Eh, I'm making an Order character(s) when 4.85 comes... Seeing as I have been against a lot of this stuff from the beginning, and I know a thing or two about Order RP, I'd offer myself if you can't find anyone else.
' Wrote:Remora I don't know what your problem is but in all my time in the Order I worked to bring Bs| and order indies together. That's 2 years, compared to your what? 2 months? I don't think any one will say I didn't do that and the close ties between Bs| and indies are thanks to me so I really think you should reconsider what you said. I have always wanted the input of indies and I always took their considerations and I guarantee you that they will agree with me.
this quote:
"Swissscorch, Do you have no respect for the Independant Order at all?"
Is a personal insult to me and my time here at disco.
Just think you should know that. And maybe you should think next time before you talk.
I apologize Swissscorch, it was badly done. You are correct. There is no excuse for me saying that.
' Wrote:...
Did you not see where I pointed out that two of the seats in our proposal there would be voted in?
My problem, is as always, that people are putting themselves in seats that they really shouldn't have. It is one thing to give the Bs| representation, being an established group, quite another to start "inventing" positions to give people, and take one yourself. This is NOT the way to do things. If the unofficial groups need representation, let the BS| and elected officials make the determination.
ELECTED OFFICIALS, not the independents who have declared themselves the council.
Quote:...
...
I've been an order player for 8 months on this server now. For the first four of them, I was the ONLY order player that could be found online almost 24/7, I was the ONLY order player who actually did anything to defend our territory, and currently I have more posted AND in-game RP than any other member of the order (Note: with the exception of swissscorch), black squadron or independent.
This does not give you the right to dictate to others how their RP should be. Nor does it give you carte blanche to consider youself "THE" representative of the order. I will freely admit that my opinion is noobish, and not very developed. I still feel my RP is greater than yours, regardless of how much "posting" you have done. I believe this based on your actions in "Roleplay." Just as people can call themselves admirals, so too do you have the ability to create a bad story. I COULD tear it up using both your actions and storyline, but I'd prefer if you look into your own story to date and then you'll see where my anger at your RP comes. Just the same, despite my opinion of it being just a mountain of uncoordinated crap, I will stop attacking your RP, since apparently some people feel it is good. As for my RP, I will not post it on the forums. There is no point in doing such an action. If you want to find out about my RP, explore it in game.
Quote:...
No amount of anger directed to me can change the fact that what I am saying isn't just smoke. Independents have a right to determine themselves. I don't care who they are, as long as it is done done right and fairly. I don't believe in giving unofficial a position on the group willy-nilly. This would be true even if I was in an unofficial. Unofficials should prove themselves as the Bs| did before being granted a position. As such, making a system to bring them in should wait until the council is established, and be done by the council.
Regardless, my position is still the same.
No Dictator. No forced leadership. No false representation.
' Wrote:Remora, quit the incessant badgering. Tenacity, cool off.
You're being uselessly difficult, Remora. You've barely been here, and you seem to think your view is king. The council, I must say, looks like it's going very well. If you don't have any shred of respect for Tenacity, good for you. There will be a whole lot of seats here, Tenacity is only one of them, and quite frankly, he's one best suited to the position.
...
I have no problem with Tenacity being ELECTED to the position. I will happily follow him in that aspect. My problem is in him coopting the position. Acting as if it is his by divine right because someone else would have put him in it. I wouldn't vote for him myself, but I would still follow him IF HE WERE ELECTED
That is my issue. I'm not trying to be uselessly difficult, I am just trying to ensure the council is something I can stomach to follow. Without the ability for those who are subjected to it to have the ability to pick who rules them, I can't follow it. Tenacity seems to be in conflict with this single principle every time I turn around, hence why I am butting heads with him. It was Wolfpack before him. It is confrontational, but only in what I see as what really matters.
' Wrote:I apologize Swissscorch, it was badly done. You are correct. There is no excuse for me saying that.
That's alright, happens to everyone.
And Orin, I'm glad to hear you wanna make an Order character lol.
Understudy is an interesting thing, my character Sasha Vorike is an apprentice to Sius Malacos. Like a master and apprentice sorta thing.
edit- as for the council thing, wolfpack has asked me to stay out of it and I will do so. I trust he will talk with the admins and they'll come to a conclusion. I do have my own thoughts about what should be done but I'll remain silent for now.
-Also I'm going on vaca tomorrow for a week and when I come back I'm really curious to see what's been done lol. Anyone wanna send me a pm every day with like a resume of what happened that day regarding the order and the council thing?:)
-Removed due to lack of knowledge and an unwant for 10-20 vision-
Next to that, I'm really not impressed with Tenacity as an Order RP'er. Sorry, no offense, but you're rubbish.
Me: "Lt. Steve, here! What's that Battlestar doing outside the Isis? Oi! Go park somewhere else, its a launching hazard! WHAT?! No! Don't SHOOT right outside Toledo, what if a shot goes astray?! It's unsafe! Don't you have Freeports to be protecting?"
Tenacity: "PM: Hes allowed to b thar, k?"
Me: "It's unsafe! On... So many levels!"
Tenacity: "Ok, well i r teh GARDZ and... ya, so u lissun, k? thnxbai"
And that was the extent of my conversation. With little attempts at RP. I was acting the part of a loyal Order pilot because 80,000 tons of steel and devastating weaponry were being tossed about willy-nilly, and I get, "He's allowed. Go away, I'm better than you as dictated by my story." Only, he didn't talk like an idiot.
It was a very upsetting experience.
I have no problems with the Bs| beyond them trying to dictate all things RP in the Order. It's not right. And its really troubling, given my experiences, that a chair in this 'council' is being given to somebody who chilled inside Omicron-100, trash talking me bordering on ooRP insults (at least the verbal barrage of vocal inanities was so profuse thats what it seemed like) due to a false (I guess 'true' RP wise) sense of superiority in-game.
Again, very troubling and rather annoying too. Some Rook coming in and due to a greater amount of free time spams the forums, writes a lovely little novelette, and bosses around this humble Order vet.
/rant
Thats more than what I wanted to say, but one point led to another. Sorry for the wall.
I guess the Order wont be seeing me around anymore if this goes through. I don't want to be under the bloody-fisted rule of a oligarchal dictatorship.
-Edit- Remora brings up a good point. Perhaps us Order vets and loving members could elect the free seats rather than having them appointed by the founders of the council? I know 'to the victor go the spoils' in the US government, but this is just silly and would spoil quite a bit of fun for others.
Quote:From an Administrative standpoint, the most important issue is who or what might have sufficient authority to enforce rules/laws by instructing Order ships to blow up other Order ships who violate those laws, and who would be empowered to do the shooting.
Even without that ability, a council can have substantial persuasive influence over the evolving role-play and storyline of the faction, so the ability to issue death warrants should not be seen as a make or break power to have.
Now wait a minute, this is not what I was pushing for.
I never said that the council would have power to destroy other order players, or to force rules on anyone, all this time it's been my impression that the council was intended as an RP tool to make decisions when it comes to the order's official RP events and relations with other factions.
Perhaps that isnt what wolf or Bs had in mind, but I dont approve in any way of giving this council the ability to attack other order players based on it's decisions. I think we're just viewing the same thing in two entirely different ways =/
Quote:This does not give you the right to dictate to others how their RP should be
I never have, and never will dictate how someone else should play as long as they're playing for the general good of the server, and not simply pvp whoring.
Quote:Nor does it give you carte blanche to consider youself "THE" representative of the order. I will freely admit that my opinion is noobish, and not very developed. I still feel my RP is greater than yours, regardless of how much "posting" you have done. I believe this based on your actions in "Roleplay." Just as people can call themselves admirals, so too do you have the ability to create a bad story. I COULD tear it up using both your actions and storyline, but I'd prefer if you look into your own story to date and then you'll see where my anger at your RP comes. Just the same, despite my opinion of it being just a mountain of uncoordinated crap, I will stop attacking your RP, since apparently some people feel it is good. As for my RP, I will not post it on the forums. There is no point in doing such an action. If you want to find out about my RP, explore it in game.
You've seen my character in-game TWICE, the first time nothing was going on, and the second I had to deal with both a whining LSF **** and a keeper at the same time WHILE you were moaning about how I was handling the situation, without lending any help yourself.
Are those two encounters alone are what you're basing your decision to attack my character on? If so, it doesnt say much for your own attention to detail here.
Quote:No Dictator. No forced leadership. No false representation.
Aside from the fact that we're not doing ANY of the above, however much you believe it, the situation doesnt change any: if you want to play in a militaristic faction you need to learn to work with, and occasionally under, other players. If you arent willing to do so, you might find playing your characters easier under a less organized faction, perhaps the rogues.
The order, both independents and black squadron, had no problems before players like yourself and THC showed up and started CAUSING those problems. THC, at the very least, has decided to work with us and improve his roleplay to look like less of a pvpwhore, you on the other hand have given nothing to help the situation, and continue posting this bull**** to add more struggle to it.
Quote:Me: "Lt. Steve, here! What's that Battlestar doing outside the Isis? Oi! Go park somewhere else, its a launching hazard! WHAT?! No! Don't SHOOT right outside Toledo, what if a shot goes astray?! It's unsafe! Don't you have Freeports to be protecting?"
Tenacity: "PM: Hes allowed to b thar, k?"
Me: "It's unsafe! On... So many levels!"
Tenacity: "Ok, well i r teh GARDZ and... ya, so u lissun, k? thnxbai"
You show a great deal of maturity, magoo, turning what I say into that garbage. Now, does everyone want to know how that conversation REALLY went?
Me: "Lt. Steve, here! What's that Battlestar doing outside the Isis? Oi! Go park somewhere else, its a launching hazard! WHAT?! No! Don't SHOOT right outside Toledo, what if a shot goes astray?! It's unsafe! Don't you have Freeports to be protecting?"
Tenacity: "PM: Camtheman is here to assist us with the nomads, he's helped us take out intruders into 100 and earned the right to be in the system."
Me: "It's unsafe! On... So many levels!"
Tenacity: "If you wanted safe you wouldnt be flying for the order, look at what we have to deal with on a daily basis."
Quote:It was a very upsetting experience.
So, you get your panties in a wad because there's a player in a battlestar sitting outside toledo blasting nomads, and you use that as a basis to degrade my entire character's RP on this server? Nice, real ****in nice, remind me to butcher your efforts at dealing with people next time I see you in game.
Y'know, I need to fraps the next time I log onto aki so you jaw yapping idiots can actually see what I have to put up with every single ****ing day, its like i'm a goddamn admin with everyone coming to me to solve their problems.
Looks something like this:
New Player: Aki.Kimura
Orderguy#1: "Greetings commander"
Orderguy#2: "KEEPERS IN DELTA!"
Orderguy#3: "A bounty hunter battleship was just in 100"
<Aki Launches from lisbon station>
Corsairguy#1: "HELP! OUTCASTS ATTACKING GAMMA!"
Blacksquadronguy#1: "We need help in delta"
Orderguy#2: "WHERE R U! HELP WITH TEH KEEPERS!"
Libertyguy#1: "Hey, tell those corsairs to stop smuggling artifacts through alaska!"
<cardamine smuggler comes into 100>
Aki.Kimura: "Drop the cargo and leave, I've got too much going on to bother with you today."
Cardamine smuggler: "No U!"
Cardamine smuggler has been killed by Aki.Kimura
Cardamine smuggler: "WTF PVP WHORE!!!"
<Bounty Hunter Battlecruiser comes back into 100>
Bounty hunter BC: "Dai Order!"
Aki.Kimura has been killed by Bounty Hunter BC.
Orderguy#3: "how u dai?"
<Aki gets spammed group invites from a dozen different people>
<Cardamine smuggler starts spamming me with PM's about how he's going to sanction me>
<Aki dies the next three times she tries to undock because the bounty hunter is still in the system>
<Aki finally gets to delta>
Keepers: "***Humans must explode!***
Outcastguy: "Lulz i worship nomads!"
<Aki Kimura dies to outcast guy, who happens to be flying a rogue gunboat with 6 dragonfly missile launchers>
Blacksquadronguy#2: "LSF IN MINOR!"
You get the idea, its pretty much that all day long for as long as i'm on the character.
Now, how many of you have to deal with that eh? It seems like every ****ing time someone has a problem, they spam me about it, I suppose thats the tradeoff for being the person everyone looks up to when black squadron isnt around.
Oh, lets not forget to add remora to the mix:
Remora's order character: "OMFG why'd you go after the LSF instead of the keeper? your RP sucks! I'm telling the high command! you're in big trouble!"
And then having the LSF bitch whine at me for the next half hour in private chat because we killed him when he didnt want to fight.
Welcome to my world.
Quote:-Edit- Remora brings up a good point. Perhaps us Order vets and loving members could elect the free seats rather than having them appointed by the founders of the council? I know 'to the victor go the spoils' in the US government, but this is just silly and would spoil quite a bit of fun for others.
if you'd been paying attention you would have realized that I PROPOSED THAT IN THE FIRST PLACE!
we had two seats on the council available, and I was even -trying- to get people who oppose my personal views (like ryoken) into the council. Now, what kind of power grubbing bitch would I be if I tried to get my enemies onto the council with me, eh?
Quote:This does not give you the right to dictate to others how their RP should be.
Council. Council members. Council decides Order stuff. Only those who want to follow the council are obliged to. If they don't want to, they don't have to.
Quote:Nor does it give you carte blanche to consider youself "THE" representative of the order.
Read your replies, Remora. You're being ridiculous. 6-9 council members, obviously Tenacity is "THE representative of the Order."
(Note the subtle traces of sarcasm.)
And Magoo... Honestly, post when you can do so in a mature manner. I know you have the ability. (Not to mention everything you are assuming is untrue. Sounds like you haven't read anything said for a long time. You might want to do so before throwing out flames and accusations.)
No one reads posts... ALL INDEPENDENT SEATS ARE SELECTED VIA VOTE IN HOWEVER MEANS THEY CHOOSE
So why are we arguing that they're "appointed" by me or someone else? Eh? HUH? WTF? Come on guys..
This is getting out of hand. Remora, Tenacity, Magoo.. I recommend all three of you take a "vacation" from this particular thread and cool your heels please? I have managed to come to an understanding with those who were against me in the first place... I'd like to see you guys do the same, or at least CHILL THE FRAK OUT.
User was banned for: Compromised account
Time left: (Permanent)
Quote:You show a great deal of maturity, magoo, turning what I say into that garbage. Now, does everyone want to know how that conversation REALLY went?
One might say the same to you about your colorful display of vocabulary. Judging by all the asterisks, one might think you a Nomad. Sure the Order is for you? Anyways...
I was paraphrasing. If you'd been here the year and a half I have, you'd know that I do that alot. In case literacy failed you, I also noted, "Only he didn't talk like an idiot".
He may be there to assist, but how many bloody defensive firefights would you imagine being allowed within weapons range of Earth? Or perhaps when a ship is jetisonned, would you imagine the government in charge would allow a small moon to drift in front of the launch zone? I rest my case.
I asked him to move away is all. And if you hadn't been in your lovely cruiser (thanks for ditching that by the way, we have an abundance:dry:) chilling in Omicron-100, I was also dealing with a Xeno tagged Marsflyer, a Zoner tagged, Corsair ID'd Corsair Gunboat which really didn't need to be there, and some guy in an Anubis play firing at me. You aren't the only one in the Order who has to deal with this rubbish, so please don't act like it.
... And an Osiris or two came by for 15 minutes or so, who also refused to get out of weapons range of Toledo.
The fighter wings can handle the Nomad fighters. If people wanna park a battleship near my home, they can feel free as long as their fire can't reach it.
It's all about RP, Tenacity. Not player power.
-Edit- My heels are cooled. Simply making an observation of a council member's activities. And yes, I apologize for my ignorance on the subject, Tenacity/Wolf. I didn't wanna read over the 12 pages which had gone by since I last checked. Or... In any case, alot of posts. Hooray. Voting. You have my support. Just wont vote for a certain member.
-Double Edit- And Orin, its not a matter of maturity. It's a matter of my failing eyesight due to computer screens. I try to limit the amount of staring. So again, sorry for not spending the next forty minutes reading eight paragraph long posts for the last three pages. Like I said, I've done that for forever and its my comic relief of sorts during posts. Relax.
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