Non-Clan Characters - It's not the first time

[Denelo]

I removed this OOC from Rheinland Message Dump, but it's a good topic for discussion

ooc: Excuse me for intruding, and sorry for the ooc, but I believe that Kvasir is a NON-CLAN Rheinland Military character, at least according to the guy who plays him. Non-clan being the key word (or words?) there. I'm sorry, but I do not believe you have the right to limit non-clanned characters from aligning with your clan's NPC faction, and, being RM aligned, a) you would actually be working together and b) he would have the same rights in RH systems as you.

And again, sorry for intruding on your dump, I just thought that that was a bit ridiculous. Moderators, if I should have put this somewhere else, please tell me (and move it?), this was the only place I could think of for it where all of RM could see it.

EDIT: Thanks Nightfall.

[caylith]

As I happened to be there yesterday in New Berlin when Kvasir launched in his Rheinland Battleship, I feel the need to point out a few things.

I told him, as captain of RM, that i'd appreciate it that when in Rheinland do as Rheinland does. A very long argument ensued...and I stayed in character. Reiterating the fact that if he was going to be flying those colors that he should take care as to how he acts. I told him to read our faction status post and our rules. He refused since he said he wasn't RM tagged. So what are we going to do if he blows somebody up? Take the heat for it? Explain he's not one of us? The person who got blown up is gonna be a bit pissed that a Battleship tagged and ID'd Rheinland Military attacked him. It still will have happened in Rheinland and RM will have to answer for it. I just told him to please read the rules and follow them. What's wrong with that?

RM has had problems in the past with the Rheinland tigers (tagged and ID'd npc RM). They would go around policing and telling pilots things contrary to what we said. This proved to be a bit of a headache when we starting hearing people complain about not knowing who to listen to.

Another example is RoyalGuardAuthority, Bretonian tagged and ID'd with a bretonian battleship. Due to his RL friend being told to leave Cambridge (he was a pirate), he attacked the SF in their home system . Threw a wrench into the RP of that one, didn't it?

There is a police tagged char Hessel, he always helps RM and asks what he needs to do. I thank him:)

Another example, the KSP in Kusari...they are not members of the KNF. The KSP still do as the KNF does even though they don't hold the faction tag.

Another example...Corsair tagged players came into Gamma and started attacking the TBH and freelancers. That had to be nipped in the bud quickly. These guys refused to cooperate with an already established faction.

Another example, the 8492, LSF tagged and ID'd, helped the SA and followed their rules.

Another example, a character named Perseus always helps those who are tagged allied with his Lane Hacker tag.

As you can see there have been both good and bad examples of non-faction tagged players (RM, SF, SA, TBH) coming in to help or cause problems. I was just trying to figure out who this guy was and what he was up to. Still haven't really gotten a good answer on that.

Oh, here are the rules of RM in case Kvasir wants to read them here:

Rule #1: RM Authority is LAW.
If a member of the Rheinland Military asks you to stop, you stop.
If they say "Hold for cargo scan and ID verification," hold position and wait for them to say you can go.
If they ask "What is your business in Rheinland?", replying "None 'o yo' bees-wax!" is not appropriate and will probably get you shot. Silence will be taken as hostile.
Just do what the nice man/woman in the Rheinland Ship O' Hurt says, and they won't be forced to open up that can-o'-whup@$$ on you.

Rule #2: If the NPC's think it's illegal, so do we.
That means artifacts, cardamine, Synthetic Marijuana, and any Naval, Police, or Civilian pilots. You can keep the pirates. Please, keep the pirates. Sell 'em where you wish. You're doing good just by shooting the d*mn b*stards.

Rule #3: Piracy will not be tolerated.
If you are a pirate, or even claim to be a pirate, we will shoot you down. Don't joke about that kind of stuff, because we won't know the difference.

Penalties:
For smuggling;
-First offence) 2 million credit fine, you will be asked to drop your cargo, and cargo will be destroyed.
-Second offence) 4 million credit fine, you will be asked to drop your cargo, and cargo will be destroyed.
-Third offence) 8 million credit fine, you will be asked to drop your cargo, and cargo will be destroyed.
-Fourth offence) Shot on sight.
IF YOU DO NOT COMPLY AT ANY STAGE, YOU WILL BE SHOT ON SIGHT AND A BOUNTY WILL BE POSTED FOR THE AMOUNT DUE.

For piracy:
A Zero-Tolerance policy concerning pirates has been enacted. You will be shot on sight.[i]

[fwolf]

If a clan player attack a non-clan player from the same npc faction and carrying the same ID, the player who was attacked can report it to the admins as a non-RP attack. According to the rules, non-RP PvP is not allowed, unless the players have agreed for a training.

[Fellow Hoodlum]

Have to agree there, a bit of courtesy concerning existing well established factions and their roleplay should
be observed. Its titled as a 'Roleplay Server' on the list. Anyone wishing to join in should make their first move,
a good look at the forums and the ongoing stories.
Just appearing, and expecting everyone else to follow your lead is a bit selfish. Roleplay should be a totally
interactive experience. Let us all consider this before just going off with an excuse to buy a battleship.
F-Wolf is actually a good example of how to do it right. He has a character who interacts perfectly with existing
factions. Won't mention the name as I'm not sure if everyone knows who it is. A true Freelancer.

Hoodlum

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Some say he is a proud member of: "The most paranoid group of people in the Community."

[fwolf]

Speaking of Perseus, Im having some problems to correct the tag.

The ship joined the outcasts some two weeks ago, and did a lot of missions from Malta, killing bounty hunters. So now it got a liberty rogues tag. I already did two or three trips to allied bases aborting missions to try to correct it, but with no success. In the last one I visited the Bundschuh base.

Seems the liberty rogues hates more the BHG than the outcasts do, so why there are only missions against the BHG in Malta? Can someone give me some information about what I can do to correct it?

[Korrd]

Well, if he has a RH BS, with RH tag and RH ID, he should act as a Rheinlander, not as a freelancer..

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(Really, I speak terrible English, so please, tell me if I make mistakes. I'd like to improve it a bit )

[Dab]

Basically the RM can't do anything about him.. Yet.

However, if he suddenly started attacking people for no reason, personal things, or out of RP things, RM could declare him a traitor to Rheinland, now excommunicated, and available to be destroyed by other lawfuls. Such would be RP-correct in response to his unlawful attacks, and RM couldn't be penalized for it. They would be doing a lawful action, the other would be doing unlawful actions. The act of doing anything unlawful classifies one as unlawful and able to be destroyed by a lawful, regardless of the NPC faction he claims membership to.

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[Malaclypse 666]

This also harks back to the altercation I had w/ TT some time ago.

His KNF-tagged vessel was acting within RP, conducting raids into Bretonian space. At the time, thanks to "off the record" negotiations, our Faction had an understanding (correct me if wrong, Madam deLuna or Adm. Firebird); that SF/KNF engagements would be limited to the Taus. Now, as this was not written anywhere on the boards or in Faction status; it was unreasonable of me to expect Tank's character to have knowledge of said "understanding". (Also, things may have changed yet again.. need that bloody deuterium...)

I suppose the moral of the story is that communication between similarly aligned players is always a good idea. We value our "pseudo members", the KSP, KTA, even our two KND brothers. If there's ever a question as to how to proceed in a given situation, hopefully a consensus can be reached through comms before misunderstandings occur.

The Fool
(more often than I'd like.)

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[Nadir]

Well put. If someone doesn't cooperate give them enough rope to hang themselves.

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ex

[TankTarget]

Well also Mal, the one thing that was never brought up into discussion was. I was never going to attack the SF for two reasons. 1( I had no and will get no infernos or battlerazors as it is my attempt to mimic NPC KNF. 2( I was not in the mood to fight in a large engagement and don't to fight my own private crusade.

However the whole point of this is...there should always be the individual's right to RP no matter what. Factions/clans are secondary because Freelancer is Freelancer not Freeclanlancer. The individual person is the main focus for the RP not the clan. Whilist being a clan leader I understand that clans have certains rights and I can order anyone I want out of Vespucci...the individual RPing as a Lane Hacker has a right to enter Vespucci but not a right to preen around with an HF tag while not being a part of the clan. See? I can RP with my KND aslong as I do not say I represent [KNF]. Because frankly I don't.

Now I oppose that there is no war between [KNF] [SF] because it's about bloody time that two lawful factions duked it out instead of me the lone pirate and all the other pirates attacking them. But that is my opinion. And I cannot change [KNF]'s stance on my own will because I would be infringing on their rights to RP as a clan.

And I could attack the SF as my KND but I won't...(maybe a fighter) I want everyone to RP. And when people don't I get mad. So, let people RP however they want within reason and let clans RP...easy