SuperNova Antimatter Cannon

[Wes_Janson]

Personally I find the SNAC is WAY to over powered.

That or cap ships are too weak.

You got a single good bomber pilot and he can significantly damage a cap ship in a 1on1.

Personally I think either slightly tone down the SNAC or beef up shield/hull/regen/ rates of cap ships, as well as giving them close in defence turrets (class 5 tops, fighter turrets, as fighter defence.)

As it stands, caps are pretty damn useless (smalelr ones especily) against bombers. I mean whats the point of having one if a single bomber can take you out easily. It doesnt make good sense, period.

Bombers should be able to NIBBLE on caps, and require numbers to do damage fast. It simply doesnt make good sense the way it is now.

Not that I expect anything to happen, over half the server only seems to be in it for the PvP .

[SGTMatt]

If MOST bombers were any worst off they would be eaten by caps. There are a couple of contrary examples that we have all gone over a hundred times.

A single bomber, flown well, has a heck of a time vs any cap flown well.

As far as I know, most caps are infact getting a boost so all we all have to do is wait and see.

Just to clarify, I have one bomber and it is a pirate one who runs like heck if it sees a cap on radar so I am not on the side of them at all. Ussually it is me giving the bombers a heck of a time.

Matt

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A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship.

-Alexis de Tocqueville-

[Kambei]

Personally I find the SNAC is WAY to over powered.

That or cap ships are too weak.

You got a single good bomber pilot and he can significantly damage a cap ship in a 1on1.

Personally I think either slightly tone down the SNAC or beef up shield/hull/regen/ rates of cap ships, as well as giving them close in defence turrets (class 5 tops, fighter turrets, as fighter defence.)

As it stands, caps are pretty damn useless (smalelr ones especily) against bombers. I mean whats the point of having one if a single bomber can take you out easily. It doesnt make good sense, period.

Bombers should be able to NIBBLE on caps, and require numbers to do damage fast. It simply doesnt make good sense the way it is now.

Not that I expect anything to happen, over half the server only seems to be in it for the PvP .

blah blah blah... they are powerfull enough against all fighter or gunboat class. You just need right equipment. Dont buy weapons only according to statistics but generaly according to WHAT THEY DO. If you can be owned by single bomber, there is not prolem in SN, there is not problem in power of cap... problem is somewhere between your chair and keyboard.

BTW: if you want remove SN... ok but than I want regulaton of number of caps in space.

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[Elvin]

Well the fact one Bomber "can" take out cruiser is little wrong. I say dont nerf it, but significally reduce agility of bombers... in some cases the can be handled better than some vhfs... And well, no matter what opinion is on "too much caps" around, Bomber shouldnt be able to take on cruiser alone... Not even damage him, if you ask me, for sake of logic.

EDit: To Kambei: Sound like you are saing " theres too much caps, make bombers stronger so they can take them out" The BHG matter comming up again, I see.

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I buy things I don't want to make an impression on people I don't like.

[AceofSpades]

Okay, bombers aren't overpowered.

Good VHF pilots know how to avoid coming in, straight line, shields down against a bomber. Dodge for ten seconds till your shields pop up and oh your hard to kill again.

Second, good pilots of gunboats who sit in turret mode, strafe, aim, and have a missile are nearly unbeatable.

And any ship bigger than a gunboat that gets solo-ed is terrible. End of story. You realize that two hits with all of your turrets cause us destruction, and you complain that 2 shots that move 500m/s and use all of our power supply is unfair to kill you? o.0

Granted its hard to hit a target thats tiny, try whittling away 250,000 shield points 3 times (bats) and then 240k hull (x2.5 hull if you have brains) a few times (bots). Honestly I have to shoot through 750k of shields and a million and a half of hull to kill a Liberty Cruiser, that is a lot of hits while dodging fire.

Lastly, sorry, but any capship above a gunboat is simply a weapons platform, very little maneuvering skill involved, simply aiming. Want to fly a ship where the top pilots can beat the odds considerably (ie killing a few fighters and its gunboat escort?), get in a bomber. Craziest ride you'll ever have.

The only problem I see is that caps, even when properly guarded (lets say a GB and 2 VHFS), can still be killed by 2 bombers because its quite hard to shoot down bombers quickly. I think the firepower of VHFs should be slightly increased universally... it'd make little difference in VHF versus VHF fights, but would make VHFs better against bombers.

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[5:57:11 PM] InfernalTater (Lewis) [Formerly TLI-Inferno]:meanwhile, Aces 'I don't always miss my destinations, but when I do, I'm on the other side of house space.'

Seriously nerf Junkers.

Shoot to Thrill

[Wes_Janson]

Well a bomber should be able to damage a cruiser SOME (sheilds at least)

But shouldnt be able to take one out (yet to happen to me but still) or even damage it on its own.


Bombers should require NUMBERS to win.

That said caps should also be significantly slower and less agile (in the cases of smaller caps especily)

Should be that the bigger the cap, the slower its agility non-cruise speed is.

I got in a fight with a bomber in a liberty cruiser earlier today, I engline killed, and thrusted away at odd angles, and rotated my ship to face him, and was able to eventualy take him out.

That is WAY too nimble for a cap shop. Especily a cruiser.
Cap ships should all have 2-3 times their current sheild/hull/regen/sheildregenspeed values, to reflect that they ARE capital ships, but also have a drop on handling. Prehaps also give the capital ships defence weapons (since the flak turrets are useless currently), prehaps add class5 turret slots, and allow mounting standard fighter/transport turrets just as a extra defenseve only measure. (or make a new class for those only)

As for the speed tables, heres waht I recomend

Hull type - max speed (non thrust)
Gunboats- 70
destroyer - 65
cruiser - 60
Battlecruiser - 55
Battleship - 45-50

This would add a realistic change in speeds that would better balance things.



As for why I think this way on the SNAC, look back to World War 2 and the naval battles, you NEVER saw 1-2 fighters at a time attacking a ship execpt with kakamazi's. They attacked in swarms, took losses from flak (something lacking in disco) then got out after firing their shots.

In Disco, its get in, fire SNAC, manuver wildly, fire SNAC, repeat. Theres no tactics or NEED for coordinated team atacks, which is why we dont see such tactics much, as people go the easy way rather than RPing it.

If things are re-balanced in such a way as to FORCE good RP, even if it is a tad annoying, there will be more good RP, which is what we are here for in the first place.

[Kambei]

EDit: To Kambei: Sound like you are saing " theres too much caps, make bombers stronger so they can take them out" The BHG matter comming up again, I see.

No I say let it be how it is now:)

btw: example from history:)

in WWII carrier Lexington was destroyed only with 2 light bombs from planes...

in disco-language Battleship was taken down by 2 VHF after 2 hits of minirazor:)

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[Wes_Janson]

The only problem I see is that caps, even when properly guarded (lets say a GB and 2 VHFS), can still be killed by 2 bombers because its quite hard to shoot down bombers quickly. I think the firepower of VHFs should be slightly increased universally... it'd make little difference in VHF versus VHF fights, but would make VHFs better against bombers.

Well I agree there.

And it would also fit in with a general increase to cap stats.

Make fighters more powerful, so that they are a threat to bombers, not the other way around.

Afterall, whats the point of a fighter if bombers can easily take it out despite numbers.

As I said in the post I was writjng when you wrote that, if you balance the stats in such a way as to FORCE cooperation, it will lead to cooperative tactics, which leads to more role play.

[Elvin]

Granted its hard to hit a target thats tiny, try whittling away 250,000 shield points 3 times (bats) and then 240k hull (x2.5 hull if you have brains) a few times (bots). Honestly I have to shoot through 750k of shields and a million and a half of hull to kill a Liberty Cruiser, that is a lot of hits while dodging fire.

Try to recount it, youve made an error.

Lastly, sorry, but any capship above a gunboat is simply a weapons platform, very little maneuvering skill involved, simply aiming. Want to fly a ship where the top pilots can beat the odds considerably (ie killing a few fighters and its gunboat escort?), get in a bomber. Craziest ride you'll ever have.

Well, really dont say theres no skill it makes you look bad.

And it is Crazy ride indeed. But I find the fact that I can take out cruiser alone in my Bomber way too crazy.


EDIT: Im not really aginst anything, I fly LF, VHF, bomber, gunboat, cruiser so Ijust see everything from more angles... I wasnt ever taken out by a bomber alone, altough I have taken out a lot in bomber alone... Its still bad.

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I buy things I don't want to make an impression on people I don't like.

[Kambei]

I can take out cruiser alone in my Bomber way too crazy.

you cant if cruiser use proper equipment + captain know basics about aiming and using guns in battle:)

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