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**Petitioner** · 07-06-2025, 10:17 PM,

Allende, Fenix-Odio, DTR-CNS>Aleksandaros-3, DTR-CNS>Edessa, Vizela[TBH], and DTR-SombraMaligna have been sanctioned for:

Quote:2.0 - Every ship must have one ID equipped, and play in a way that represents the role of that ID. Your ID explains what you can do and where. Some IDs have a 'Zone of Influence' (ZOI) where extra actions are permitted. All IDs have a ZOI in systems containing an NPC station of the same affiliation. A player that flies ships outside of ZOI to invite attack from ships that could otherwise not be attacked by the player in question can be considered PVP baiting as explained by this link.

2.1 - You must provide sufficient roleplay before attacking another player, and give them enough time to react. This means at least two messages and 10 seconds delay before attacking.

Note: Every form of RP is acceptable.

Consequences:

You six have violated your ID's engagement lines failing to provide sufficient time for your targets to react, by issuing an unreasonable demand (all cargo from all Bulwarks without having any means of hauling said cargo, or having specific ID lines against said cargo), and only issuing your demands after you had already started shooting.

Fenix-Odio and Vizela[TBH] in particular are also additionally warned to remember that the Bulwark is a trade ship and cannot be simply attacked the same way that, for example, a gunboat could be.

Some of your credits have evaporated into thin air in protest of being used to fuel such behavior.

Original Link for Admin/Mod Use | Discovery Server & Forums Rules | Before You Post Here

If you require evidence, you may request such via PM from a Staff member. Only the accused or an official faction leader of the accused person's faction may request such. Once you have the evidence, and if you wish to dispute it, you may post in the Sanction Thread below. Do not continue PM'ing a staff member, as that will result in your Appeal being denied. If you PM a staff or post in the sanction thread and you are not directly involved, you are consenting to be subjected to the reprisal of my choice which may involve in game repercussions up to a ban. Blaming members of your immediate family, neighbors, friends, pets, and assorted Orcs, Trolls and any other legendary creatures may result in the use of Admin Right #CTE 750AE

MasterL410 · 07-06-2025, 10:31 PM,

Evidence please

The Brotherhood · 07-06-2025, 10:38 PM,

Hello.

We'd appreciate evidence to be forwarded here too.

**Luke.** · 07-06-2025, 11:00 PM,

Evidence sent.

[Image: 4a0e7968-2678-4a66-9449-352a2bb8d72f.png...fit=bounds]

MasterL410 · 07-06-2025, 11:16 PM,

(07-06-2025, 11:00 PM)Luke. Wrote: Evidence sent.

Evidence was in fact not sent.

**Luke.** · 07-06-2025, 11:34 PM,

Relevance to the sanction verified. Evidence also sent.

John'DTR'Grey · 07-07-2025, 05:27 AM,

Good day,

Would like to have the evidence sent please.

Salut.

**Luke.** · 07-07-2025, 11:42 AM,

Sent.

John'DTR'Grey · 07-07-2025, 12:02 PM,

Good day,

After watching the proves submitted. I believe those rule breaks are invalid and the sanction is not solid. I will argument it all. Let me please disclose it all:

1) DSACE what shows some sketchy chat, and also a normal fight engagement. It's not the first time Phoenix, when pirated, rejects to stop (and they have the absolute right to do so) but when faced by the consequences, one can't complain.

[19.06.2025 21:09:04] DTR-CNS>Edessa: Three Phoenix on scanner
[19.06.2025 21:09:09] /fm gmg 'sair at the jump gate 19
[19.06.2025 21:09:09] (\^/)Thelema: 'sair at the jump gate 19
[19.06.2025 21:09:13] DTR-CNS>Aleksandaros-3: Wepons hot

- I do not know if there is any RP related reason for this totally OORP chat to GMG from Phoenix zoners, not the one here to judge.

2) Phoenix, apparently by the proves, shoot first as shown in the next capture, meaning corsairs are defending themselves and the nature of rule 2.1 ain't broken. After checking other sources, there is the Vizela[TBH] that fires a salvo of gunboat primaries, that really make close to no damage to the bulwark. Then, the Thelema fires a full salvo of the BC gun to the rest, and battle starts. They were running and as we can see, there are many demands to stop, and telling phoenix to go nowhere. There is an active FR3 on phoenix from the Corsairs also, and with the transport changes I am pretty sure bulwarks count as "fairly defensively ships".

[Image: D219LKR.png]

The red fire comes from the BC weapon of the other bulwark.

3) Where does the rule break 2.0 comes from? There is no evidence, not even dubious one about any 2.0 argument being broken there. Every ship might have his ID, and the ones not, if there is any. are not specifically listed.

I wish staff to review this sanction, since evidence is unclear, not solid, and the sanction is vague in its nature.

Feel free to contact me in discord for anything,

Salut.

**Petitioner** · 07-07-2025, 10:16 PM,

As you've decided to post your appeal publicly, the team's response will be public as well.

There are a number of issues here. First of all, the server logs (where we've verified both chatlogs as well as damage logs) prove that the Corsairs were the ones to engage first as one would with a typical hostile ship. No demands were made prior to the engagement starting. The classification of the Bulwark as a trade ship might be a debatable one, but with the overwhelming mixed fleet you applied here, you cannot reasonably claim that the Phoenix Bulwarks were anything other than hapless victims.

Furthermore, it is in fact legitimate to engage someone for refusing to halt when repeatedly ordered to do so, even though such an order is not a "demand" in and of itself as per the rules. However, the Corsair group explicitly shot them for running without ever actually issuing a demand to halt. It's true that one of the DTR ships did eventually issue a proper demand in this encounter, but critically, that demand was issued after the Corsair group had already attacked.

Spoiler

Finally, the messages to the GMG are completely fine and not at all ooRP. Zoners and the GMG have always gotten along, and the GMG and Phoenix share a common hated enemy in the Corsairs. The GMG also act as a de-facto law enforcing body within the Sigmas. With all of that in mind, asking the GMG for help against Corsairs (whether you were pirating them or simply murdering them, it doesn't matter) while within GMG space is completely reasonable, and thus is entirely immaterial to this sanction.

I hope this clarifies matters for you. The sanction stands.

Recruitment | Task Force Prometheus | ICN FIRESTORM

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