interested in handing over a lot more responsibility to others, now we have the option to just throw something at the wall. If the relevant people (here, storyteam) don't like it, it doesn't stick, and we can just repost it in Stories & Biographies for all to see. If they do like it, then we've contributed to and shaped the world in our own way, and given others more to work with, that they know they can include in their own stories without any lore incompatibility issues. That's also a good thing, imo!

Personally, I like the idea of my own creative work giving others more options for theirs, even if I don't maintain total control over it once I put down my metaphorical pen. To me, that's in the spirit of roleplaying, because it's inherently collaborative. The difference here is just that even more responsibility is placed on the other partner in the collaboration (storyteam), yet that other partner also takes a more passive role.

In short, this is a fun option to have, and I'm glad that this exists.

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